CROOKED RECRUITING COMPANIES

I have to agree with this statement. I am being offered contracts ( and many times by someone who cannot speak proper english ) at a greatly reduced rate which most times does not make the contract feasible. I especially like when you respond to an e-mail inquiry with a question and that question goes completely ignored. Contracting has become a joke at this time and i have decided to seek full time employment because of it.

ditto. I actually reported Spherion to a Baltimore institution as they we doing unethical practices. They were circumventing the hiring process for the state of Maryland. Haven't heard from them again! I don't waste my time with any of the others as I have submitted multiple resumes to all of them with no response.

Interesting observations, people. I just wrote all of these agencies off as not able to help me. Four or five of the names above have contacted me also. After they get my resume, I don't hear from them any more. I thought that it was because they were unable to place me. And, you are right, those whom I spoke to was unable to communicate in English very well. Wow, I did not know that they were just prowlers.

David Banner said: That is totally false I have had nothing but positive things to say about kforce because of them my career is back on track, just because you did not have the skills to get the job they presented to you don't bash these companies

Ajilon is not bad, but I have to agree that the others can be very hard to deal with.
I have been "working" for TEK systems for over a year now, and they have yet to find me an actual contract.
My "senior recruiter" contacts me with the same job over and over again, even though I have told her I am nt willing to work there.
It also depends alot on what area of the country you are willing to work in and nothing to do with your skill set, there seems to be a lot of work in Fla.
I would have to agree with others that hvae posted that this new breed of head hunter seems only to want to keep you in their portfolio of sales prospects 90% of the time.
We IT professionals have all worked hard to get where we are and that can be very frustrating, especially when it involves wasting vacation days for bogus interviews.

Deb Rochester NY said:
Ajilon is not bad, but I have to agree that the others can be very hard to deal with.
I have been "working" for TEK systems for over a year now, and they have yet to find me an actual contract.
My "senior recruiter" contacts me with the same job over and over again, even though I have told her I am nt willing to work there.
It also depends alot on what area of the country you are willing to work in and nothing to do with your skill set, there seems to be a lot of work in Fla.
I would have to agree with others that hvae posted that this new breed of head hunter seems only to want to keep you in their portfolio of sales prospects 90% of the time.
We IT professionals have all worked hard to get where we are and that can be very frustrating, especially when it involves wasting vacation days for bogus interviews.

you are soooo! right about the IT professional working hard to getwere we are, and the pay they are wanting you to accept...

You have to be kidding me. IT Professionals work sooooo hard? You are overhead with the exception of those who are actually developing a software product to acutally go to market with which will make your company money. You have very short memories of 2000-2003 when you were begging for work and blaming the Staffing and Consulting firms for not getting you work when you were overpaid due to Y2K. WAY OVERPAID!

These people from these firms work far more hours and with far more stress than you can imagine. The most stressfull part of many of your days is weather Lumburg is going to run off with your stapler or if the Teksystems, Technisource, Modis, KForce guy brought bagels for your team on Friday morning. The Account Managers and Recruiters are out there working for you and their customer to deliver the talent that their customer wants. Sometimes they win, sometimes they lose and YES there are a lot of turds in that industry but the companies themselves are striving to provide a good and needed service. They are in the one industry that has a product to sell, BUT the product can tell them and the customer NO I dont want to be sold to this client. Name one business that has to deal with that kind of stress and people problems and name one with more competitors.

IT people work sooooo hard. Please dude, ditch diggers, construction workers, military personnel, janitors, teachers and retail professionals all work far harder than you with WAAAYYYY less pay.

My guess is that this topic was started by an IT Professional who did a poor job on his/her last 8 jobs in the past 2 years and they are looking for someone else to blame other than themselves for not performing.

I do find it annoying that even recruiting has gone offshore. I will not return calls of individuals I cannot understand. I also note that because the pay in the offshore country is so cheap, they expect the same pay or cheaper than standard rates to be appealing here!

I was appalled by an opportunity that was presented to me in the last 30 days. As described:

1099 rate - $35 all inclusive
required travel at my expense to Denver, CO (I am based in TX)
Technical Writer with 5 to 7 years experience with BA skills needed

1. This really is a Business Analyst job when I discussed it with the gentleman I spoke with. I market myself across both to bring me the most opportunities. There was much more requirements and engineering as-is and to-be processes involved and not as much 'cut and dry' documentation.

2. By the time I take expenses and taxes out, this is the equivalent of working for $5/hr. That is just crap.

3. While I am hunting, the rate specified is a W-2 rate for just a plain-jane technical writer in my home market and expenses still allowed.

I would like to know what these people are smoking when they even present this to prospective workers...

However, having recently finished a job where some offshore interaction occurred - in India, SQL programmers make $150/wk contract and that is considered 'good pay.' A senior level programmer as an employee makes $20 - 25K per year and their benefits are quite generous. This is distorting the market terribly.

What is equally difficult to understand is why companies continue to do this when it is almost a 1:1 ratio of onshore personnel required to manage the offshore resources. I do not see the cost savings/benefits to this from my experience with several firms.

Business model for this company has far too much overhead hence pushing lower salaries to individuals with inferior benefits. What I mean by that is they have many, many, many recruiters, administrators, account mgrs out the ying-yang and they have to pay for these people.

I believe operationally this company needs to capture 35-40% of the rate just to pay for it's operations, this in turn leads to lower hourlies or salaries to it's individuals who ultimately become disgruntled and find better rates quickly at other places. They are a churning shop hoping to grab a quick 6 mos contract that ends and move on to the next one w/o creating a financially rewarding model to the consultant which ultimately puts the golden handcuffs on them such that they can't leave.

Look at it this way... if Tek asks $80/hr for somebody, lets say a Sr Developer and ends up paying $43/hr W-2 with crummy benefits Tek is making about 35-40% of rate on this person. Now they can't possibly sustain this person because the greedy Sr Developer consultant knows they can make 80-85K w/Full Blown Benefits at most places internally and maintain much better job security. The $43/hr they were making w/Crappy benefits ..... is.... $86K a year and they have zero stability. That is why premiums need to be paid for short-termers. In this scenrio the consultant should be at $55/hr or even $57/hr and they will stay longer.... but that cuts in to the ability to pay all of those operational costs explained above... hence it's a cycle. The answer is fewer people at the operational level working for this company, higher salaries to consultants w/above avg benefits, keep the golden handcuffs on everybody, retain them ... thus supplying long term consultants to your clients making them happier and getting more clients w/more projects and it is a win/win for everyone. It's finding the balance that is the key.

Agreer said: I have to agree with this statement. I am being offered contracts ( and many times by someone who cannot speak proper english ) at a greatly reduced rate which most times does not make the contract feasible. I especially like when you respond to an e-mail inquiry with a question and that question goes completely ignored. Contracting has become a joke at this time and i have decided to seek full time employment because of it.

I agree...How do these people that can't
speak English get a hold of my resume. How do I get them to stop calling me with non-existent jobs? Contract companies are a joke.

I have been rushed to interviews with 4 of the above mentioned recruiters who claim to have a position for me, but when I get to the office for the meeting, they claim...ooops that job is gone. Well they have a warm body in the chair now. The worst part is my past supervisors have been bothered by numerous recruiters asking for references. The recruiters get the great references, then they claim they dont have any positions right now. So far the recuiters Ive dealt with are not professional or efficient.

Dr. James Edison Dolenz Ph.D. said: DO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH ANY OF THE FOLLOWING
Robert Half Technology
TEK Systems
Alegis Group
KForce
Manpower Professional
Modis
Omni Resources
Spherion
Technisource
Unicon Internation
Ajilon
Judge Group
Right now, every Tom, Dick, Harry, Rachael, Sue, Julie, Sarat, and Amir on planet Earth is trying to make a fast buck by being a temporary employer of some kind, yet the only real difference between each and every one of you is the amount of sales puff you can blow up an employer’s behind with the standard ‘WE ARE THE BEST” sales hype or the amount of payola that is paid to an employer to get a signed contract. Most of you lie, cheat, and steal on a regular basis to achieve your sales goals and maximize your cut of your secret billable rate. You also scour the resumes you receive for applicant placement and the help-wanted ads placed by employers to find new prey. Using resumes for marketing and sales is pretexting, which is getting private information about an individual under false pretenses, is wrong.

What can you tell us about TEK? Anything specific?

Dr. Rosen said: You have to be kidding me. IT Professionals work sooooo hard? You are overhead with the exception of those who are actually developing a software product to acutally go to market with which will make your company money.
These people from these firms work far more hours and with far more stress than you can imagine. The most stressfull part of many of your days is weather Lumburg is going to run off with your stapler or if the Teksystems, Technisource, Modis, KForce guy brought bagels for your team on Friday morning. The Account Managers and Recruiters are out there working for you and their customer to deliver the talent that their customer wants. Sometimes they win, sometimes they lose and YES there are a lot of turds in that industry but the companies themselves are striving to provide a good and needed service. They are in the one industry that has a product to sell, BUT the product can tell them and the customer NO I dont want to be sold to this client. Name one business that has to deal with that kind of stress and people problems and name one with more competitors.
IT people work sooooo hard. Please dude, ditch diggers, construction workers, military personnel, janitors, teachers and retail professionals all work far harder than you with WAAAYYYY less pay.

For being a Doctor you sure are stupid...and you can't spell either :)
acutally is actually
stressfull is stressful
dont is don't

I'd like you to come and work with me on a few projects and we'll see if you reconsider what stress actually is...you think IT folks work HARD period. 55-65 hour weeks, crappy pay in many instances. I was in the military for 6 years and I didn't even come close to working this hard. There's some perspective for you because you don't have any.

There is obviously a vast disconnect between those that actually worked in IT (and made an HONEST living doing so) and those that know little about the industry short of working with some very unprofessional IT people (such garbage exists in all fields). I can offer this: Y2K was one of the few things that were hyped to push strong-arm sales but IT is hardly alone in the dishonesty and under-handed tactics people use to make the sale.

The reality is that technology drives business today. IT people are necessary. This notion that IT is merely a cost center, unless you develop software, is as ignorant as it gets. IT is an asset which means it creates value in many different ways, even if it is not by way of direct revenue stream generation. Maximized business uptime (fault tolerance, backup systems, colocation, etc.) and fast response to emergency situations (standards development contingency planning, system hardening, etc.) are all HUGE for any serious business.

The problem is that businesses cut corners on things that do not have direct paths to revenue generation. They pirate software, send important jobs overseas, and rehash what others have done instead of developing their own, custom-fit solutions. I can sympathize with both sides of the story because I have managed IT people and I have been the IT professional myself. Both business owners and IT professionals have been burned but that doesn't dismiss the very real value that exists in effective leveraging of technology.

I hear complaints from folks in other fields, fields that have nothing to do with technology, stating that recruiters and so-called talent scouts are not as useful as they were only a decade ago. Surely, there are many candidates that lie but let's not go tit-for-tat on this. Surely, there are more under-paid professions. We're talking about IT here and the relative "depreciation" in the field. Let's not go off on other tangents, Doctor. 8)

Derrick Devine said:
For being a Doctor you sure are stupid...and you can't spell either :)
acutally is actually
stressfull is stressful
dont is don't
I'd like you to come and work with me on a few projects and we'll see if you reconsider what stress actually is...you think IT folks work HARD period. 55-65 hour weeks, crappy pay in many instances. I was in the military for 6 years and I didn't even come close to working this hard. There's some perspective for you because you don't have any.

I just wanted to second what Derrick said. Quite on-point. In fact, the attitude this "Doctor" exhibits is a good reason why IT people are treated as outsiders and, sometimes, as slaves. I remember putting in 48-hour shifts in one job (no lie) and then being expected to come into work the next day at my regularly-scheduled time. Mind you, I lived 2-3 hours away and, after my commute, would only get about 1 hour of sleep and about 30 minutes to shower, get dressed, and had back out. Is that fair? If you say yes, I have to question how valuable your college education really is.

This has become such a hot topic that I've explored other areas on my LinkedIn account and personal blog...

yogizilla.wordpress.com

I agree that all recruiting firms are out for is the quickest commission. They don't care who gets the job as long as they get paid. I had one employer tell me to my face that he did not trust the recruiting firm "as far as I can throw them". Yet, he was working with them to find employees. What hypocrisy.

It's true.

I have recruiters admitting themselves that they are merely sales people, not HR professionals. They don't want to deal with the complicated parts of the hiring process but then that leaves the question: who WILL? Companies have a love-hate relationship with recruiters. They realize that they do not get their money's worth a lot of the time but what they always get is a scapegoat, someone to be accountable and responsible for the hiring process.

Check out the discussion by checking out my LI profile and viewing my Q&A section. LinkedIn consists of quite a lot of recruiters so it's no surprise that there are some very defensive arguments being post here...

www.linkedin.com/in/yogizilla

I am not ragging on all recruiters. I know a few that really do their job and go beyond their call to duty. It *DOES* have a lot to do with the company because those that treat their operations like a simple call center will only look at the sales numers. New recruiters get sucked into the industry and get overwhelmed. Their primary concern is on making dials, getting candidates to the interview, keeping candidates on the jobs, identifying the most jobs, and beating out the competition so that their company can reap the benefits. The particularly competitive ones look at it like this: "How many people can I cheat out of a good salary until I get that 65-inch plasma TV in my bedroom?"

I remember the last time I really worked closely with a recruiter. After doing some research, I found out that the recruiter shaved $20,000+ off of my salary. Soon after, he bought a new house and had a big-screen TV. Coincidence? No. This was the same guy that told me "I know where you are in your career and you shouldn't try to ask for more money yet." Had I listened to him, I would not have gone on to make a six-figure income.

Again, not all recruiters are bad people but many of them out there make us dislike them all even more...

I agree that all recruiters are not created equal however I do have to give kudos to the Westminster office- I have had nothing but positive conversations/interviews with my recruiter. She has listened to my concerns, answered my questions, upheld my position and really aided in my job search. I actually start a full time position with a company in the upcoming week and cannot wait to start on the next chapter of my career. Please do not discount a company or a recruiter because of one poor experience. Ask more questions before passing judgement. Also if you do not want to share personal information be honest with your recruiter- most will drop the subject. With regards to references specifically ask that they not be contacted until a position has been identified. Most will respect your position and the integrity of your references. I have found TEK to actually be the most competent agency out there and I have worked with them all. Call my recruiter- she is truly an individual. Christie 303-412-2709. Good luck in your career search!

KSeadruh, it seems that you have been very fortunate but, seeing where you are from, that can explain a lot. I have seen very few satisfied people in huge metropolitan areas. New York City is definitely one of those places where recruiters are a dime a dozen. Surely, you find good ones but that is the exception, not the rule.

My personal experiences and that of my clients have been the same, for the most part. The recruiters don't listen well and mostly bombard you with questions, demands, and things they use to instill fear in you (supposedly "creating urgency" and "realistic expectations"). I've known many recruiters that tell their candidates "I know where your career is at and what you're really worth" after only knowing the person for a week. Is that professional? Hardly.

I think most people here are judging their opinions based on several experiences, I know I am. Some folks are definitely giving us knee-jerk, emotionally-charged reactions. It happens.

You mention that most recruiters will drop the subject. I have yet to see this be a trend. If they DO drop the subject, they usually make crazy conclusions and essentially give up on the candidate. Usually, their expectations are unrealistic and they give the candidates little in return.

For example, in the prime of my IT career, I remember when the minimum hourly rate for consultants was $30-50 an hour and that was on the low end. These days, the same work includes a lot more responsibilities and cross-concentrations, for much less pay. Recruiters expect you to be excited about $22 an hour. In New York City, that is NOT liveable income. I've paid rents as high as $3000/month. Do the math. ;)

TEK has been okay for me in the past. Not great, but better than most. They're a division of Aerotek, I believe, which has a good reputation.

In regards to high expectations, one of the trends I see, especially in IT, is that there are many recruiters looking for very specific, unusual skill mixes. They want someone that will be a desktop technician, shell scripter, web designer, assembly writer, and Broadway singer. Then they want that same person to have experience in specific industries such as "a hospital with over 2000 employees." You may be a close match and be the person that they need but, since you do not match the "letter of the words", they will move on.

The sad part is that these types of industry-specific, cross-concentration roles are rare to come across. How can people get the exposure if there is no entry possibility? Most of the time, they can easily convert to temp-to-hire or entry-level positions but, instead, they look for this magical person that will do ten jobs for the price of one, or half of one. You saw the doctor a few posts earlier: IT people are very under-appreciated. Most people still regard us as the ubiquitous "computer people", which is why I am focusing on my writing, teaching/training, and marketing work - people see the value in those more established fields, unfortunately.

Again, some people get lucky but working with recruiters still remains a hit-or-miss. I agree: ask lots of questions and remember that you are not required to share personal information. Even when a solid job is identified, there is only so much you need to divulge to enable a recruiter to submit you for a job. Typically, I see recruiters doing pre-emptive work, just to build up their Rolodex and get more leads. This is why giving references and such can be bad. I remember several past employers always telling me "tell them I'm at a meeting, I don't want to talk to those pesky sales people."

Recruiters today are more concerned with sales numbers than helping people. This is the trend me and many others see. When you find the GOOD recruiters, hold on tight and develop trust!

A friend of mine had no trouble finding a job through Manpower Professional. The onl thing is,his job has NOTHING to do with his degree. He is a computer engineer,but they have him doing surface mount for half he's worth.

Deb Rochester NY said:
Ajilon is not bad, but I have to agree that the others can be very hard to deal with.
I have been "working" for TEK systems for over a year now, and they have yet to find me an actual contract.
My "senior recruiter" contacts me with the same job over and over again, even though I have told her I am nt willing to work there.
It also depends alot on what area of the country you are willing to work in and nothing to do with your skill set, there seems to be a lot of work in Fla.
I would have to agree with others that hvae posted that this new breed of head hunter seems only to want to keep you in their portfolio of sales prospects 90% of the time.
We IT professionals have all worked hard to get where we are and that can be very frustrating, especially when it involves wasting vacation days for bogus interviews.

It's not up to the recruiters to FIND YOU A CONTRACT. Recruiters assist in the job search. It's amazing that people like to bash recruiting agencies, but the moment they ASSIST with an actual contract, temp-perm, or perm job -- everything is fine and dandy.

If you all hate recruiters, DON'T USE THEM!

I love the passion of the arguments.

Being a veteran of the agency side of the business and an ex-TEKsystems employee, I thought you'd all enjoy some perspective from the other side...

Is it a sales business? In short: YES, ABSOUTELY.
The bottom line is if you are an agency recruiter and you can't put people to work you get FIRED, the reality is that the 2 yr. attrition rate in the staffing industry pushes 90%, few industries are worse. This drives some, who for whatever reason which doesn’t matter or justify the action, to say and do things that would lead many to question the individual’s integrity. Just like any line of business you have some bad, some good and actually I will suggest it’s probably a standard distribution of firms from bad to great.

SO, what matters to you all? What does a great recruiter look like?
The odds are it will be a smaller local private firm, where you will find industry vets, 10+ years, they know the local market, will have very professional recruiters that will under promise and over deliver. The problem with the larger firms is that they have one or two of these vets in with 20+ Jr. recruiters, so 95% of the time you are actually talking to someone with at most 1 or 2 years of experience. Will they ask you for referrals or sales leads, probably… anyone who is actually really good does, but the point is if they have gained your trust and respect, then you know they will make you look good to your friends and collogues.

If you can find a recruiter that’s been around 5 yrs + and with the same firm, then its an anomaly… keep track of THEM and don’t forget it’s a two way street, if you make the effort to get to know the recruiter and stay in touch, you will be the first call when a career opportunity for you hits their desk.

Best of luck to everyone, hope this helps frame why it’s so hard to find a quality recruiter.

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE.....
Add Insight Global, Inc to the list of consultant companies that will waste your time and have you running in circles. Here is their website, www.insightglobal.net.

Marcy said:
It's not up to the recruiters to FIND YOU A CONTRACT. Recruiters assist in the job search. It's amazing that people like to bash recruiting agencies, but the moment they ASSIST with an actual contract, temp-perm, or perm job -- everything is fine and dandy.
If you all hate recruiters, DON'T USE THEM!

Who said I hated recruiters?
I am not bashing anyone, just telling the truth about TEK systems here in Rochester and my "senior" recruiter.
Do you work for TEK systems?

Marcy said:
It's not up to the recruiters to FIND YOU A CONTRACT. Recruiters assist in the job search. It's amazing that people like to bash recruiting agencies, but the moment they ASSIST with an actual contract, temp-perm, or perm job -- everything is fine and dandy.
If you all hate recruiters, DON'T USE THEM!

We as IT professionals also hardly have any choice, but to work with these people(recruiting firms), who half of the time BTY don't even know what the technical requirments for the job are or the difference between programming languages.
It makes it hard to sell something if you do not know what the product is or what the customer needs.
Where have all the real "head hunters" gone, who actually knew something about IT?

Dr. Rosen said: You have to be kidding me. IT Professionals work sooooo hard?
What an odd reply.....
I cannot speak for all IT professionals, But I know I work hard.
Last time I looked Ditch diggers and janitors did not need degrees. They also did not need to keep up on the latest ditch digging or floor polishing techniques.
What are you a doctor of, if I might ask?

TEK called me yesterday about a job in Illinois. When I asked about per diem, I was told they would pay $5/hour per diem. When I suggested their perdiem was their problem, the recruiter got bent out of shape. So much for this worthless company.

I'm afraid most people have a terrible opinion of recruiters, much like used-car salespeople. I'm a technical recruiter now, but have 20 years prior experience in sales & marketing management in high technology, software development industry. Specific industry, technology recruiters like me are out there! But, it's difficult to get employers to allow us to show them how we are very unique from the masses, because of past poor experiences. However, once we get the chance, however, it becomes obvious the differences and advantages to them. We know the technology, specific roles and their unique requirements and can do a better job prescreening to determine if the candidate will be successful in that job. And, we become a huge support to the corporate recruiters to find the right candidate, faster than ever with our own internal network of technology people.

Some one who worked at CZN. said:
We as IT professionals also hardly have any choice, but to work with these people(recruiting firms), who half of the time BTY don't even know what the technical requirments for the job are or the difference between programming languages.
It makes it hard to sell something if you do not know what the product is or what the customer needs.
Where have all the real "head hunters" gone, who actually knew something about IT?

EVERYONE has a choice. This is not a 3rd world country. The fact is it is better to seek out/speak to/form a relationship with a recruiter who could possibly, again, ASSIST you -- rather than try and submit your resume online to a company like Paychex that just received 400 resumes for one position. If a recruiter has not come through for you, than stay on unemployment yapping away about "these people" on message boards, or get off your bum and actually look for a job yourself.

And to the other people out there, it is up to the client to want to interview you or extend a job offer -- just like any other position out there. The recruiters have no influence (in the end) on the clients decision.

It's just so ironic how peoples opinions change the moment they actually get a job -- through a staffing firm.

First of all;
I am currently working and not just yapping away and sitting around on unemployment.
Second;
I have gotten every job I have ever wanted and obtained an interview for. (3 good ones through staffing firms, not TEK systems.)

My complaint with the Rochester area TEK systems office is that they "collect" your resume for their portfolio.
Let's be honest, when you are contacted by the same recruiter about the same job over and over again, that never seems to materialize into an interview,and further, when another recruiting firm gets you an interview with that same client you see a recruiting firm for what it is; inefficient.

Believe me when I say that I am not sitting around waiting for TEK systems to "find" me my next contract. The point of all of my posts have been that it is my choice not to deal with TEK systems.
I also do not like the fact that they do have my resume and present it to their "clients" without my permission. I want a good "salesman" (and that is all that they are) working on getting me the face to face interview, not someone that does not know the first thing about IT or my qualifications.
When they forward my resume to a perspective employer without my knowledge and I apply for the same opportunity by myself or through another recruiter(and they ask if you have given your resume to other firms).That employer may already have a first impression of me and my qualifications.
One that I have no idea may even exist.
I have a strong feeling you may work for TEK systems. YOU may be serious about what you do, but the majority of people who work in the Rochester/Pittsford office in my experience are not.
My advice to you : Direct your energy into making changes at the office you work for,instead of defending your companies bad performance on message boards meant for people who have had legitimate and negative experiences with them.

Excellent post, and very true.

I was/am a software developer that "jumped" over to the dark side. After my layoff the market was a little tight and I looked into recruiting...seemed like a way for me to keep my fingers in the pie and stay abreast of technologies. I've been recruiting for 3 years now but am transitioning back into the hands-on world by joining a consulting firm. I wanted to give a brief background before delving into the fray. I'm not fond of recruiting but hey...gotta pay the bills right?

I will agree that there are many shady people in the recruiting industry...some are openly shady while others are of the sneaky variety. You won't see them coming until after the paperwork is signed and you've accepted the position. I've been successful in recruiting because I tell people my background right up front so they know they're dealing with someone who understands that C# is NOT pronounced C-pound and Java is NOT just a cup'o'joe. There are people in my office with more experience in recruiting than me, however, I've been the "go-to" guy when it comes to questions on technology.

I've been pushed, poked and prodded to say things to candidates that I didn't feel comfortable saying. I just wouldn't do it. I'm sure I missed out on placements because of it but my integrity means more to me than that. I've befriended most of my candidates and when they're close to finishing a project (on their own or through me) they usually check in with me. If I have a position for them...great. If not, they put feelers out on their own.

There are a lot of shady people in the recruiting industry and at the end of the day these companies only care about one thing...how many placements you have. Most don't care how it's done...just do it. You're pushed to make x amount of calls, submit x amount of resumes and if you don't make the numbers...you're out.

I'm getting out while I still have my sanity and integrity intact.

Yogizillain New York, New York said: In regards to high expectations, one of the trends I see, especially in IT, is that there are many recruiters looking for very specific, unusual skill mixes. They want someone that will be a desktop technician, shell scripter, web designer, assembly writer, and Broadway singer. Then they want that same person to have experience in specific industries such as "a hospital with over 2000 employees." You may be a close match and be the person that they need but, since you do not match the "letter of the words", they will move on.

Yogi: I had a good laugh at this comment because Ive been trying for 4 months to figure out why I dont get responses to applications for which I have the identical experience. I totally agree with you as funny as it may be...its sad that HR people are screening resumes for 99% match of keywords rather than using insight and experience to screen. The Broadway singer who has been in IT for exactly 5 years with sales experience and a BA is typical of the mindset of some of the recruiters and hiring managers.

Susan in Littleton, Colorado said: I agree...How do these people that can't
speak English get a hold of my resume. How do I get them to stop calling me with non-existent jobs? Contract companies are a joke.

If you don't want called on your resume, then don't post on job boards! Even if you posted it 5 years ago, you can still be contacted. I have been in the IT industry for over 14 years, first as a Recruiter, then an Acct. Rep, now a Director. Many things that all of you are saying is valid, but some is not. In addition many points are being missed.

I too have seen this industry re-invent itself to where ethical, caring, career minded IT consulting firms have evolved into just plain "body shops". Many of the ones that were listed above would fall into that category. In the old days, you had consultants that stayed with a firm, had annual pay raises, free training, award recognition, paid bench, etc. However, today, at least in the staffing side of the business, recruiting has become nothing more than going out to job boards and subcontracting non-US consultants from non-US owned firms. That is not recruiting. Where are the relationships and pipeline?

As for offshore, lets not forget who is to blame. How many American companies went oversees and BUILT IT Training centers? FORD, GM, JP MORGAN? How many fortune 500 firms invested in Universities oversees? If you want to be mad at offshore, maybe you should be mad at your own employer. Or how about being upset with some of our American IT talent that refused to migrate off of there mainframe skills to client server or web or even ERP, because they were to bullheaded? Many of your criticisms of consulting firms are well founded but not complete. We are a re-active industry, many times not proactive. We try to work with companies based on what THEY ask for. Granted, we do sell offshore wneh needed, but it is to stay competitive within our industry and if we don't offer it, someone else will.

Cant complain about Tek- recruit to placement was under a month. Account manager and recruiter keep in touch and return calls and emails. No problem with pay or payroll.

I challenge any one of you to try Robert Half Technology. Totally different set up. If you dont understand the business behind contract agencies dont knock. I agree some are not on the up and up. But one comapny does not reach the billion dollar mark just because we work with every Tom Dick and Harry. Most times major companies use contract house's to weed out the weak!!

Dr. James Edison Dolenz Ph.D. said: DO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH ANY OF THE FOLLOWING

Robert Half Technology
TEK Systems
Alegis Group
KForce
Manpower Professional
Modis
Omni Resources
Spherion
Technisource
Unicon Internation
Ajilon
Judge Group

Right now, every Tom, Dick, Harry, Rachael, Sue, Julie, Sarat, and Amir on planet Earth is trying to make a fast buck by being a temporary employer of some kind, yet the only real difference between each and every one of you is the amount of sales puff you can blow up an employer’s behind with the standard ‘WE ARE THE BEST” sales hype or the amount of payola that is paid to an employer to get a signed contract. Most of you lie, cheat, and steal on a regular basis to achieve your sales goals and maximize your cut of your secret billable rate. You also scour the resumes you receive for applicant placement and the help-wanted ads placed by employers to find new prey. Using resumes for marketing and sales is pretexting, which is getting private information about an individual under false pretenses, is wrong.

I have been reading on this forum about the many and versatile perspectives about recruiter/placement agencies. Unfortunately, I am looking for work and have signed up with about 17 (my list) of them in the Houston area alone. I have signed up with even more that are physically in some other place in the country. To date, I have not been successful with getting very far with any of them. They seem to rush me into getting my information to them, visiting their offices to formally register with them, and then, they disappear. Yes, disappear. When I do follow ups, they are unable to either remember me or be able to fine my file. I have followed up with some on several occasions, and they finally tell me that the position that I went through a three or four hour exercise to apply for has been filled. Now, this is after I have called several times just to follow up on the position. The case manager finally calls the client to see if the position is still open. Most of the time, the case manager will tell me that the position is filled, again, after I call to follow up. I have never gotten a call back from one of these agencies. I have, though, spoken to recruiters that are employees of a large company and gotten feedback from them. They seem to be in tuned and are knowledgeable about what is going on. But, the agencies that you all have been talking about are not job seeker friendly. Sure, many job seekers are successful using these agencies. The agencies would not be so successful if they were not getting people work. However, the industry has gotten so cut throat that it is difficult to find an agency that has good intentions for the job seeker. It is in fact all about the money. Job seekers are a commodity, and if they don’t get placed right away, their placement priority will be pushed farther and farther to the back of the line. I see it; I hear about it, I experience it.

Have you tried Modis IT, I have worked with them when I was looking for a job in Texas.
Try..
Angela.Moreno@ModisIT.com

Robert Half advertises positions that do not exist. They even have a particular code for those non-existent positions. They "phish" for resumes to pad their database. If you call them about a non-existent positions, they will describe the position and tell you it is "one of their biggest clients". Ask them for the name of the company. If they refuse to give it, then it does not exist. Reputable companies will name the company up front.

How are entry-level IT people supposed to get into companies then if not going through recruiters? It's become virtually impossible to get into decent companies without going through some kind of contract company. Shady they may be, but it pays the rent and keeps me from having to move back in with my parents at the age of 31.

Dr. James Edison Dolenz Ph.D. said: DO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME WITH ANY OF THE FOLLOWING

Robert Half Technology
TEK Systems
Alegis Group
KForce
Manpower Professional
Modis
Omni Resources
Spherion
Technisource
Unicon Internation
Ajilon
Judge Group

Right now, every Tom, Dick, Harry, Rachael, Sue, Julie, Sarat, and Amir on planet Earth is trying to make a fast buck by being a temporary employer of some kind, yet the only real difference between each and every one of you is the amount of sales puff you can blow up an employer’s behind with the standard ‘WE ARE THE BEST” sales hype or the amount of payola that is paid to an employer to get a signed contract. Most of you lie, cheat, and steal on a regular basis to achieve your sales goals and maximize your cut of your secret billable rate. You also scour the resumes you receive for applicant placement and the help-wanted ads placed by employers to find new prey. Using resumes for marketing and sales is pretexting, which is getting private information about an individual under false pretenses, is wrong.

I agree as well. I have stopped dealing with ALL recruiters.

You know, I don't see Kelly Services on that list. They are the worst company I've ever worked with. All they ever had were entry-level jobs with crappy pay, where you get treated like dirt because you're "just a temp".

I had far better jobs at Fortune 500 companies through Manpower and Spherion than I ever did with Kelly.

...We IT professionals have all worked hard to get where we are and that can be very frustrating, especially when it involves wasting vacation days for bogus interviews.

I wasted a couple of days going out of state for an interview and was told I was a finalist and looked very promising. They didn't even check my references and a guy with no experience (for something they said was vital) got the job.

HH seem to lie about how great you are unless they find somebody who will do it cheaper. Can you say H1B visa?

Please add:
Kelly Services
Taylor Grey
Contemporary Staffing
Daybreak Staffing

to that list.

Please add the ones below. All shady in one way or another. They keep trying to push me to agree to submit my resume to jobs I'm only lukewarm about. So fed up with working with them!

- Creative Circle (part of Robert Half)
- Berman Larson & Kane
- Liberty
- Hired Guns
- Concepts in Staffing
- Pakter

I have yet to meet a staffing company that I would want to work with again!

Using resumes for marketing and sales is pretexting, which is getting private information about an individual under false pretenses, is wrong.

Actually, it is ALSO AGAINST THE LAW! People need to report this. Would the FTC or the Atty General's office want this info??? They need to be SHUT DOWN!

Hardly ANYONE actually gets a job thru these predatory agencies! Maybe less than 1% of all resumes received.

They use private and confidential info on resumes to scout for new companies to call for business. This is illegal, sorry to inform you!

Al Townswend in Houston, Texas said: I have been reading on this forum about the many and versatile perspectives about recruiter/placement agencies. Unfortunately, I am looking for work and have signed up with about 17 (my list) of them in the Houston area alone. I have signed up with even more that are physically in some other place in the country. To date, I have not been successful with getting very far with any of them. They seem to rush me into getting my information to them, visiting their offices to formally register with them, and then, they disappear. Yes, disappear. When I do follow ups, they are unable to either remember me or be able to fine my file. I have followed up with some on several occasions, and they finally tell me that the position that I went through a three or four hour exercise to apply for has been filled. Now, this is after I have called several times just to follow up on the position. The case manager finally calls the client to see if the position is still open. Most of the time, the case manager will tell me that the position is filled, again, after I call to follow up. I have never gotten a call back from one of these agencies. I have, though, spoken to recruiters that are employees of a large company and gotten feedback from them. They seem to be in tuned and are knowledgeable about what is going on. But, the agencies that you all have been talking about are not job seeker friendly. Sure, many job seekers are successful using these agencies. The agencies would not be so successful if they were not getting people work. However, the industry has gotten so cut throat that it is difficult to find an agency that has good intentions for the job seeker. It is in fact all about the money. Job seekers are a commodity, and if they don’t get placed right away, their placement priority will be pushed farther and farther to the back of the line. I see it; I

You have BETTER chances GOING DIRECT!!! The agency will lie to stop you!

EH said: How are entry-level IT people supposed to get into companies then if not going through recruiters? It's become virtually impossible to get into decent companies without going through some kind of contract company. Shady they may be, but it pays the rent and keeps me from having to move back in with my parents at the age of 31.

This is EXACTLY what the recruiters WISH you would believe! It is simply NOT TRUE. Apply DIRECT! DIRECT DIRECT DIRECT DIRECT! You do NOT need these predatory agencies!

Illegal activity - Recruiting Agencies in Denver, Colorado said:
They use private and confidential info on resumes to scout for new companies to call for business. This is illegal, sorry to inform you!

I agree and will add that when they ask for references, prior to even speaking to any company's hiring manager, it is for new contact. You see most people have references who are in a hiring or supervisor position. Tell them no references and hang up, see how bad they really want you.