Vector marketing-- Big scam

Sorry I messed up the type on that last one. My comment starts with "turnover rate"

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: Focus Group of 1 - very effective.

Allow me to apologize. As it is the responsibility of the writer to make sure his text is understandable by all his readers it seems I have failed. Allow me to reiterate in a manner you can catch on to. The example of the supervisor who is moving away and keeping his cutlery is not the whole of the people who do so. It was simply an example that came to mind while writing on the subject and since it was recent that's why I included it.
I would also like to say that even with the social not being able to be written off that isn't actually a huge deal. I'm guessing thay you as a regular employee have all sorts of expenses that you cannot write off. May I also add that Social security is not a business expense and therefore is unrelated to my previous post of the advantage of being a private contractor.
As far as disadvantages goes Vector has relatively few of them. The worst paying job I've ever had is the U.S. military. And if you're gonna say that is an illigitimate job with the same face that has been protected by that institution for your entire life then I really don't care for your opinion. The point is that we, as soldiers surrender all our freedoms. We literally become property of the U.S. Government. Our pay sucks, we go where we're told to go, and we do not have the ability to leave. Let me clarify, if we attempt to leave it is called deserting for which we can be shot. Vector has none of these constraints, but requires a little work and effort. You don't sell your soul to the company.
May I also say that many of the defenses I've seen on here (don't remember whether it was you or bosco) have come from single examples such as the woman who posted claiming that she had great difficulty getting her money back for her demo set.

racket444 in Cranston, Rhode Island said:
I would also like to say that even with the social not being able to be written off that isn't actually a huge deal. I'm guessing thay you as a regular employee have all sorts of expenses that you cannot write off. May I also add that Social security is not a business expense and therefore is unrelated to my previous post of the advantage of being a private contractor.
.

1. the social security tax is a DISADVANTAGE of being an independant contractor. Having to pay an extra 7.65% of all my earnings would be a huge reson why I would not want to be an independant contractor. It's unfair to list advantages without also listing disadvantages.

2. Please list what you think you can write off that I cannot. I am curious to think what I can and cannot document as an employee.

2.

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: 1. the social security tax is a DISADVANTAGE of being an independant contractor. Having to pay an extra 7.65% of all my earnings would be a huge reson why I would not want to be an independant contractor. It's unfair to list advantages without also listing disadvantages.

2. Please list what you think you can write off that I cannot. I am curious to think what I can and cannot document as an employee.

2.

can you WRITE OFF mileage on your car?
food for appointments
food in between demos (half off)
sample kit
any other cutco you purchase
cell phone bills
portion of electricity bills (if you have an office at home that you use)
entertainment (going out with other sales reps or managers)
cell phone (if you get one for the business)
business conferences
parking expenses
etc.
etc.
etc.
Those are just the things I can think of off the top of my head. You can argue all you want that being an independent contractor is worse but the bottom line is that the most successful people in life OWN THEIR OWN BUSINESS and pay all of those taxes that you speak of. They still do better than the employees though...obviously.

MarMan in Warsaw, Indiana said: can you WRITE OFF mileage on your car?
food for appointments
food in between demos (half off)
sample kit
any other cutco you purchase
cell phone bills
portion of electricity bills (if you have an office at home that you use)
entertainment (going out with other sales reps or managers)
cell phone (if you get one for the business)
business conferences
parking expenses
etc.
etc.
etc.
Those are just the things I can think of off the top of my head. You can argue all you want that being an independent contractor is worse but the bottom line is that the most successful people in life OWN THEIR OWN BUSINESS and pay all of those taxes that you speak of. They still do better than the employees though...obviously.

First off- working for Cutco as an Independent contractor- you DO NOT OWN YOUR OWN BUSINESS. CUTCO OWNS THE BUSINESS.

okay, having said that- currently, I get my milage reimbursed every month by my company, same rate that the gov't pays, so that's the same. And It's after taxes.
I do not own Cutco,- or a sample kit, so that is pretty job specific and irrelevant.

When you mean food for appointments- I will take this as lunch or coffee with a customer- yes I can write this off, or my company pays me back.

Meals between appointments- just like you, as long as I am more than 50 miles from my home/office- I can.

Cell phone- yes I write this off, same with my cell phone bill.

Parking expenses- business conferences- my company pays for these, no need to write them off.

Entertainment- as a manager- you can write this off for taking reps out, as I am not a manager I can only expense or reimburse it if I am entertaining clients.

So to summarize- almost everything you mentioned I either write off, or get reimbursed for.

So yes, you get to write a bit more stuff off, but my company pays for more stuff, which means it doesn't have to come out against my earnings anyways.

MarMan in Warsaw, Indiana said: can you WRITE OFF mileage on your car?
food for appointments
food in between demos (half off)
sample kit
any other cutco you purchase
cell phone bills
portion of electricity bills (if you have an office at home that you use)
entertainment (going out with other sales reps or managers)
cell phone (if you get one for the business)
business conferences
parking expenses
etc.
etc.
etc.
Those are just the things I can think of off the top of my head. You can argue all you want that being an independent contractor is worse but the bottom line is that the most successful people in life OWN THEIR OWN BUSINESS and pay all of those taxes that you speak of. They still do better than the employees though...obviously.

Lets put it this way- if We both made $5,000 in commissions for the month- before write offs, taxes, etc. $5,000 GROSS INCOME, who do you think nets more, after work related expenses and taxes?

Well that's true and I expected that your company did pay for it. But as far as write-offs, there are more. In my experience,(and I've had both types of jobs) the actual taxes paid end up being very similar. The cool part, at least for a conservative-minded person like myself, is that I don't loan the government my money for a year interest free. I know there are other things I write off, and I tried to make it specific to reps and not managers. Typically though the owners, even though they pay more in taxes (payroll taxes, etc.) probably make more than the employees...or else what would be the point? I'm sure that whoever is paying you all that commission and base pay and for your conferences and things nets more money than you do.

Also, are you telling me that if someone owns a franchise they do not OWN the business? Hmmm...we might be getting into semantics here but I THINK they do. I have no research to back that up and frankly don't care enough to look it up.

MarMan in Warsaw, Indiana said: Well that's true and I expected that your company did pay for it. But as far as write-offs, there are more. In my experience,(and I've had both types of jobs) the actual taxes paid end up being very similar. The cool part, at least for a conservative-minded person like myself, is that I don't loan the government my money for a year interest free. I know there are other things I write off, and I tried to make it specific to reps and not managers. Typically though the owners, even though they pay more in taxes (payroll taxes, etc.) probably make more than the employees...or else what would be the point? I'm sure that whoever is paying you all that commission and base pay and for your conferences and things nets more money than you do.

Also, are you telling me that if someone owns a franchise they do not OWN the business? Hmmm...we might be getting into semantics here but I THINK they do. I have no research to back that up and frankly don't care enough to look it up.

Yes if you own the franchise- you are the owner. I thought you were a MANAGER. Are you a branch manager? or an owner? There is a big difference.

If I do my takes and witholding right, I do not loan the government money interest free for a year, at least not very much. It's all about knowing how many withholding to take.

The big thing that you are missing- Take for example a business conference, yes you get to write it off, but you still had to pay for it.

Over simplified example- we each get $1,000 for income, you pay for a $200 conference, my company pays for it, you pay out of your pocket.

I will be taxed on $1,000, you will be taxed on $800. If my income tax is 15%, and yours is only 10% (lower net income = lower tax bracket)

My net =$850 ($1,000 *85%)

Your net =$720 (($1,000-$200)*90%)

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: Yes if you own the franchise- you are the owner. I thought you were a MANAGER. Are you a branch manager? or an owner? There is a big difference.

If I do my takes and witholding right, I do not loan the government money interest free for a year, at least not very much. It's all about knowing how many withholding to take.

The big thing that you are missing- Take for example a business conference, yes you get to write it off, but you still had to pay for it.

Over simplified example- we each get $1,000 for income, you pay for a $200 conference, my company pays for it, you pay out of your pocket.

I will be taxed on $1,000, you will be taxed on $800. If my income tax is 15%, and yours is only 10% (lower net income = lower tax bracket)

My net =$850 ($1,000 *85%)

Your net =$720 (($1,000-$200)*90%)

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

TO clarify- this is income tax only. I didn't even include that you pay 2x that OASDI that i have to pay.

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: TO clarify- this is income tax only. I didn't even include that you pay 2x that OASDI that i have to pay.

Guy, you are partially correct. The self employed or contract employee would pay double on the Social Security Tax. However, half of the tax is deductable from net income for tax purposes.

For further explanation see the following link on the Social Security Administration website:
www.ssa.gov/pubs/10022.html

And before Bosco even has a chance to say anything, this site has facts, not opinions like the sites he quotes or references.

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: Guy, you are partially correct. The self employed or contract employee would pay double on the Social Security Tax. However, half of the tax is deductable from net income for tax purposes.

For further explanation see the following link on the Social Security Administration website:
www.ssa.gov/pubs/10022.html

And before Bosco even has a chance to say anything, this site has facts, not opinions like the sites he quotes or references.

Good point. It's not double, but it's still more.

And please let me know if anything else in the example on $1,000 is incorrect.

racket444 in Cranston, Rhode Island said: I think you're missing something. The fact that we are hired as independent contractors is a benefit in itself. This allows us to make any business expenses tax right offs. so we get compensated for mileage on our vehicles, I believe it's somewhere around 48 cents per mile, paper, ink, pens, folders, if we have a phone designated for work like say a track phone we can write off the minutes we buy, heck if we go to lunch with another employee to talk about the job and how we're doing it counts as a business consultation and we can write that off too. Yes we do have to pay the money up front, but we get it all back in the long run. The only thing frusturating thing about the way in which we are paid is that we don't have the taxes taken out of our pay, again we're private contractors. This makes it necessary for us to fill out a different tax form from the w2 and we need too keep much better track of our funds and where we spend them since the federal government is not very forgiving.

Rackett- I was just re-reading your post. You have a major flaw in how it works with expensing things on your taxes. The milage is a good deal, but as I have wrote in other posts, you do not get back 100% of what you spent on other supplies, bills, etc.

If for example- you spend $1,000 that you write off in a particular month. The govermnet will NOT give you $1,000 in refund. What you do on your taxes is REDUCE your income by $1,000. They figure as it is an expense it is not income, so you do not have to pay income taxes on it.

Yes it will reduce your taxes, but it also reduces your income.

I'm still waiting to find evidence that Vector isn't a good company. Seems like the argument against the quality, that they're not the best quality knives in the entire world, is the same being used against the income and business practices. I don't really care if I get pain $100 dollars less than you do. A job is a job, and as long as they're not doing anything underhanded or illegal I don't see much problem. Again, all this info about taxes and stuff is discussed with each employee when we sign our contracts.

racket444 in Cranston, Rhode Island said: I'm still waiting to find evidence that Vector isn't a good company. Seems like the argument against the quality, that they're not the best quality knives in the entire world, is the same being used against the income and business practices. I don't really care if I get pain $100 dollars less than you do. A job is a job, and as long as they're not doing anything underhanded or illegal I don't see much problem. Again, all this info about taxes and stuff is discussed with each employee when we sign our contracts.

Funny - one minute you are touting how GREAT it is to be an independant contractor. The minute I say some disadvantages- you don't have a counter point, you just say "we were told all this info when we signe our contracts"
From your posts, I'm not certain you truly understand how it works though.

Also- there has been plenty in these pages written about the good, and the bad of working for Vector. I would say more bad than good, but there is both. If you don't want to see the bad, than that's on you.

Soooo..Is Vector a Big Scam?

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: Rackett- I was just re-reading your post. You have a major flaw in how it works with expensing things on your taxes. The milage is a good deal, but as I have wrote in other posts, you do not get back 100% of what you spent on other supplies, bills, etc.

If for example- you spend $1,000 that you write off in a particular month. The govermnet will NOT give you $1,000 in refund. What you do on your taxes is REDUCE your income by $1,000. They figure as it is an expense it is not income, so you do not have to pay income taxes on it.

Yes it will reduce your taxes, but it also reduces your income.

I don't see how it is possible for your income to be reduced. That's pretty much impossible. Taxable income maybe. But you get what you get.

MarMan in Warsaw, Indiana said: I don't see how it is possible for your income to be reduced. That's pretty much impossible. Taxable income maybe. But you get what you get.

Your Income is reduced by your extra expenses MarMan. It goes back to the example about paying for the Business Conference.

Yes, you get to deduct it from your taxes, but you also have to pay for it out of your pocket.

GO back to that example- that is how your income is reduced. Rackett keeps "bragging" about all these things he gets to write off, but he neglects to write that he has to pay for them, vs. them being provided by an employer.

This company is such a scam it's not even funny. I mean yea the product is great but I really don't believe that you shouldn't get paid for training that you have to sit through 3 days of 5 hours, to then get told you have to buy your kit for $150. I mean HELLO newflash I'm trying to get a job to get money so I have to spend money I don't have to work?? What is that crap?

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: www.ssa.gov/OACT/ProgData/taxRates.html

Rackett- no offense was taken, but i see you have become VERY QUIET since I posted this.

Did you not realize this before I posted it?

Let me just start off by saying that I don't intend to shoot down anyone's claims here. There are certainly some very bad apples clearly all across the board with Vector. However, while that may be true, it's also important to look at this from both sides. The majority of the stories seem to coming from American Vector offices. And it is true that there were a series of lawsuits in the early 90's and that they were never fully resolved. And while the deception may be continuing as the stories continue to come in, I can only make a qualified comment on two things:

1) Not all stories are bad. You'll notice that this job is only what you make of it. There are fellows who have made a lot of money off the job. The job is really done at your own discretion. Every company has its way of getting recruits and increasing productivity. And based on my own experiences for working at Vector, I would say that everything is legit.

2) That brings me to the beef of my time at Vector so far. First of all, NOBODY, and I repeat NOBODY has to endure 5 hours of training 3 days in a row if they DO NOT WANT TO. During the interview, I was personally told what I was going to do and if that was something I wanted to do. I was also told that not everybody decides to do it after those 3 days, that I won't get paid for it and that it may not be for me. However, they also told me that even if I don't go, it may be useful information. And it was. I was genuinely interested by the company and the product and decided that it was something that I wanted to pursue.

At the end of the training, I was asked to pay just over $100 for the sample kit. And for those complaining about how expensive that is, boohoo. Once again it's your own discretion. Secondly, you do sign an agreement where you can get the money you paid for it if you return it. I know some people who have done that. I know even more people who just keep the set after they've quit Vector.

To continue, I'd just like to explain why the deposit is put down on the kit. Do you honestly expect them to give you a free kit without any agreement? They hire a lot of people, so it's not necessarily all that cheap to be giving out dozens of kits to people who may just up and leave with them and end up ripping the company off (instead of the other way around. Ironic isn't it?).

Secondly, with base pay just over $16/appointment, that comes out to just 6 presentations that I have to do to get that money back, giving me ample time to get my presentation in order.

Now, to the biggest concern I keep seeing everywhere: you coerce your friends and relatives to buy the product because they feel obliged to help you. Yes and no. First of all, nobody is going to dish out hundreds of dollars just to help out their child. The only reason people dish out that money is because the PRODUCT is awesome. Definitely there is the combined element of getting an awesome product and helping somebody out. But let's face it: you told them you get paid per presentation. And if they still feel like that's not enough after they haven't bought anything, they're strange people. I've done many presentations, and I've had plenty of no's from people who I thought would help.

Do you think I care that they didn't buy? Hell no. They didnt' need knives. I said "that's ok guys, I don't want to force you to buy anything you don't need" and that was that. Did I get more experience? Yes. I was more prepared to tackle people that I didn't know.

Did I get paid for all the presentations I did that had no sales? Yes, I did. Did I learn how to better deal with people? Yes I did. I know people are busy and that they don't want to be disturbed. Nobody has to help me out and if somebody I don't know doesn't want to see me that's fine. I personally don't force anyone to buy the knives. If somebody's knives truly suck and I think they can afford it, I promote that idea to buy Cutco.

To sum it up:

Vector Canada doesn't suffer from the same problems the US branch suffers from. At least from my experience. I get the chance to work in one of the bigger offices and while it's far from amazing, it has been around for years and does its job.

Secondly, the job is what you make of it. If you suck at it, you'll sever important social ties and lose respect from loved ones. Nobody said it's an easy job either. You really have to work at it to make 10k for a summer for instance. I haven't made nearly that, but way more than my sample kit already.

I have sold to some family/friends. Do I feel bad about it? No. Once again, the product is great and the people who bought it are those who had terrible knives and could afford Cutco. There is no question that they wanted to help me out by making their purchases too. However, why wouldn't they want to help a friend?

Dan from Canada some dude in Richmond Hill, Ontario said: To sum it up:

Vector Canada doesn't suffer from the same problems the US branch suffers from. At least from my experience. I get the chance to work in one of the bigger offices and while it's far from amazing, it has been around for years and does its job.

Secondly, the job is what you make of it. If you suck at it, you'll sever important social ties and lose respect from loved ones. Nobody said it's an easy job either. You really have to work at it to make 10k for a summer for instance. I haven't made nearly that, but way more than my sample kit already.

I have sold to some family/friends. Do I feel bad about it? No. Once again, the product is great and the people who bought it are those who had terrible knives and could afford Cutco. There is no question that they wanted to help me out by making their purchases too. However, why wouldn't they want to help a friend?

Just curious Dan- how long have you been there?

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: Just curious Dan- how long have you been there?

I've been doing it for nearly a month. Now, it's not as heavy as it was in the first 10 days when I was excited about the fast start, however it works for me. I get maybe 2-3 appointments every week now. That's about 32-48 a week and while being far from amazing pay allows me to have another job where I can work solid hours from 9-5.

Basically, from what I hear, a lot of managers seem to be really pushy and tell their reps to lie. And I can see why they'd do that as there are plenty of younger managers attempting to take their time at Vector into a full-fledged career. My manager on the other hand told me the only quota is to sell one item per year in order to keep my rank in the company.

So I mean, the real concerns are:
-making enough money. If I take vector seriously, I can make hundreds of dollars a week. If I don't, I get about 32-48 a week, giving me plenty of time to work at subway. So, that's not an issue. Also, I don't drive. And if I did, as far as I know, it's up to you to decide whether driving somewhere is worth it. And gas can be a tax payoff from what I was told (again, I don't drive, so that doesn't concern me at this point)
-Coercing friends/family into buying. I took this job knowing that part of it was to sell. It's how well you market a product. And to dream of any company not ommitting facts and choosing truths about their product to sell it is ridiculous. If a company offered all the negative things about it, it wouldn't sell. Having said that, minus the price, Cutco make phenomenal knives. My parents didn't buy any sets, but I made enough off the fast start to get a couple knives and still use my starter kit pieces at home so they just bought a couple of steak knives and they're happy with their purchase. Secondly, with anyone else, I try to promote the idea that it is a big investment (which it is). They make the decision.

Essentially, to family and friends especially, I made it very clear that I get paid per presentation. I'd make sure to go over the uses of the knives and make sure that if somebody were buying them that they were perfectly affordable with their budget and probably equally importantly that the knives they were getting were going to be of real use to them. I remember several couples saying they thought a knife was cool but that they probably wouldn't use it. What did I tell them? I told them if they're not going to use it much that they should just stick with their knives and that it's fine because now they're making an educated decision. And that's the other cool thing with the presentations. In addition to being fun and engaging (potentially) for both the presenter and the customer, it's also educational. I really made it my job to get across why the common knife isn't good and why Cutco is better. And if the customer is ok with the disadvantages of their knives, I am perfectly happy because I've made some money and I've educated somebody. Simple as that.

Hello Dan. Thank you for that information. I really appreciate you taking the time to let us know about the company. I've read all the reviews and good and bad and most of the bad complaints have been the ones in the U.S. and checking with the BBB I see a lot of the U.S. companies are not up to par, yet the one in Ontario, Canada is which makes me realizing it might not be a scam after all. I guess we'll have to see how my first week goes.

Thanks again.

Dan from Canada some dude in Richmond Hill, Ontario said: I've been doing it for nearly a month. Now, it's not as heavy as it was in the first 10 days when I was excited about the fast start, however it works for me. I get maybe 2-3 appointments every week now. That's about 32-48 a week and while being far from amazing pay allows me to have another job where I can work solid hours from 9-5.

So Dan, the "honeymoon" lasted 10 days. You are so gung ho about a company you have been at a month, ad where you will be making $32-$48 per week- BEFORE EXPENSES.

If that's what you need in your life- good for you, but others thinking about working here, read this post a couple times. After 10 days he has lost his enthusiasim, and has a regular job to support him.

How long till Dan is out, and just broke even for his knives.

Also- Rackett, you were so GUNG HO, and then I pointed out some facts, now where are you?

Well, I have an interview for today, at 6pm, at a location that sounds impossible to find without knowing that it is there. I have no plans on going, after reading items here (and other forums). I'd like to thank everyone here (who wasn't bragging about their supposed success with Vector) for giving me a good dose of reality. I feel ashamed of even submitting an application now.

Of all the problems and scamming features, I think the biggest scam that many first encounter is that it is offered to young students. This sounds like hard work, that frankly, I can't imagine anyone who is under 22, really succeeding, save for a select few. That is fine, if it is advertised that way. But a letter is sent to just about anyone they can get, which is seriously misleading. Tonight when I call to cancel, I'm doing it on speaker phone, so if they give me a hard time, or say something rude, my father can jump in (yes, a parent, since I'm only 18!) and give them a piece of his mind.

I will definately tell my High School, which I graduated from, to warn students against this. (After all, Vector reps handed out letters as we left our graduation! Some nerve! Trying to get family pictures outside, and some rep is putting papers in my face! I had forgotten about that when I had applied with them.)

Again, thanks for helping to avoid wasting a nice July evening at some crappy interview.

So.... I'm wondering where Rackett, Unoma, Ibysmom, Jay, and Dan from Canada went.

All of them have been on here in the past month- that they are starting, and telling us it's a great job.

Well- a month in, Please tell us what you think of it!

I'm still doing it. It's only been a week and going into my 2nd week.

So far, I've made in total for the past two weeks 12 presentations and 0 sales. Yup. Out of those 12 presentations, 0 sales, there were 4 this week. Even with all the deals, savings and all no one still wanted to buy anything.

As for the last week, my 1st few days. I had 4 presentations SEPARATE presentations in ONE house over 6 hours there, and still they counted it as ONE presentation which I was not happy with at all because I didn't do just ONE presentation but 4 separate ones, as I finished one, another relative dropped by to ask what it was all about, and I presented it to them, and after I finished, then another, and another. It wasn't them coming during the other presentations as they did not want to disturb.

And still it was counted as one, not too happy about that I guess we'll see though how it goes.

And the reason why I haven't posted is because I have a life outside of this, and other responsibilities to do than to post here. I only came here though to get information on the company.

Ibysmom -

Thanks for the update. And I apoligize, you were not bragging about how great a job it is.

But I do think you bring some things to light that new people need to check out before deciding to go forward.

yes this is a scam, I had a interview today and when they asked for 135 dollars i knew something was wrong. and for all these vector employees lying the borrow knoves ar enot free a deposit of 135 must be made. adn then training with no pay. LOL. that is ridiculous. And you employees are also lying about the receiving of pay plus commission, NO!!!!! you only get one or the other not plus.... and I also doubt you get paid if you do not do the complete 45 minutes....seriously I am not that stupid

shan in Nolensville, Tennessee said: Yeah right you must be one of the people trying to hire folks to do this so called business. Isn't it funny how you are the only one that says something good about it. Makes people think. Read the other post. I am not the only one that knows about how this company is a HUGE SCAM!!!! Come on folks how real is it that you made 50k in one year. Like I said you are the one that's probably trying to hire people for this business wasting their time. Misleading them in the ads and everything else. Don't be pulled into the lies folks it's just not true and it just isn't going to work like that. I don't care where you live and who you know and what you do, the only ones that profit are the ones in the ownership of the business. Of course unless you invest in this scam and find some old couple that has nothing better to do with their money and falls for the tired sales pitch and pay for some knives that cost an arm and a leg. I don't even think it's too many of those people left. Just be prepared to go door to door knocking, begging and trying to sell. How about that!!!!!!

Shan, the reason why I'm replying to this massages is I'm form Nashville and I live near Paragom Mills Elementary School, if you know where that is. the point is I been selling Cutco for one year now. I made good money, will honesty I made really great money. In one day I can make more then you in a week, in one week I can make more then you in one month, and in one month I can make more the you in a year. Also, I paid my way to school at MTSU, drive a 2005 car paid off by selling Cutco, and helped my sister buy here first house. Now a BM at Vector Marketing making HALF what I sale. let me ask you if i sold $7500, how much will i make? I forgot I did that last two week. For the people who reading this post that about 20 appointments and 20 appointments is about 26 hours in two weeks. By the way I'm only 20 year old.

nghiem in nashville, Tennessee said: Shan, the reason why I'm replying to this massages is I'm form Nashville and I live near Paragom Mills Elementary School, if you know where that is. the point is I been selling Cutco for one year now. I made good money, will honesty I made really great money. In one day I can make more then you in a week, in one week I can make more then you in one month, and in one month I can make more the you in a year. Also, I paid my way to school at MTSU, drive a 2005 car paid off by selling Cutco, and helped my sister buy here first house. Now a BM at Vector Marketing making HALF what I sale. let me ask you if i sold $7500, how much will i make? I forgot I did that last two week. For the people who reading this post that about 20 appointments and 20 appointments is about 26 hours in two weeks. By the way I'm only 20 year old.

Congratulations on your success with this opportunity.

Sales obviously isn't for everyone. People can be very successful with it, or not. If not, that does not make it a scam, because it is not for you. It's easy to bash a company that one fails at, or discovers is not for them. It's easier then just saying "it was an opportunity that just wasn't for me".

Why bash a company if it just isn't for you?

People, if it is not for you why can you not just leave it be? Attacking people for what they do is not the way to go about it. Do you want someone attacking you over what you do for a living?

I apologize my comments were not meant to offend or attack anyone i just wanted to point out the qualities that this person has exhibited and how i have had the same experiences with people from that company. I think its great that he/she can make a living off of a decietful business practice and trust me i have the literature t prove how decietful it is and i also have their emmy-award winning script of phone approaches with every possible answer to any objection any typical person would come up with. My manager even taught me how to trick people into letting me come into their houses. If you can make a living out of more power to you but with what i have seen the only people that move forward are the ones with no self awareness and an uncanny ability to be a pushy ass#$%$

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: People, if it is not for you why can you not just leave it be? Attacking people for what they do is not the way to go about it. Do you want someone attacking you over what you do for a living?

Anti- this board is for people to share their work experiences and give advice to others as to why, or why not someone should work there, or at least what to expect. Theoden did exactly that - he/she had a bad experience and told others about it. You yelled at Bosco and me for not having ever worked there, or knowing what truly happened, well here is a person who did experience it first hand.

Interesting in that when ngheim comments about how great experience thier time has been, you commend them, but when someone has a bad experience they are suppose to keep quiet.

You always say to research, well, if people want to research reading both the GOOD and the BAD should let peopl decide for them selves what to think, and make an informed decision.

Since the title of this forum is "Vector Marketing - Big Scam" and not "Good for you since you made a little money" then I submit the following link for your enjoyment:

www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?vector

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: Interesting in that when ngheim comments about how great experience thier time has been, you commend them, but when someone has a bad experience they are suppose to keep quiet.

Excellent point Guy! I think Anti-Me is just looking for ANYTHING that will refute our opinions . . .

It's the same in the MLM forums.

Bosco in Orlando, Florida said: Excellent point Guy! I think Anti-Me is just looking for ANYTHING that will refute our opinions . . .

It's the same in the MLM forums.

Don't have to look to far.

You're right, everything is the same in the MLM forums, you sounding like a broken record, quoting the same crap over and over, and listing the same garbage websites over and over. And YES, THAT IS MY OPINION!!!!!

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: People, if it is not for you why can you not just leave it be? Attacking people for what they do is not the way to go about it. Do you want someone attacking you over what you do for a living?

What do you mean by "leave it be?" Do you mean that people should not post their negative experiences with this company?

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: Read the post again. Where did I tell him to keep quiet? Gee, I never did, did I? All I said was that it isn't necessary to bash the company in the way he did to get his point across. If it wasn't for him fine. If he wants to say why fine. Where am I telling him to keep quiet GUY? Where? That's right, no where!!!! As usual, just like Bosco, making up stuff as you go along to suit what you want to say. GOOD JOB!!!!!

you said "leave it be"- does that not mean keep quiet and just "walk away"? Go ahead- spin that one.

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: Also, who allowed you to decided what this forum is for? Is this something you decided for yourself, and you're letting me now know what this forum is for? Thanks for letting me know, I'll try to stick to YOUR guidelines now that I know what this forum is for.

I believe the people at Indeed.com have decided what these boards are for. They monitor and delete posts that are innapropriate. They also start forums, and in the ones started by hosts, they will ask people their expreiences, and opinions on a company.

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: I believe the people at Indeed.com have decided what these boards are for. They monitor and delete posts that are innapropriate. They also start forums, and in the ones started by hosts, they will ask people their expreiences, and opinions on a company.

Guy, read your own words. "Anti- this board is for people to share their work experiences and give advice to others as to why, or why not someone should work there, or at least what to expect." If this is the case then why are you two allowed to continue bashing those that are trying to promote their business, and continue to attack those that are successful. What you two do doesn't fit what you say the forum is for. Read your own words again, and think about what you are using this forum for, and what Bosco is using this forum for. I can tell you that it is not to tell your work experiences and to give advice based on those experiences.

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: You two are the ones trying to put a "spin" on things. I addressed this in the post, if either of you actually read it, or just read that parts that you wanted to read. I said "let it be" as in not attacking those that are doing the business and being successful. I have no problem with those that have done a business and leave negative feedback. I never said "keep quiet" or "walk away". Those are only your words Guy. Again, do either of you want someone attacking you for what you do for a living? Can you not see the difference here?

People attack what I do all the time. I have tough skin and I can take it.

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: Guy, read your own words. "Anti- this board is for people to share their work experiences and give advice to others as to why, or why not someone should work there, or at least what to expect." If this is the case then why are you two allowed to continue bashing those that are trying to promote their business, and continue to attack those that are successful. What you two do doesn't fit what you say the forum is for. Read your own words again, and think about what you are using this forum for, and what Bosco is using this forum for. I can tell you that it is not to tell your work experiences and to give advice based on those experiences.

Since I interviewed years ago, and knew people who worked at VECTOR- why am I not allowed to comment?

Guy in Ohio in Cleveland, Ohio said: Since I interviewed years ago, and knew people who worked at VECTOR- why am I not allowed to comment?

Nobody said you couldn't comment. There is a difference between attacking people and the company they represent, and commenting. Again, can you not see the difference?

Anti-Bosco in Orlando in Orlando, Florida said: Nobody said you couldn't comment. There is a difference between attacking people and the company they represent, and commenting. Again, can you not see the difference?

I suppose it's all in how you read into it. You looked at his comments one way, I looked at them another.

Fair enough

look im not trying to bash anyone i just meant to point out some obvious facts but its true guy from clevalndits all about how you read into it. But its hard to ignore the fact that there will be 2 good comments and 14 negative comments. you have to take it for what its worth. The other funny thing is the whole argument about this forum and whether it is or not for work experiences with this comapny. Im sure this forum didnt say "hey tell us about your work experience" but as soon as someone saw the name vector the first posts were negative. UUNNTTTIILLL vector managers decided to search for "vector hate sites" as my manager would call them and then what they do is talk about how much they made like nghiem, they put people down and deny all of the facts.

This petition is worth reposting:

www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?vector

It designed to expose the deceitful business practices of Vector Marketing and contains more than 11,000 signatures!!!