Ethics in America

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Comments (19)

CJM in Boca Raton, Florida

85 months ago

I've been reading many views from many people about the unethical practices of both recruiting companies and other corporate companies they have worked for or with. Unfortunately I have had the same experiences with MANY recruiting firms as well as employers. I am a professional woman in her fifties, and I have had OVER fifteen jobs in the last two years because I refuse to stay in jobs that I am forced to work for ruthless and unethical people. It is hard not to feel like a complete loser for not staying but I am at a point in my life that the stress is too costly. Reading some of these testimonials is sadly comforting. It seems to only way to combat the behavior in our corporate system is via litigation and I have now participated in numerous class action suits for various causes- and I have seen some positive results in the work place because of them. I used to shy away from such activities, but now feel that it is my way of contributing (by the way, I have received very little in the way of settlement money). I enjoy working and want to continue to work for a long time. If anyone out there knows of a good company in the financial industry to work for (and will hire someone over fifty) please let me know. Good luck to all!

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

The best company to work for is CJM INC. :)

www.indeed.com/forum/gen/Career-Advice/05390c183c137e1874794a0c

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

In other words, the best company to work for is yourself.

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CJM in Boca Raton, Florida

85 months ago

How funny, I was a small business owner for ten years before I had to go into the corporate world- maybe that's the reason so many people choose to work for themselves if possible. And, yes, my employees were very loyal and I gave them the respect they deserved.

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Sandra Millar in Coventry, United Kingdom

85 months ago

I found Robert Half and its subsidiary Protiviti to be a very unprofessional and unethical company. I worked at Protiviti in London as their Government sector expert until April 2007. I was sacked for raising my concerns about the company's non-compliance with legislative requirements. I am now taking legal action and an employment tribunal is scheduled for October 2007. It seems that the company's publicity about high corporate governance standards was a smoke screen. As most of Protiviti's senior management are ex-Andersen partners you would have thought they'd learnt their lesson after the Enron affair.

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

Sandra Millar in Coventry, United Kingdom said: I worked at Protiviti in London as their Government sector expert until April 2007. I was sacked for raising my concerns about the company's non-compliance with legislative requirements.

I don't know UK law so I cannot say what the exact situation was but I can tell you two things..

1- In the US there are laws to prevent such things from happening to people we call whistle blowers.

2- I have seen many cases where an employee oversteps their authority. As example only, if your job was (as implied) that you were handling placement with government contractors, it might not have been appropriate to take it upon yourself to dictate how the company as a whole should react in regards to government edicts.

A simple example is where an employee is a supervisor over a few people but assumes the role of management and starts to voice concerns over what upper management does. It is simply not that person's job to do so within the company. All such concerns should be addressed outside the company more as a concerned citizen than a voice of management within the company. That is what it sounds like happened but correct me if this does not fit your circumstance.

In any business it is not a good idea to voice dissent against the company unless it is your place to do so. A company is not the same as a free society where freedom of speech and such is permitted.

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CJM in Boca Raton, Florida

85 months ago

My experience has been that the "leopard does not change it's spots". In other words, their mentality has just been transferred to other areas. I don't know how this country is supposed to maintain the respect of the international community when our corporate practices are so ruthless. I sent a letter to 60 Minutes after the Enron exposure and said I believed their practices to be more the rule than the exception. The sad thing about it is that most of these organizations could still be successful without operating the way they do. Good luck on your case- it takes alot of courage to stand up for your convictions.

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CJM in Boca Raton, Florida

85 months ago

Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky said: I don't know UK law so I cannot say what the exact situation was but I can tell you two things..

1- In the US there are laws to prevent such things from happening to people we call whistle blowers.

2- I have seen many cases where an employee oversteps their authority. As example only, if your job was (as implied) that you were handling placement with government contractors, it might not have been appropriate to take it upon yourself to dictate how the company as a whole should react in regards to government edicts.

A simple example is where an employee is a supervisor over a few people but assumes the role of management and starts to voice concerns over what upper management does. It is simply not that person's job to do so within the company. All such concerns should be addressed outside the company more as a concerned citizen than a voice of management within the company. That is what it sounds like happened but correct me if this does not fit your circumstance.

In any business it is not a good idea to voice dissent against the company unless it is your place to do so. A company is not the same as a free society where freedom of speech and such is permitted.

So sorry to read the info above- that loss of freedom of speech is what is allowing some people to continue with behavior that is unethical. I agree that comments and concerns should be addressed to the proper parties depending on where you are in the organization, but taking away our freedom of speech in the corporate world is just another way to control an environment (and often times not for the good of all).

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

CJM in Boca Raton, Florida said: taking away our freedom of speech in the corporate world is just another way to control an environment (and often times not for the good of all).

But that is exactly my point. The workers in any organization do not control the business. The business is in control of the person or entity that owns the business. A business is a commodity like any other. It can even be sold and the people who work there are sold along with the company capital equipment. Anyone who does not like the sale or the new owners can resign. I can't think of any business in a capitalistic society that is basically a democracy.

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

Sandra Millar in Coventry, United Kingdom said: I found Robert Half and its subsidiary Protiviti to be a very unprofessional and unethical company. I worked at Protiviti in London as their Government sector expert until April 2007. I was sacked for raising my concerns about the company's non-compliance with legislative requirements. I am now taking legal action and an employment tribunal is scheduled for October 2007. It seems that the company's publicity about high corporate governance standards was a smoke screen. As most of Protiviti's senior management are ex-Andersen partners you would have thought they'd learnt their lesson after the Enron affair.

Seventh spam

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CJM in Boca Raton, Florida

85 months ago

Are you familiar with the philosophy of Jim Goodnight of SAS Corporation- a privately owned multi-billion dollar software company based out of North Carolina. He says that the success of his business is determined by "the people that walk into his offices in the morning and leave at night". At what point did we humans become such an unhuman commidity? I am not a bleeding heart, but I firmly believe that our society is strongly weakened when we disregard the value of the hard working people that make it happen. I do agree with you in that our corporate culture is not a democracy- it has turned into a dictatorship.

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

CJM in Boca Raton, Florida said: Are you familiar with the philosophy of Jim Goodnight of SAS Corporation- ... I do agree with you in that our corporate culture is not a democracy- it has turned into a dictatorship.

I am not familiar with that particular individual but I agree with the philosophy up to a point. Certainly no business will survive without the people who actually build the widget and/or service them. My only opposition is to the workers who believe that just because they work for an employer they have a right to determine the course of that business.

In essence, if you are not elected to the board of directors, then you really have little say in what direction the company goes. Your only basic right is to resign. Working for a company should be seen as a privilege and if you don't see it as such, then again, you can only leave it.

As for the dictatorship, it has always been that way.
Think of this.. If you had a billion dollars of your own money and were able to convince someone to sell you their business because you thought you could make a better go of it, would you want ordinary workers there attempting to tell you you were wrong and that they thought it should be run the way it had always been run? Wouldn't you rather figure it belonged to you and it was to operate as you saw fit?

You know this. You said you were in business for yourself. How much credence did you give to the average worker when it came to the general direction of your company?

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CJM in Boca Raton, Florida

85 months ago

I agree that it is the responsibility of those at the top to make the final decisions on what direction a business should go. I welcomed feedback from my employees because I think that open communication can often improve production and help to avoid some problems before they occur. Ideally you will try to hire and keep people that have good ideas. I also believe in keeping the levels of management at a minimum in order to keep the politics at a minimum. Well, so much for business philosophies. I have had some good experiences with some smaller, privately owned companies that had the same philosophy so I guess that it what I need to find again. Enjoyed the debate, best of luck to you in your pursuits.

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

CJM in Boca Raton, Florida said: Enjoyed the debate, best of luck to you in your pursuits.

And you as well. I too enjoyed the discourse. May I say that it is refreshing to discuss viewpoints with someone as intelligent as yourself? I get so many personal attacks from people who have opposing viewpoints. I wish everyone could read our discussiion and see the proper way it is done. People don't have to agree on every point in order to put their views up as being as valid as those of another.

Thank you, CJM.

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Sandra Millar in Wales, United Kingdom

85 months ago

Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky said: I don't know UK law so I cannot say what the exact situation was but I can tell you two things..

1- In the US there are laws to prevent such things from happening to people we call whistle blowers.

2- I have seen many cases where an employee oversteps their authority. As example only, if your job was (as implied) that you were handling placement with government contractors, it might not have been appropriate to take it upon yourself to dictate how the company as a whole should react in regards to government edicts.

A simple example is where an employee is a supervisor over a few people but assumes the role of management and starts to voice concerns over what upper management does. It is simply not that person's job to do so within the company. All such concerns should be addressed outside the company more as a concerned citizen than a voice of management within the company. That is what it sounds like happened but correct me if this does not fit your circumstance.

In any business it is not a good idea to voice dissent against the company unless it is your place to do so. A company is not the same as a free society where freedom of speech and such is permitted.

I was a senior executive (Director level) with the responsibility of advising the company on policies and procedures to have in place to win Government business. Government in the UK requires companies to have best practice and ethical policies otherwise it will not deal with them. Sometimes companies try to mis-represent themselves and have policy documents which are not adhered to in practice. This amounts to a fraud on the client - as the Government client would never have done business if it was known what how the company was truly operating.

Companies belong to their shareholders (all shareholders) and employees and executuves have a duty to protect the shareholders investment and not place the company at risk of prosecution

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

Sandra Millar in Wales, United Kingdom said: I was a senior executive (Director level) with the responsibility of advising the company on policies and procedures to have in place to win Government business.

Sorry but I don't believe that for a millisecond. If you were at that level and had those responsibilities they would not have sacked you for doing your job now would they?

Sandra Millar in Wales, United Kingdom said: Companies belong to their shareholders (all shareholders) and employees and executuves have a duty to protect the shareholders investment and not place the company at risk of prosecution

Right and I can just go buy a hundred shares of Robert Half and I have the right to waltz in and start telling them how to run the place.

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CJM in Boca Raton, Florida

85 months ago

Sandra- it is the attitude that Charlie has that is causing the problems that we are having here. Too many executives (and politicians) have the attitude that Charle does and feel that they should not have to be accountable to anyone. And as the saying goes "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely".

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Call me Charlie in Louisville, Kentucky

85 months ago

CJM in Boca Raton, Florida said: Sandra- it is the attitude that Charlie has that is causing the problems that we are having here. Too many executives (and politicians) have the attitude that Charle does and feel that they should not have to be accountable to anyone. And as the saying goes "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely".

What you are now discussing is the basic ideas of Capitalism vs Socialism in essence. I'll not get into that bag of worms, thanks. :)

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Sandra Millar in Coventry, United Kingdom

85 months ago

CJM - yes I become disappointed when I see how young people want to work really hard for their companies but see some senior executives just acting in self-interest not for the good of those companies. Ultimately everyone loses out as those companies earn a bad reputation and lose business and may in the end be destroyed by those acting selfishly.

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