Are unsafe operators flooding the maket because of NCCCO?

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Justin Scritchfield in Grand Junction, Colorado

69 months ago

I'm just curious what people think. I personally think that the CCO certs are about worthless now days. I think that it is because companies are pushing people through the CCO program. I'm tired of people thinking that they are operators, when they only have a limited amount of time in a boom truck, and their company made them get their certs, and now they have a false sense of security. Tell me what you think.

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The General in West Palm Beach, Florida

69 months ago

Justin Scritchfield in Grand Junction, Colorado said: I'm just curious what people think. I personally think that the CCO certs are about worthless now days. I think that it is because companies are pushing people through the CCO program. I'm tired of people thinking that they are operators, when they only have a limited amount of time in a boom truck, and their company made them get their certs, and now they have a false sense of security. Tell me what you think.

I think its these shady CRANE SCHOOLS that charge these poor saps tons of cash and promise them everything in the book including the CCO and Job placement.... but they still cant offer EXPERIENCE!!! you have to have a certain amount of hours even to take the CCO !!!

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lpgfamily5 in Tracy, California

69 months ago

True. I lucked out. I got to practice on a 70 ton Potain Tower for 4 months under supervision prior to attending the lame 16 hour school that was rushed. So fast that I actually failed the 1st written test. Retook written, passed practical, got NCCCO. I agree, way too fast. My saving grace was the Tower I worked on had so many fail-safe features.

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jhov4 in Crestwood, Kentucky

69 months ago

Justin Scritchfield in Grand Junction, Colorado said: I'm just curious what people think. I personally think that the CCO certs are about worthless now days. I think that it is because companies are pushing people through the CCO program. I'm tired of people thinking that they are operators, when they only have a limited amount of time in a boom truck, and their company made them get their certs, and now they have a false sense of security. Tell me what you think.

I think to a certain extent you are right, but what did we have before? people still claimed they were crane operators, and they didnt even need a license to prove it. i think the test should be a little bit harder than getting a drivers license.

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jhov4 in Crestwood, Kentucky

69 months ago

The General in West Palm Beach, Florida said: I think its these shady CRANE SCHOOLS that charge these poor saps tons of cash and promise them everything in the book including the CCO and Job placement.... but they still cant offer EXPERIENCE!!! you have to have a certain amount of hours even to take the CCO !!!

thats not true anymore, it used to be a thousand hours of crane related experience.... but since there was no real way to prove how much time anyone really had, they did away with that. i mean is checking the oil and washing windows as an oiler really crane related experience? You want to mandate experience? the Operating Engineers apprenticeship program Gives people experience.

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skydiver in Morgantown, West Virginia

68 months ago

jhov4 in Crestwood, Kentucky said: thats not true anymore, it used to be a thousand hours of crane related experience.... but since there was no real way to prove how much time anyone really had, they did away with that. i mean is checking the oil and washing windows as an oiler really crane related experience? You want to mandate experience? the Operating Engineers apprenticeship program Gives people experience.

i am cco certified i agree with the written part of the test there is a lot of information you need to know. the practical test is a joke to me it is 4 maneuvers that everyone giving and taking the test know and can practice for months until they can do it.

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Liebherrguru in Longview, Texas

68 months ago

I agree completely!!!! I have been running cranes for 15 but my dad and uncle have been running them for 40 a piece. Both of them have made the comment that they probably couldnt pass the cco, whereas I lucked out and BARELY passed!!! It aint about checking the oil and washing the windows, its about KNOWING EVERY part of your crane frome the sheaves to the driveshaft or trackpads. I personally have 3 1/2 years of rigging experience where these folks nowadays never know that a endless red is good for 13,200# in a vertical except in that school cause I guarantee you if you go back 3-4 months later and retest these guys with no exp., they will flunk bigger than Dallas.

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OPERATOR in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina

67 months ago

YES I KNOW FOR A FACT ITS HURTING REAL CRANE OPERATORS.I'VE BEEN OPERATING CRANES FOR 25 YEARS.OLD FRICTION RIG OPERATOR.CCO CERTIFIED ONLY TOWER CRANES. CAN'T FIND A JOB BECAUSE OF PEOPLE GETTING CCO.I'VE WATCHED PEOPLE ON JOBS WITH NO EXPERIENCE.I CALL THEM SEAT WARMERS.BEEN IN TOWER CRANES LAST 10 YEARS STRAIGHT.ALSO I,VE OPERATED MANY A TIME IN UNSAE CONDITIONS JUST TO KEEP MY JOB@CAN PROVE IT WITH RECORDER VIDEO.SOME COMPANY'S DONT CARE THERE JUST HIRE SOMEONE ELSE.THE CRANE CRTIFICATION MEANS NOTHING

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joe flow in Poway, California

67 months ago

yes nothing can replace the knowleage of in the seat no book can show no teacher can explain the feel of evey situation you will in counture out in the feild the best thing to do is keep safety in mind always and know every crain is different.

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OPERATOR in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina

67 months ago

skydiver in Morgantown, West Virginia said: i am cco certified i agree with the written part of the test there is a lot of information you need to know. the practical test is a joke to me it is 4 maneuvers that everyone giving and taking the test know and can practice for months until they can do it.

hey there is a lot of things on the written test,that have nothing to do with operating cranes.whats up with:appointed person,competent person,designated person,qualified person.get real.

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James V in Deming, New Mexico

67 months ago

Well I'm one of those guys who got certed through a crane school and I can gaurantee that I'm not hurting your job prospects.Every company I've talked to only wants guys with experience.

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James V in Deming, New Mexico

67 months ago

In addition to that comment , no one is going to put a rookie in the seat.Even though they are probably keener on specifics and haven't had time to develope any bad habbits.Load chart,wire rope,rigging and crane maintenance specifics would still be fresh in new operators mind.NCCCO certs aren't just handed out to any one that decides they want it.

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eazy_money81

67 months ago

im a certified operator in the wyoming oilfields, the certification here just gives people here someone to blame when their problem goes bad. we have to think outside the box and an operator has to learn fast and really learn the feel of several machines. personally how many of us havw had to operate on one outrigger to keep our job, or thats what happened when things went south in the middle of a lift and you cant go back?

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LOCAL 139 JOURNYMEN in Milwaukee, Wisconsin

67 months ago

I BELEVE THAT THE NCCO EXAM IS GOOD TO SOME EXTENT, BUT BEING A HANDS ON EXPRINCE TYPE, THE BOOK WORK WAS THE HARDEST FOR ME, BUT AS SOME OF YOU HAVE SAID THE ONLY WAY TO BE A GOOD CRANE OPERATOR IS BY TIME IN THE SEAT. THAT IS TRUE TO, I HAVE HAD THE OPERTUNITY OF OPERATING CRANES FROM A MANITOWOC 2250 TO A MANITOWOC 4100 AND SO ON, THOUGH I DONT HAVE 1000S OF HOURS IN THE SEAT I DO HAVE OVER 7000 HRS OILING, AND SOME OF YOU MIGHT THINK THAT THIS JOB IS A BRAIN DEAD JOB, BUT YOU HAVE TO KNOW JUST AS MUCH AS THE OPERATOR, THAT IS IF YOU HAVE A GOOD OPERATOR.. THAT YOU ARE WORKING WITH. MY OPERATOR THAT I USED TO HAVE HAD TRAINED ME SO THAT WHEN HE WAS IN THE SEAT NOBODY WOULD BOTHER HIM I WAS THE PERSON YOU TALKED TO NOT THE OPERATOR. YOU HAD A QUSHTION ABOUT WEATHER OR NOT WE COULD PICK SOMHTING, YOU ASKED ME AND I CHECKED IT ON THE LOAD CHART WE MESURED THE DISTANCE AND THEN I INFORMED THE OPERATOR OF WHTAT WE HAD GOING ON AND IF I WASNT SURE OR HAD A QUSHTION HE CORECTED ME AND WOULD SHOW ME WHAT I MAY HAVE FIGURED WRONG.. HE WOULD TELL ME THE POINT OF ME TRAINING YOU IS SO THAT IF IM SICK ONEDAY YOU CAN JUMP IN THE SEAT AND KNOW WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON. IT DOSENT DO ME ANYGOOD HAVING YOU STAND THEIR DOING NOTHIN AND YOU WANT TO BE AN OPERATOR. SO THIS IS HOW WERE GONA DO IT. WELL LAST YEAR I GOT MY NCCO JUST IN LARG HYDRO, BUT TEACH THE YOUNGER PEOPEL DONT JUST MAKE THEM WASH WINDOS. THATS NOT A GOOD OPERATOR..

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Ljpiscatelli

62 months ago

The cco doesn't make anyone a crane operator. It does however make us responsable for anything that happens.I have four of my cco the written exam is great knowledge the practical exam is a bunch of crap I could my dog how to pass that. Now most of the inexperienced people thy pass the cco only get one job before they relize it's not for them. On the other hand I have also seen 10-15 year veterans freeze up when they are told to get the mancage on the hook. So it's the person not the experience or certifications

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Liebherrguru in Judson, Texas

62 months ago

Amen brother!!!!

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Wong Kian Loong in Singapore, Singapore

62 months ago

bb

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

1. i think the CCO is a complete joke. to suggest that anyone can attend a class for a couple of weeks and then be competent enough to take their own rig out is nothing more than a disaster waiting to happen. just like equipment licensing in the military, the cco offers nothing more than a false sense of competence for the unknowing operator.

2. do i feel like the my position or job is threatened by some newbie with a cco cert? ABSOLUTELY NOT! in fact, the crane i'm assigned to is one that i wouldn't feel threatened by even an experienced operator. my company knows all too well the dangers associated with putting just anyone in the seat.

3. i read a comment about the significance of "OILING" experience as it pertains to the pursuit of obtaining a crane operator's cert. i can assure you that half the time the oiler knows more about that crane than the operator. and i can promise you that on my crane an operator would be lost without me as their oiler. on my crane i'm the assigned "oiler" even though i am fully certed and am the primary relief operator should my operator take a day off or just decide he doesn't feel like running the crane. aside from my partner nobody knows my crane as well as i do.

4. i think it important for people to realize that there are two sides of the house when it comes to the crane operator field of work. there is the contractor crane opeator where all they do is pretty much show up on the job and jump in the seat and then there is the TRUCK CRANE RENTAL side of the house.

any idiot can show up on a jobsite and jump in the seat of a crane. "oiling" is when you not only know how to run the crane, but build it up, service it, engineer lift plans, engineer and apply rigging plans. any operator that's never done this and has only sat in the seat is a joke. they are not a real crane operator. there's more to being an operator than sitting in that seat and pulling levers.

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Liebherrguru in Judson, Texas

62 months ago

i agree with you 110%, I have been preaching that for years. If you let someone else build your crane and then you just show up, run it til the job is done and let someone else tear it down, HOW IN THE HELL do you know what your crane does or what is wrong with it? I have always called them fellars "lever pullers" and they are a far cry from being a by God crane CRANE OPERATOR!!!

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

62 months ago

You know I've read it over and over again. The guy who worked his way up to get his cert. against a guy who went to a school and got his cert. Any HR rep would be nuts to hire a guy who only went to school over a guy who worked his way up in the field. HELP change the way the NCCCO does it. Who will sign a petition to have Crane certification work on a graduated scale apprenticeship ? eg: 1st yr- rigger/oiler 1500hrs 2nd yr-hands on under supervision of a Journeyman 1500 hrs. 3rd yr 1500 hrs hands on and then technical (school). Before the man receives his/her Hoisting ticket. The details of hrs on machine types can be ironed out over time. So that when a man gets his ticket it means something to the guy hiring them. STAND UP AND BE COUNTED IT'S THE ONLY WAY OPERATORS CAN CHANGE IT. AND KEEP THE IDIOTS OUT OR OUR TRADE. And yes I've had my own credentials reviewed by the Hawaii state board as well as the NCCCO and they have been accredited, according to letter I've gotten back. So I'm not some lame Canuck stirring the pot. I'm moving to the states and had to have my credentials put under scrutiny and would very much like to see this trade go to the next level With G-8 certification where the best of us take it there.

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

62 months ago

AGAIN WHO WILL SIGN A PETITION TO BRING IN STEP-CLASS CRANE CERTIFICATION ???

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

hey man, if you want to consider yourself a crane "GOD" i challenge you to come to my company and try playing that game. in fact, i'll roll out the red carpet for you to get in the seat of my crane any darn day you think you want to throw your experience around - GMK 5175.

hmm, we'll see if you can even get the boom scoped out much less be able to find the right chart. go talk your nonsense elsewhere. i'll eat a crane "GOD" up anyday.

tomorrow i'm going to take my crane out on a job that the sales guy still needs to recon to make sure my crane will be able to fit in. to me that means its going to be tight. my operator has the day off tomorrow. i'm fully certed, but work is slow. what does that mean? it means that i'm going to either take a green oiler out on my crane or oil for someone that doesn't know my crane at all (the exception being 3 or 4 people in my company). yes sir, this oiler might be holding the hand of an operator tomorrow that has no business being in the seat of my rig and you better believe it will be my job to keep him out of trouble to include programming the computer, pacing off the pick, engineering the rigging, engineering the pick, and not only putting the load chart in his lap - but explaining a carefully planned liftplan to him to include which lever to pull and when to pull it. for that i get to make 5 bucks less an hour to carry him, but at least my crane doesn't get tore up. all of that so a CRANE GOD like you can talk his trash like he's better than the rest of us.

don't talk to us about it pal. come show me!

you want to be a god? those certs don't mean anything to me.

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crane guy in Cheyenne, Wyoming

62 months ago

I completely agree that we need a better system for certifying operators. It also seems to me that most people don't understand the difference between being an operator and just running a machine. I really don't like hearing oilers/riggers complain about making less money or having to know more than the next guy. That is part of the process of becoming an operator. You need to put your time in, eat a lot of crow, keep your mouth shut, and know your place. If you think you have it difficult always remember that us real operators had it twice as bad as any of the newcomers. I also feel that anyone who needs to talk to build themselves up are generally very insecure about their abilities. I firmly believe in letting your actions in the seat speak for you.

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

if you are a CRANE GOD and i have to carry you then "NO, YOU ARE NOT WORTH MORE MONEY THAN ME. IN FACT YOU SHOULD BE OILING FOR ME IF YOU EVEN QUALIFY FOR THE JOB". here in vegas we have a saying. "you are only as good as your last pick".

you bring up the idea of PAYING DUES to the trade. let me tell you something. the day you think you know it all you better do us all a favor and hang it up. the day you think your sh_t don't stink because you are in that seat you become a danger to us all.

YES, i have worked for company in LONG BEACH, CA where an oiler actually had his operator run off. be careful buddy. you act like a god in this neck of the woods you will be called out. if you can't run that crane right you will be down the road and yes you better believe your "OILER" will have you run off. as oilers the safety of the job and the preservation of our cranes are our job and we do it well. come into our turf you'd be well advised to be at your best or you'll be sent packing.

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

i've only worked 8 hours in the past 2 weeks. work is freaken slow. my operator is leaving town for a day on important family matters. no matter what i know i can't permit my crane to be harmed or the job to go bad just because i know he's coming back the next day.

he trained me on this rig to be able to handle any situation - high voltage power lines, poor ground stability, overloading the crane or rigging, etc... should something go wrong i'll never be able to look him in the eyes and admit that i allowed our crane to get damaged putting us both out of work. i can't do that to my mentor and partner. it doesn't matter if i'm in the seat or not. i will be held responsible for anything that goes wrong. i'm the assigned "OILER". when on a job in the moment of truth i own that crane and everything on its hook and am still held accountable for everything the operator does. when in the field its my rig! i have the final say on everything that happens and believe me when i tell you "i'm constantly looking for the flysh_t in the pepper". honestly, unless its an experienced GMK operator coming out with me on my rig i know its going to be a bad day from the start.

crane gods i have to watch with twice the vigilance. they may have my office fooled, but i know better. i'm a real "OILER". I TAKE CARE OF CRANE FIRST ALWAYS.

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

62 months ago

Dude keep in mind that every potential employer can/is reading what you write. If the attitude you show here is what you give on site it does not surprise me that you are not at the controls

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

I only trust the GMK operators when it comes to my crane. yeah i have an older GMK and more often than not there's something they may have forgotten about my rig. all of them have run my crane before, but still there might be a very basic thing here or there that they may have forgotten - i'll help out em out real quick to get them over the hump and i'll do it with a smile on my face. they know what they are doing. i know it. still, every crane has its quirks and i know the ones associated with my crane - no big deal. the little thing i don't worry about when dealing with a real pro. they know what's going on. one thing i guarantee you is this - they'll never approach my rig or me with any lack of respect. often they'll even tell me, "hey man its been a long time since i been on this rig" and i'll respond with, "don't worry bro, i got your back. you run into a problem let me know and i'll get us squared away". i'll be the very best "OILER" they ever had. and i'll know they are worthy of sitting in that seat because they were smart enough to admit when they didn't understand something. the newer GMK's are all computerized more than mine is.

i'll always have the right chart for the job before they do and if their chart is different than mine i'll be asking a lot of questions if their chart is weaker than mine. i run at 100% of chart or at least that's how i engineer my picks. after all i do work in TRUCK CRANE RENTAL. i endeavor to achieve the best i can with what i have onboard. i don't call in for cheek weights, spreader bars, or bigger rigging unless there's no other way to get the job done. and even then i better be able to explain myself to the bosses if i do.

EXAMPLE - GMK 5275 is all computerized and fully integrated between the crane carrier and the house. that's all i'll tell you. i won't mess with a 275 ton grove unless i have someone holding my hand. why? because there's so much involved that i don't want to create a bad situatio

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta said: Dude keep in mind that every potential employer can/is reading what you write. If the attitude you show here is what you give on site it does not surprise me that you are not at the controls

welcome to TRUCK CRANE RENTAL! if you are worried about what anyone thinks of your decisions when you are right then you don't belong in the seat in the first place. remember something buddy! they pay us to take chances and do things that most people would run from. why do you think they hire us to begin with??? you can't handle the heat then get the hell out of the kitchen!

if you wanted to define in a single sentence what crane operators do for a living its this, "WE ARE PROBLEM SOLVERS."

when you get around big money i can promise you the customer doesn't want to hear anything about doubt. they want you to be 100% certain you can do what you are about to do. to do that you have to convince them with a properly engineered lift plan and stand by it. that means you have to prove to them on paper you can do it before you even attempt it. and "NO" you will not have anyone dispute you without blowing them out out of the water with facts and figures.

the single most important attribute of any real crane operator is CONFIDENCE. you have to know your crane, your rigging, your crew, and most of all what the hell you are doing. its not cockiness my friend, but a most certain confidense that can never be questioned. when the strength and the power of god are at the the control of your fingertips you better not only believe in what you are doing, but make sure damn sure everyone else believes in it too.

perhaps you should try carpentry.

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

ya man, you want to think i'm worried about what potential employers will see? am i worried they'll see somebody with the balls to make big things happen?

have you ever engineered a LIEBHERR LR 1400 making a pick in heavy lift and then dropping and totally disconnecting the heavy lift wagon with the load on the hook in the middle of a pick while the load is still on the hook and then finishing the pick because there's no room to swing the wagon? have you done this at an oil refinery?

have you ever coached an operator and laid out the lift plan for an entire crane crew to do this when you are picking 200 plus k at heavy lift chart only to boom it up close enough to be able to drop the wagon and swing it such that you can trip it with another crawler, then grab a new vessel and do the same damn thing in reverse? talk your nonsense eslewhere.

MAXIM CRANE - TORRANCE, CA 1995 exxon/mobile oil refinery

i still don't have a CCO buddy. instead i've I.U.O.E. certs and thats all i need. i know when to step back and take the direction of those that know more than me. i also know when to tell someone that i don't know what i'm doing and to please help me do right by them, our crane, and our job.

yeah you bet i want a prospective TRUCK CRANE RENTAL employer to see this. i just want to do great things with great people and great equipment.

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eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada

62 months ago

for all of you obsessed with your certs or that of getting your certs i would challenge any of you to ask my operator who he'd rather have in the seat of his crane in his absense. the answer? ME! yes we have other qualified hands that can run this crane, but ask my operator in that case who he'd most prefer "oil" on the rig in his absense - ME!

why? i won't let anyone hurt my crane. i'll know an operator's every move before they ever make it. i'll know everything first. i am my crane's most loyal "oiler/operator"

psst! i still laugh at the CCO! you come on my rig you better have more lead in ur as_ than that piece of paper. ITS MY RIG! after the owner i am the next in line you'll answer to. there's a reason my rig is just as clean underneath as on top. there's a reason my rig is still the best crane in the fleet as far as i'm concerned.

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

62 months ago

eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada said: hey man, if you want to consider yourself a crane "GOD" i challenge you to come to my company and try playing that game. in fact, i'll roll out the red carpet for you to get in the seat of my crane any darn day you think you want to throw your experience around - GMK 5175.

hmm, we'll see if you can even get the boom scoped out much less be able to find the right chart. go talk your nonsense elsewhere. i'll eat a crane "GOD" up anyday.

tomorrow i'm going to take my crane out on a job that the sales guy still needs to recon to make sure my crane will be able to fit in. to me that means its going to be tight. my operator has the day off tomorrow. i'm fully certed, but work is slow. what does that mean? it means that i'm going to either take a green oiler out on my crane or oil for someone that doesn't know my crane at all (the exception being 3 or 4 people in my company). yes sir, this oiler might be holding the hand of an operator tomorrow that has no business being in the seat of my rig and you better believe it will be my job to keep him out of trouble to include programming the computer, pacing off the pick, engineering the rigging, engineering the pick, and not only putting the load chart in his lap - but explaining a carefully planned liftplan to him to include which lever to pull and when to pull it. for that i get to make 5 bucks less an hour to carry him, but at least my crane doesn't get tore up. all of that so a CRANE GOD like you can talk his trash like he's better than the rest of us.

don't talk to us about it pal. come show me!

you want to be a god? those certs don't mean anything to me.

Dude before you spout off you better find out who you are talking to. 15 yrs in the oil patch of Alberta ,from the Crows nest pass to the back woods of Zama as well as three terms in the Arctic. Definitly makes me more Qualified then you. Taking that into fact tells me not to ever have you on my crew !

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

62 months ago

eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada said: for all of you obsessed with your certs or that of getting your certs i would challenge any of you to ask my operator who he'd rather have in the seat of his crane in his absense. the answer? ME! yes we have other qualified hands that can run this crane, but ask my operator in that case who he'd most prefer "oil" on the rig in his absense - ME!

why? i won't let anyone hurt my crane. i'll know an operator's every move before they ever make it. i'll know everything first. i am my crane's most loyal "oiler/operator"

psst! i still laugh at the CCO! you come on my rig you better have more lead in ur as_ than that piece of paper. ITS MY RIG! after the owner i am the next in line you'll answer to. there's a reason my rig is just as clean underneath as on top. there's a reason my rig is still the best crane in the fleet as far as i'm concerned.

Where I come from Operators are required to do their own engineered lift plans and we are all trained to do so as part of our TRADE certification You really need to get grip on who's certification you slam KID. Alberta sells I'ts program on Crane and Hoist Globally. The same program I was trained in as well as field training. Working in temps -25 C to [-40 C (-40F) same thing] is normal in alberta.

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pop in Wake Forest, North Carolina

61 months ago

[QiUOTE who="LOCAL 139 JOURNYMEN in Milwaukee, Wisconsin"]I BELEVE THAT THE NCCO EXAM IS GOOD TO SOME EXTENT, BUT BEING A HANDS ON EXPRINCE TYPE, THE BOOK WORK WAS THE HARDEST FOR ME, BUT AS SOME OF YOU HAVE SAID THE ONLY WAY TO BE A GOOD CRANE OPERATOR IS BY TIME IN THE SEAT. THAT IS TRUE TO, I HAVE HAD THE OPERTUNITY OF OPERATING CRANES FROM A MANITOWOC 2250 TO A MANITOWOC 4100 AND SO ON, THOUGH I DONT HAVE 1000S OF HOURS IN THE SEAT I DO HAVE OVER 7000 HRS OILING, AND SOME OF YOU MIGHT THINK THAT THIS JOB IS A BRAIN DEAD JOB, BUT YOU HAVE TO KNOW JUST AS MUCH AS THE OPERATOR, THAT IS IF YOU HAVE A GOOD OPERATOR.. THAT YOU ARE WORKING WITH. MY OPERATOR THAT I USED TO HAVE HAD TRAINED ME SO THAT WHEN HE WAS IN THE SEAT NOBODY WOULD BOTHER HIM I WAS THE PERSON YOU TALKED TO NOT THE OPERATOR. YOU HAD A QUSHTION ABOUT WEATHER OR NOT WE COULD PICK SOMHTING, YOU ASKED ME AND I CHECKED IT ON THE LOAD CHART WE MESURED THE DISTANCE AND THEN I INFORMED THE OPERATOR OF WHTAT WE HAD GOING ON AND IF I WASNT SURE OR HAD A QUSHTION HE CORECTED ME AND WOULD SHOW ME WHAT I MAY HAVE FIGURED WRONG.. HE WOULD TELL ME THE POINT OF ME TRAINING YOU IS SO THAT IF IM SICK ONEDAY YOU CAN JUMP IN THE SEAT AND KNOW WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON. IT DOSENT DO ME ANYGOOD HAVING YOU STAND THEIR DOING NOTHIN AND YOU WANT TO BE AN OPERATOR. SO THIS IS HOW WERE GONA DO IT. WELL LAST YEAR I GOT MY NCCO JUST IN LARG HYDRO, BUT TEACH THE YOUNGER PEOPEL DONT JUST MAKE THEM WASH WINDOS. THATS NOT A GOOD OPERATOR..

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

61 months ago

Your point is valid. One of the signs of a good operator is his willingness to hand down his knowledge to his rigger. It is what an operator learns from his/her own experience that sets them apart from others. In this trade, the problem is finding a rigger who 's desire to operate does not excede his want to be at the controls. I believe you made it there because you listen to the instructions of the operator. Sounds like you should have been at the controls sooner.

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JTHENG14 NYC in Blairstown, New Jersey

61 months ago

Justin Scritchfield in Grand Junction, Colorado said: I'm just curious what people think. I personally think that the CCO certs are about worthless now days. I think that it is because companies are pushing people through the CCO program. I'm tired of people thinking that they are operators, when they only have a limited amount of time in a boom truck, and their company made them get their certs, and now they have a false sense of security. Tell me what you think.

Worthless is an understatement... Just think about what the NCCO is, it is being backed by insurance companys,rental outfits,non union outfits, and states that have not ever taken a look at who is in the seat. Your right it has also created a business for the so called Crane Operator School which mean squat. The only way to be a crane operator is time in the seat under guidance of a professional. How can anyone say because you pass a written then a sort of pratical exam that your ready to hit the street. I have 29 years in the seat, NYS and NYC license but first I had to have time to sit for the test.. Did two years in the scrap yard on an old Link Belt 108, then at a concrete plant digging barges, then with Weeks doing water work... That is how you become an operator.. One last thing, then NCCO is a way to get the company,insurance guys and others out of dodge and place all the blame on the operator...

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JTHENG14 NYC in Blairstown, New Jersey

61 months ago

one last thing to think about these people come out with basic education on cranes, that is fine but who would hire them without five year or more on a rig. I wouldn't, also what happens if they get sent out on an old rig like a 2900,3000,3500 or 4100 tower..

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JTHENG14 NYC in Blairstown, New Jersey

61 months ago

Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta said: AGAIN WHO WILL SIGN A PETITION TO BRING IN STEP-CLASS CRANE CERTIFICATION ???

I would sign it and I have 29 years in the seat to back up my point of view

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JTHENG14 NYC in Blairstown, New Jersey

61 months ago

eo1scw in Las Vegas, Nevada said: for all of you obsessed with your certs or that of getting your certs i would challenge any of you to ask my operator who he'd rather have in the seat of his crane in his absense. the answer? ME! yes we have other qualified hands that can run this crane, but ask my operator in that case who he'd most prefer "oil" on the rig in his absense - ME!

why? i won't let anyone hurt my crane. i'll know an operator's every move before they ever make it. i'll know everything first. i am my crane's most loyal "oiler/operator"

psst! i still laugh at the CCO! you come on my rig you better have more lead in ur as_ than that piece of paper. ITS MY RIG! after the owner i am the next in line you'll answer to. there's a reason my rig is just as clean underneath as on top. there's a reason my rig is still the best crane in the fleet as far as i'm concerned.

Now your a proud and damn good oiler and operator.. I take my hat off to you bud! Looks like we have lots of IUOE guys here so answer me this why is the international backing this thing..our guys are the best we know it and so do they. We are the best trained and skilled.. Any of us who have worked out of a rental barn know that if you don't have it together then your gone. As well as with any of the iron or concrete outfits and if your bad the hall will not back you... so why does giblan back this thing

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

61 months ago

JTHENG14 NYC in Blairstown, New Jersey said: I would sign it and I have 29 years in the seat to back up my point of view

I've seeded the idea to a contact with the NCCCO and he has said that the current style of certification has gotten feathers ruffled and in himself interested to see proper changes made. Will you help me word the petition to ensure it makes it?

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jtheng14 in Blairstown, New Jersey

61 months ago

can do!

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Crane Wild in Clarkston, Georgia

61 months ago

Justin Scritchfield in Grand Junction, Colorado said: I'm just curious what people think. I personally think that the CCO certs are about worthless now days. I think that it is because companies are pushing people through the CCO program. I'm tired of people thinking that they are operators, when they only have a limited amount of time in a boom truck, and their company made them get their certs, and now they have a false sense of security. Tell me what you think.

I'm sure that alot of people would agree that new programs are always pushed around by these liers that run schools, But I found a group in atlanta that worked with me took all the time I needed and did'nt charge me and arm and a leg, way untraditional in the market that crane schools are pushing,I paid around $900 for my tower written and practical, so i guess there are some good ones out there.

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Crane Wild in Clarkston, Georgia

61 months ago

Huum ! He can obviously clean a crane maybe even run one but there must be a reason he's still an oiler and not an operator... Get it right!!! It's still the operator then the oiler understand your the dirty one at the end of the day.

Get your traing pass the BASIC exam for any certifactaion program and then only THEN you can be in charge.

By the way if the CCO is so bad then why is the IUOE sponsering it in all there videos?

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Crane Son in Watford City, North Dakota

61 months ago

Agreed. Companies are taking advantage of the NCCCO. It is reckless to put an individual in a crane seat without practical experience. Not only are the companies putting the individual at risk (physically, emotionally, financially, and legally), they are causing a higher potential danger for others. It seems like there should be a facility where people can be trained over a period of months to obtain the NCCCO without prior experience. Not a 9 week program, but a 6 month+ training camp where individuals are given a more challenging and realistic approach to the profession. I do think that the people who are really interested in the work will benefit. The people for the wages probably won't.

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ALVIN HANCOCK in Griffin, Georgia

60 months ago

LOCAL 139 JOURNYMEN in Milwaukee, Wisconsin said: I BELEVE THAT THE NCCO EXAM IS GOOD TO SOME EXTENT, BUT BEING A HANDS ON EXPRINCE TYPE, THE BOOK WORK WAS THE HARDEST FOR ME, BUT AS SOME OF YOU HAVE SAID THE ONLY WAY TO BE A GOOD CRANE OPERATOR IS BY TIME IN THE SEAT. THAT IS TRUE TO, I HAVE HAD THE OPERTUNITY OF OPERATING CRANES FROM A MANITOWOC 2250 TO A MANITOWOC 4100 AND SO ON, THOUGH I DONT HAVE 1000S OF HOURS IN THE SEAT I DO HAVE OVER 7000 HRS OILING, AND SOME OF YOU MIGHT THINK THAT THIS JOB IS A BRAIN DEAD JOB, BUT YOU HAVE TO KNOW JUST AS MUCH AS THE OPERATOR, THAT IS IF YOU HAVE A GOOD OPERATOR.. THAT YOU ARE WORKING WITH. MY OPERATOR THAT I USED TO HAVE HAD TRAINED ME SO THAT WHEN HE WAS IN THE SEAT NOBODY WOULD BOTHER HIM I WAS THE PERSON YOU TALKED TO NOT THE OPERATOR. YOU HAD A QUSHTION ABOUT WEATHER OR NOT WE COULD PICK SOMHTING, YOU ASKED ME AND I CHECKED IT ON THE LOAD CHART WE MESURED THE DISTANCE AND THEN I INFORMED THE OPERATOR OF WHTAT WE HAD GOING ON AND IF I WASNT SURE OR HAD A QUSHTION HE CORECTED ME AND WOULD SHOW ME WHAT I MAY HAVE FIGURED WRONG.. HE WOULD TELL ME THE POINT OF ME TRAINING YOU IS SO THAT IF IM SICK ONEDAY YOU CAN JUMP IN THE SEAT AND KNOW WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON. IT DOSENT DO ME ANYGOOD HAVING YOU STAND THEIR DOING NOTHIN AND YOU WANT TO BE AN OPERATOR. SO THIS IS HOW WERE GONA DO IT. WELL LAST YEAR I GOT MY NCCO JUST IN LARG HYDRO, BUT TEACH THE YOUNGER PEOPEL DONT JUST MAKE THEM WASH WINDOS. THATS NOT A GOOD OPERATOR..

I AGREE WITH THAT 100% WE NEED TO TRAIN OUR YOUNGER BROTHERS AND SISTERS

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ALVIN HANCOCK in Griffin, Georgia

60 months ago

we have to be cco but all the other people we work with can,t rig flag or speek english whats up with that

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ALVIN HANCOCK in Griffin, Georgia

60 months ago

we have to be cco but all the other people we work with can,t rig flag or communicate whats up with that

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JTHENG14 NYC in Sparta, New Jersey

60 months ago

One thing we all have to remember when training our younger brothers and sisters, not all of the equipment they will be running will be the 99% fail safe hydr. rigs. They have to get training on the old friction rigs...

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Ron Walton in Edmonton, Alberta

60 months ago

Wow a man with common sence. Believe him kids there is alot of that old junk out there. They have no LMI no lock-outs or A2B. you learn real fast how to eyeball your radius and memorize all your deductions and maybe not all of your chart but most of it. If you don't your over and then things get ugly FOR YOU !! The laws are being re-written to hold operators personally liable in civil court, if they have not done their due diligence prior to lifting and the list is long. The laws in Alberta have! ACT C-45 . What do you think all the certification is leading up to?? Don't be scared it could just cost you EVERYTHING you have for the rest of your life.

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JTHENG14 NYC in Sparta, New Jersey

60 months ago

That is how I learned on old junk with my dad and my grand dad watching and wacking me in the back of the head.. New York is going the same way as Alberta, if your the man in the seat you have to know your business and know when to say NO! Our training school breaks our young engineers in on alot of junk, without learning the old 2900's,3000's, 3900"s ect these kids are worthless. Can't tell you how often a young guy comes out, licensed by the city,with a CCO, but all he knows is the hydraulics. Around here you see way too much gray hair in the seat of the old equipment because the kids can't do the job or are afraid of the pile drivers...lol In my 30 years I have see a big change from 2nd. and 3rd. generation to relieing on the CCO type of training. The union tries really hard here to train the guys right but with the new laws and such this CCO is going to cost more in accidents and deaths because the real ENGINEER is not in the seat

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OwenDavid40@GMail.com in Hobart, Indiana

60 months ago

Well i have to some what agree with you,but Iam a Union Operator and have been for over 20 plus yrs.I had to take the NCCO when i was working in the Miami,FL. UNION hall. In order to even take the class you had to have 2000 hrs of seat time on every crane that you where certifing on and you had to prove your hrs on each crane,but that was the UNIONS requirements.It sould be that way for everyone wanting to get certified.Now when i came back to my home l ocal in NW IN the local would not except my ncco becouse they said that anyone and there brother can get one,but i told them that that was not the case when i got mine,and told them the requirements that the union hall had,and they told me that that was not a requirement for the ncco that in some cases in 3 to 4 days you could be a certified crane operator. Now my local here has its own certification.

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