What One Thing Would You Change

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Calfornian in Hayward, California

18 months ago

I've been thinking about this for awhile so I thought I'd put it out here just to see if the topic goes anywhere.

What one thing would you change about today's job market, job hunting process, etc.

I'm not going to list any, yet, because I don't want to bias the results, and like I said, I have a whole lot more than one.

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Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania

18 months ago

Calfornian in Hayward, California said: I've been thinking about this for awhile so I thought I'd put it out here just to see if the topic goes anywhere.

What one thing would you change about today's job market, job hunting process, etc.

I'm not going to list any, yet, because I don't want to bias the results, and like I said, I have a whole lot more than one.

I would like to see some real legislation that would give a company some great incentive with hiring an older, experienced worker, much like the incentive to hire a minority. Too many of us are out of work and cannot get back in by no fault of their own.

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Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania

18 months ago

Calfornian in Hayward, California said: I've been thinking about this for awhile so I thought I'd put it out here just to see if the topic goes anywhere.

What one thing would you change about today's job market, job hunting process, etc.

I'm not going to list any, yet, because I don't want to bias the results, and like I said, I have a whole lot more than one.

OK...I do have more than one, but I have to list this as well.

I would like to see certain questions and fishing for personal information on an initial application ILLEGAL, such as;

* what year did you graduate high school
* social security number
* first and last names and contact info of references
* required salary

All these things do not belong in the hands of someone that isn't even going to interview you!

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

I've gone on a couple of interviews where it was like the year 1975. No Taleo, no behavioral quests, no 5 interviews, no personality tests, no rude interviewer, no BS, no pages of requirements, etc...

I really wish it was like that today. Just take a somewhat good person and give them a chance at a good job. Train them, treat them fairly, and expect alot from them at the same time.

Nowadays interviewing is always like I'm trying to become an exclusive member of Donald Trump's private club. Unreal. Too much!

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Also, the economy is dragging. We need to get it rocking again where there are more jobs than job seekers.

But, I think for us and the rest of the world this is the new normal.

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Almost Suicidal in San Antonio, Texas

18 months ago

Thank you for asking. This morning's application included 4 security questions. Really, who would want to hack into my job application?

Then there was the required explanation of employment gaps. Hey, when all you can get is temp work there are going to be plenty of those.

And while minorities and women may be encouraged to apply, this educated hispanic female is getting nowhere fast!

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Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin

18 months ago

Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania said: OK...I do have more than one, but I have to list this as well.

I would like to see certain questions and fishing for personal information on an initial application ILLEGAL, such as;

* what year did you graduate high school
* social security number
* first and last names and contact info of references
* required salary

All these things do not belong in the hands of someone that isn't even going to interview you!

I filled out an online application the other day that even asked for the name and location of the elementary school I attended. Now why would they need to know that?

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Yep in Cedar Rapids, Iowa

18 months ago

Just one thing? Well I suppose that one thing I would do is bring back training. There are so many people who can do a lot of things, but they need to learn how. If employers started training people, then entry level jobs could truly be entry level again instead of requiring "1 to 2 years experience."

If I couldn't do that, then I would make credit checks illegal. Its a modern day debtors prison, how can you pay your bills if you can't get a job?

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Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania

18 months ago

Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin said: I filled out an online application the other day that even asked for the name and location of the elementary school I attended. Now why would they need to know that?

Oh my freaking gawd! Next thing they will ask will be, "year graduated kindergarten" so they can compare that to the elementary school question. And yes, I once came across the question you are citing and nearly fell out of my chair laughing.

BTW "Californian", love this blog topic!! It's not just a blind rant, but a way to speak out about the specific things that have gone so wrong with looking for work in the last few years.

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania said: I would like to see some real legislation that would give a company some great incentive with hiring an older, experienced worker, much like the incentive to hire a minority. Too many of us are out of work and cannot get back in by no fault of their own.

They have actually talked about this. Make age a protected class and offer a tax credit for hiring one of us ol' geezers.

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin said: I filled out an online application the other day that even asked for the name and location of the elementary school I attended. Now why would they need to know that?

LOL! Were you applying to the CIA?

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Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania

18 months ago

LabProfessional in Jamaica, New York said: I am new here..how do i start a forum ...any one can give me idea?

LabProfessional, we expect you to "hit the ground running" and ask for no "training"... LOL!

Seriously, just back out by one tab up top so you are looking at "Forums > General" and you will see blue text that says "Start a Discussion". Click on that and start a topic. Hope that helps.

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania said: Oh my freaking gawd! Next thing they will ask will be, "year graduated kindergarten" so they can compare that to the elementary school question. And yes, I once came across the question you are citing and nearly fell out of my chair laughing.

BTW "Californian", love this blog topic!! It's not just a blind rant, but a way to speak out about the specific things that have gone so wrong with looking for work in the last few years.

I am waiting for them to ask for my kindergarten teacher's email address. Er, and making that a required field.

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blah in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania

18 months ago

I'm waiting for them to ask for my mother's social security number.

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Jeff in Silver Spring, Maryland

18 months ago

Hmmm. A big problem today is that while online job applications make it easy to apply for jobs they also mean that there are many more applicants for each job. It is too time-consuming for employers to read each application, so they use scanning programs to filter the applications. This means that career management ability (or being lucky enough to fall into the right job) counts more for getting hired than do actual work skills. But I don't know how to solve this problem.

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Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin

18 months ago

Bluetea in Texas said: LOL! Were you applying to the CIA?

You would think so! But no, it was a privately held company and an HR position.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin said: You would think so! But no, it was a privately held company and an HR position.

Aren't you the same Stillsmiling from Georgia?

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Almost Suicidal in San Antonio, Texas

18 months ago

First application of the day, auto filled my name and phone number into every field on the application.

Here's another fun thing, after you have invested time, they tell you at the end they are going to do a credit check. That must eliminate a lot of candidates these days!

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Unhappilyunemployed in Pennsylvania

18 months ago

Almost Suicidal in San Antonio, Texas said: First application of the day, auto filled my name and phone number into every field on the application.

Here's another fun thing, after you have invested time, they tell you at the end they are going to do a credit check. That must eliminate a lot of candidates these days!

I would love to see an auto fill for every single application. I would be overjoy if there was software that allowed you to plug in all your stats into one place and then it would be able to self populate into all the boxes of any application out there, flawlessly. Especially a stupid Taleo application.

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Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin

18 months ago

Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York said: Aren't you the same Stillsmiling from Georgia?

Yes and for some reason, it has my location in Wisconsin but I'm still in Georgia. Tried to change the location but it won't let me.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin said: Yes and for some reason, it has my location in Wisconsin but I'm still in Georgia. Tried to change the location but it won't let me.

I forgot the details been so long. But did you have to travel farther to another office for work or are you still at the same office? And how's that job going?

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Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin

18 months ago

Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York said: I forgot the details been so long. But did you have to travel farther to another office for work or are you still at the same office? And how's that job going?

Good memory! I turned down the transfer since it would cost me $250 per month and they weren't willing to pay me any more money or for any gas. So 2 weeks later I was informed that at the end of that month, I would no longer have a job. When the end of the month came, I was offered part time at 25 hours a week. That was more than unemployment so I accepted especially since I can make my own schedule. I am looking hard for a job and they know it and are stating my separation as downsizing to any potential employer that calls. I know it sucks but it is covering what could have been another gap on my resume. No more benefits for me tho such as vacation accrual, sick days, holiday pay or retirement. I keep hoping to find a job I can grow with, pays well and has retirement.

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Nick in Linden, New Jersey

18 months ago

Actually try to process and tax illegal immigrants.

I have nothing against them, they're hard-working folks for the most part. But they're allowing themselves to be exploited, and we're allowing their exploitation by looking the other way. Let's be honest, these companies are only hiring these people to avoid taxes and healthcare. Make the companies pay for ALL of their employees.

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Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin

18 months ago

I think if I could change one thing it would be somehow requiring all those online applications we fill out to automatically alert us when we are not going to be considered for a job. There has to be a way! Too many times applicants are left wondering about a job. Most of us assume after no word after 30 days that we aren't going to get an interview but it sure would be nice to know for sure.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Nick in Linden, New Jersey said: Actually try to process and tax illegal immigrants.

I have nothing against them, they're hard-working folks for the most part. But they're allowing themselves to be exploited, and we're allowing their exploitation by looking the other way. Let's be honest, these companies are only hiring these people to avoid taxes and healthcare. Make the companies pay for ALL of their employees.

Nick,

Was wondering what happened to my friend Nick. Thought you got that transfer to Hawaii.

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Nick in Linden, New Jersey

18 months ago

Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York said: Nick,

Was wondering what happened to my friend Nick. Thought you got that transfer to Hawaii.

That application so far basically got ignored...I got one of my ranks back, but I'm still at $14.50/hr =P

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Stillsmiling in Milwaukee, Wisconsin said: Most of us assume after no word after 30 days that we aren't going to get an interview but it sure would be nice to know for sure.

I use the 30 day rule and put my own time limit on all the waiting and wondering. That is what most people say to do.

Yes, there is always a possibility that they will call. I got my last job that way but I wasn't their first choice. Their first choice, the person they originally hired backed out. That was the only time.

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YourCalIisBeingRedirected in SomewhereOverTheRainbow, Kentucky

18 months ago

Just wait till all this "fishing" causes an unbelievable amount of identity theft!!!!

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Calfornian in Hayward, California

18 months ago

I guess I'll answer now.

I assume most of you remember when ATM's first came out. Banks all said "no, we won't charge you to use them, they're a convenience, and we'll make the money back in other ways." Those other ways being to get rid of the tellers.

A few years later banks started charging us to use ATM's. "Hey, these transactions have a cost", they said. So, we were paying to use the ATM that got rid of the tellers, thereby saving them money, and providing a new revenue stream.

A few years later banks pulled this one, "hey, we still have tellers, they cost money, so if you want to use one...."

A few years after that "yeah, you went over your limit, that's a $35 charge", "wait, how did I go over my LIMIT, if it's a limit?"

Then, after that, "Mr. X bought a car, what's my bid for that information? Do I hear $0.20? $0.25, I hear $0.25."

Somewhere along the way business changed from providing a good service, at a fair price, to get everything you can, anyway you can, and who cares about anything else.

It's extremely adversarial.

Looking for work seems the same way with drug tests, background checks, tell us your entire salary history (if the check doesn't provide it), offering 29.5 hour work weeks or expecting 24/7 with no OT, training, on your own. We have to protect shareholder value above all else.

For me, I would change the process back to offering good and fair value, rather than taking it anyway you can.

But, with Tim Cook lauded as a hero before Congress I'm pretty sure this is just wishful, and delusional, thinking on my part.

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Calfornian in Hayward, California said: I guess I'll answer now.

I assume most of you remember when ATM's first came out. Banks all said "no, we won't charge you to use them, they're a convenience, and we'll make the money back in other ways." Those other ways being to get rid of the tellers.

I was in college and working as a bank teller when ATMs first came out. Part of my job was to "load" the ATM, replenish the envelopes and to balance it at night.

In Europe, many banks consist of 30 ATMS and a phone. They do have "peopled" banks but not on every corner. Not like here.

Banks have had the technology to go "peopleless" for years but the holdup has been the US Treasury - they don't (until recently) like this idea. Bank tellers are the de-facto agents of the US Treasury.

Bank tellers have to continually take compliance tests which are issued by the US Treasury. Europe has a different system.

But back to your point, what you are talking about is "fee income" and its a money maker.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Calfornian in Hayward, California said:

Somewhere along the way business changed from providing a good service, at a fair price, to get everything you can, anyway you can, and who cares about anything else.

It's extremely adversarial.

Looking for work seems the same way with drug tests, background checks, tell us your entire salary history (if the check doesn't provide it), offering 29.5 hour work weeks or expecting 24/7 with no OT, training, on your own. We have to protect shareholder value above all else.

For me, I would change the process back to offering good and fair value, rather than taking it anyway you can.

I've seen this firsthand because I'm on the frontline in Sales. No matter how much they talk about the customer it's not about them any longer. It's all about the stock price/investor. There is no balance any longer. I think I heard someone coin the phrase "Predatory Capitalism." It's greed beyond greed. And that hurts people alot. See alittle greed is ok, (your barber not recording all of his cash customers for the day) but now it's beyond that. Winner takes all mentality, everyone else gets nothing. The stories I could tell from my own experience and last company.

When Enron was in business they use to shut down electric companies in California for a few days I believe the story goes. They said it was for maintenance. But in reality it was all for the sake of supply and demand and in turn making money. When this was being done in the hot summers some elderly people actually died and many others went being sent to hospitals for heat stroke.

But I'm not sure there is a direct correlation between businesses being greedy and the hiring process??? Might not be the best example out there to use.....

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Calfornian in Hayward, California

18 months ago

Bluetea in Texas said: But back to your point, what you are talking about is "fee income" and its a money maker.

Another place you see it in California is when a public entity has to mobilize and they can assign blame. "Look, it's their fault this happened". It's particularly pernicious with people who aren't likeable and easy to blame.

But, in case you've forgotten, Mr. Public Entity, we created you, specifically, to deal with accidents. Our tax dollars fund you, specifically, to be able to mobilize for this sort of thing.

Asking for more, to do your job, is an interesting approach, but it's how everything is done today.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Bluetea in Texas said:
But back to your point, what you are talking about is "fee income" and its a money maker.

Another example, I worked for a company that took back customer/clients purchases if they decided it wasn't what they wanted.

After many years this huge Fortune 500 company decided to start charging a return fee. No other company did at least the privately held ones. But it was a way to generate more profits.

They told customers, well we have to hire someone to put the return item back on the warehouse shelf and process it in the computer. You didn't charge a fee in the past, why now?

They were looking for a way to generate more money without being to obvious.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Blue,

You take out the bike for some fresh air today?

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Calfornian in Hayward, California

18 months ago

Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York said: But I'm not sure there is a direct correlation between businesses being greedy and the hiring process??? Might not be the best example out there to use.....

I wasn't trying to point to greed, exactly, so if my example implies that, and I think I agree that it does, then it's a bad example. I'm also non-linear in how I think so this can happen. :)

Because anything goes, the process has evolved into a very adversarial relationship. We, as an employee, aren't a partner in the company, we're an expense, almost an enemy. You aren't a partner with the bank, even if they have your money, and make money on it, you are someone to nickle and dime to death with fees.

A local consumer guy says that it used to be different but today they just hide in the bushes waiting to ambush you with anything they can.

An employee is the same thing. Does anyone believe a company who says "We value our employees?" Or, is your first thought, "yep, they outsourced their support to India, accounting is in the Philippines and how come all the local support guys speak Hindi?" Do you trust, any, large employer, today?

Maybe it wasn't, ever, that different, but I'm pretty sure at places like HP, or IBM, it was different at one time. It wasn't adversarial and workers were valued as more than a resource, at least in some places.

So, I think they are related. As we've degraded our businesses to be about getting anything we can, anyway we can, that would also extend into the hiring/working process.

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Jeff in Oxon Hill, Maryland

18 months ago

Calfornian in Hayward, California said: I wasn't trying to point to greed, exactly, so if my example implies that, and I think I agree that it does, then it's a bad example. I'm also non-linear in how I think so this can happen. :)

Because anything goes, the process has evolved into a very adversarial relationship. We, as an employee, aren't a partner in the company, we're an expense, almost an enemy. You aren't a partner with the bank, even if they have your money, and make money on it, you are someone to nickle and dime to death with fees.

A local consumer guy says that it used to be different but today they just hide in the bushes waiting to ambush you with anything they can.

An employee is the same thing. Does anyone believe a company who says "We value our employees?" Or, is your first thought, "yep, they outsourced their support to India, accounting is in the Philippines and how come all the local support guys speak Hindi?" Do you trust, any, large employer, today?

Maybe it wasn't, ever, that different, but I'm pretty sure at places like HP, or IBM, it was different at one time. It wasn't adversarial and workers were valued as more than a resource, at least in some places.

I think that it did used to be different. I think that 30+ years ago, accumulation of wealth was nor considered to be the only consideration. People felt more of a civic obligation, and this meant not grabbing any penny that they could justify for some technical reason. I grew up at a time when the character Scrooge was considered to be a bad person but he would fit in as typical in today's society.

MHO is that in modern America, not getting everything for yourself that you possibly can is the only thing that is considered immoral, and to worry about the impact on other people is considered to be silly.

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York said: Blue,

You take out the bike for some fresh air today?

Yup! I have a 3 wheeler. Everyone here in the trailer park thinks it cool.

Ask Mom what's for dinner. I don't feel like cooking tonight.

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Jeff in Oxon Hill, Maryland said: MHO is that in modern America, not getting everything for yourself that you possibly can is the only thing that is considered immoral, and to worry about the impact on other people is considered to be silly.

"Greed is good" - Gordon Gecko (Wall Street)

As the Roman empire began to fall, they had a campaign of panem et circenses. Latin for Bread and Circuses.

It was an attempt to placate the masses with entertaining stories of the Lindsay Lohans and Dancing with the Stars of the day.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Bluetea in Texas said: Yup! I have a 3 wheeler. Everyone here in the trailer park thinks it cool.

Ask Mom what's for dinner. I don't feel like cooking tonight.

In about an hour home made pizza. Alot of dessert laying around the house...that's always good too.

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Bluetea in Texas

18 months ago

Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York said: In about an hour home made pizza. Alot of dessert laying around the house...that's always good too.

Wow! I would be the size of a prize winning hog if I lived there.

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Joe Gagill in Monticello, New York

18 months ago

Bluetea in Texas said: Wow! I would be the size of a prize winning hog if I lived there.

Pizza's done Blue. Get off the computer and come out of your room. Hope you like pepperoni on one side and broccoli on the other.

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