hard to find someone who will hire coming out of school

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DNL in Phoenix, Arizona

59 months ago

jumper in Mesa, Arizona said: I am at rsi in phoenix and the hvac industry in az seems to be big out here so I have my fingers crossed.

It is big but there are also to many HVAC/R techs for the amount of jobs so alot of the companies won't touch you without minimum 2-3yrs field experience,something the schools don't tell you. I'm not saying you won't get a job but i highly suggest looking on your own and not relying on the school to find you one,i know my school sure isn't doing anything to help any of us out. They claim a high placement rate but they don't mention that means they just find you a job,it could be flipping burgers though and as far as the govt cares it counts towards thier successful placement rate. Good luck to you though,i hope you find something.

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GlennM Quality Technical Training Cent in North Las Vegas, Nevada

59 months ago

I have a friend that just graduated form the same school I did. He is now working at the Venetian...Las Vegas. He's starting out at 29.70 an hour...no Kidding! After a three month course. we just graduated on sep.1st. I got a job at a 17,000sft night club/theater on the strip. Starting out at 19.00 hour. Its all about how you market yourself you have sell yourself no one is going to do it for you. Tell them your the best at what you do tell them why they need you. you have to dress you resume up don't lie.. just dress it up to look nice if you now power tolls tell them you have an EXTENSIVE KNOWLEDGE of POWER tools. if you know one or two OSHA rules tell them you have KNOWLEDGE of OSHA rules & regulations...cause you do! Tell them you have have experince with hand tools.

Just sell your self.....And remember your the best out there ...list everything relevant in your resume" if you know plumbing at all list it..same with all other skills...and remember HVAC companies aren't the only ones to apply to. Try maintenance positions,hotels,motels,hospatials,apartments,state jobs(HVAC,Maintenance,)There's a ton of places to apply.

Good Luck To You All..
________________________________________

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Orienteering in Brevard, North Carolina

59 months ago

DNL in Phoenix, Arizona said: It is big but there are also to many HVAC/R techs for the amount of jobs so alot of the companies won't touch you without minimum 2-3yrs field experience,something the schools don't tell you.

As an employer who is growing I did want to give you my take on the situation. Trade Schools only prepare you with the very basics. It is very good information and I believe the education worthwhile. This trade is dynamic, has many facets and the schools do help you experience a few of these. What they do fail to tell you is that this trade requires passion. You have to invest in yourself and continue to gain knowledge through self study and networking with others in the field. Their are many mentors out there, willing to share their knowledge and expertise. You also have to genuninely like people and have good communication skills (yes, if you have bad hand writing, you may want to work on that too.) They also fail to tell you to learn who are the better companies in the community (those that practice good ethics and follow industry best practice) and that you should be reaching out to these from day one to develop a relationship with them and lean on their guidance and advice. Are we busy people? Yes, but we are first and foremost problem solvers and have a passion for people, so we always have time. Afterall, we are the ones who will continue to train and mentor you after your graduation, we can best tell you how to develop the skills you will need. And when we consistently hear from you, we begin to recognize your drive and your passion. We recognize the efforts you are putting forth to better prepare yourself for our employment opportunities. You are in a good position, not having to unlearn bad habits. But we do need experienced persons in place to mentor and support you for our customer's benefit as well as your professional growth.

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Mike in Isehara, Japan

59 months ago

Id have to disagree somewhat with orienteering in North Carolina. Yes, you are correct that you do need passion for the trade. I now have several NATE certs and Im working on others. The part about genuinely like people is a bit of a stretch. I dont think you have to like the so much, you just have to have a good temperment, and be a good listener. Many customers are straight up A-holes. Cycle through a few of them and youll loose that passion for people B.S. real fast. You dont have to like them, just be able to stay calm, after all, your the one in control of the situation, the stupid customer usually cant fix squat. There are also many in the trade who are backstabbers or azzkissers and who dont want to work. You mention "reaching out" Well reaching out these days involves major azz kissing for some people. We dont need any more of that, what we need, as you said, are people with a passion for work. Work involves physical labor and self study. Be loyal to your boss. You make it sound to easy. Im afraid the real world aint like that.

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DNL in Phoenix, Arizona

59 months ago

I was a Land Surveyor for 12 years and loved it so i know about needing to have passion for your job but when companies won't look at you unless you have 5+ years experience it's kinda hard to show you really do want to work. If a future employer wanted to call my previous bosses up they would all say that i'm a hard worker,on time(usually early),drug free and very loyal to the company,however since i don't have 5+ years experience in the HVAC field they never find that out since they won't give me the time of day. I also am clean cut and have good handwriting. I'm so sick of hearing these companies complaining that they can't find any good employees nowdays,maybe if they gave someone a chance and actually paid decent they might get a long lasting,good employee.

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Orienteering in Brevard, North Carolina

59 months ago

I agree with Mike in that listening is a great skill, but you will get more combative customers over the phone than you will in person. Those you get in person usually have a real gripe (usually because their consumer confidence is low for a good reason.)

We have made it a practice to hire at least one "apprentice" a year, sometimes two or three (depending on climate and economy.) So let me quantify what the last five years have brought us from the trade schools (and why the young man from Chicago was correct about saying..it is who you know, the difference is that you can make those relationships, they do not need to be existing.)

Five years ago, we hired three. Two were straight A students, one was a C student. The C had great "outside" references, had been in contact with us. Of the A students, one has decided he is not capable of performing in this industry (he is out of trades all together.) The second straight A, is personable, likable and after 5 years is still only a clean and check guy. This is his comfort level, he has not grown even with constant encouragement. Disappointing, but customers like him and have confidence. The C student, in 5 short years, has developed to be our best tech, even above our 20y veterens. He has real passion, he does his homework and is always eager to learn. He has some great contacts throughout our industry and has made real suggestions to help grow the company. He contacted us when he was making the decision to go into trade school, stayed in contact with us, and he is a very valuable asset and because we do not want to loose him, we compensate him based on what he provides us, not the limited years of experience. Yes, he is that "gem" we all wish for. The other years since that we have hired from school, most have developed quickly. A few have opted to go to other parts of the world, and we still support them from afar. Running out of posting space, but short lesson, there are ways to maximize your zeal

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Mike in Japan

59 months ago

All this likeability and touchy feely stuff is a bunch of B.S. if you ask me. Perhaps I have been around the government too long, but I tell you from my experiences, when it comes to many employers, they dont care what you know. Thats part of the problem with the industry. The people in charge are the wrong people. Allot of them never even worked in HVAC! They look down on people who work hard, because to them, that is stupid. To them, what is smart, is kissing the azz and finding ways not to work. They think that is using your head. I have no respect for these people and they pick up on it, so they dis you at the interview. What needs to happen in the HVAC industry is this-

Bring back the real work ethic. Put the young people through the works, work them hard but reward them. If they dont like it, then they step. This is a simple process of weeding out the good from the bad.

You must do the time before becoming a manager. A degree means nothing in the trades.

Require techs to get certified. This will force them to study up on their own. Reward those who make the cut.

Start techs off on minimum wage or a little higher. Some will argue that this will turn everybody off to the trade. So whats the option, what we have now? The wages are high but nobody will hire unless he is some Mr. likeability A-hole with no skills or a mechanical engineer. That aint working. Start them off low, work their way up fast, all the while learning the craft. Give everybody a chance. Ive seen some guys out of jail who were hard workers.

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nodak in Albert Lea, Minnesota

58 months ago

in regards to trades and age. trades aren't that bad but you have to realize and accept you better be willing to move into quasi management someday unless you still want to be turning wrenches when your 65.

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James in Malden, Massachusetts

57 months ago

Has anyone heard of Kaplan in Charlestown MA? I call them and tell them I'm interested in the HVAC program, and they tell me that HVAC certification takes about 1 and 1/2 years with job placement after hands on training. After reading this I'm not sure it's worth it. I've got a feeling entry level HVAC jobs in Boston rare. I mean...how are you supposed to get experience if no one gives you the chance?
They are giving me a tour tomorrow. I'm going to keep what I read on here in mind when I talk to them.

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Daniel Marky in Phoenix, Arizona

57 months ago

James in Malden, Massachusetts said: Has anyone heard of Kaplan in Charlestown MA? I call them and tell them I'm interested in the HVAC program, and they tell me that HVAC certification takes about 1 and 1/2 years with job placement after hands on training. After reading this I'm not sure it's worth it. I've got a feeling entry level HVAC jobs in Boston rare. I mean...how are you supposed to get experience if no one gives you the chance?
They are giving me a tour tomorrow. I'm going to keep what I read on here in mind when I talk to them.

I don't know about jobs in Boston but i just finished hvac school after 1 year and can say do not listen to what they tell you,they will promise you the world and get you nothing. The school i went to is still telling the new students that they will all get jobs after graduation even after no one from my class has found a job. I have my Universal Cert and in this economy no company is looking to hire a newbie,atleast here in Phoenix. I'm sure not all schools lie and i'm sure many do actually try and get thier students jobs but be very wary and do alot of research on your own before you waste all your money. Just my 2cents. Best of luck in whatever you decide.

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James in Malden, Massachusetts

57 months ago

Its amazing when you do some research and find out the details they don't want you to know. I'll bear that in mind.

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Mike in Fujisawa, Japan

57 months ago

Some of these schools are charging 10000 USD for training. Thats criminal. You can pick up the EPA card in a weekend. Pick up any good HVAC-R book and mentor under somebody. Take the NATE exams. Its all I needed. Some people need to be spoon fed. If your one of those types, I suggest you look elsewhere. If you can do it on your own and really love learning about it, I dont see why you need a school. Only thing I can think of is maybe for safety issues. There are some programs out there that are cheap, sponsored by the city, state or whatever, I come across them occasionally. Be careful about some bootcamp b.s. or all that. Hit up Amazon.com for the best HVAC-R books. There is one I used to study and basically memorized the whole book. RSES has some outstanding DVDs also. What it boils down to is that the sh-t is really pretty basic but its tough work. You have to be aware of safety also at al times.

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mydanno in Litchfield Park, Arizona

57 months ago

Daniel Marky in Phoenix, Arizona said: I don't know about jobs in Boston but i just finished hvac school after 1 year and can say do not listen to what they tell you,they will promise you the world and get you nothing. The school i went to is still telling the new students that they will all get jobs after graduation even after no one from my class has found a job. I have my Universal Cert and in this economy no company is looking to hire a newbie,atleast here in Phoenix. I'm sure not all schools lie and i'm sure many do actually try and get thier students jobs but be very wary and do alot of research on your own before you waste all your money. Just my 2cents. Best of luck in whatever you decide.

Hey Dan
I am in phoenix as well and I was looking at possibly going to one of the local schools but have a few questions. Can you email me at dsalazar88 at gmail . com
Thanks
Dan

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steve in Thomaston, Georgia

56 months ago

It is stressful trying to find work in this field (with a company), but I'm gonna give you all some game. If I had known that you had to have a perfect driving record, I would have never entered the field lol. But be that as it may, I went to school, paid 3000 dollars to learn, and ran with it. Fortunately for me, my instructor was also a licensed contractor with a successful business. I did my externship with him and he liked my work ethic and hired me on afterwards. He doesn't call me much anymore for work, but I learned 10yrs experiencein 2working with him, getting paid a little for a lot of work, but eventually tapping into my own clientel and making big dough. After applying with a thousand companies, I decided that I would go out on my own and the rest is history. I have my own business and by the way, if you are a good tech and U KNOW IT, just start your own business. In a lot of states you dont need a contractor's license to start a business. DO YOUR HOMEWORK,STOP CRYING, AND START HUSTLING. Thats what these azzbackwards companies are doing. GET MONEY.

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PDSmith in Surprise, Arizona

56 months ago

I'm currently two months from graduating RSI with (so far) honors, top tech, 100% in every class, tho I'm doing what I can now to prepare for the opportunity at a job, it may not be enough.

As populations in cities age and people retire jobs are created, these jobs may require experienced HVAC techs, if companies don't take on rookies then where will experienced jobs come from?

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matt in Fayetteville, North Carolina

55 months ago

I'm trying to find entry level work in the hvac industry. I'm living in Fayetteville, NC. I have a 1 year vocational diploma for hvac & a 1 year vocational diploma for electrical. I have sections 608 & 609 cfc certifications. While I went to trade school for 2 years I worked as a part-time hvac helper in a commercial/industrial environment. I'm trying to get a pick-up, tools, lap top, and some competency exams. I also need to better prepare for the test given by each potential employer.I need to know how to get free info on codes, regulations, and proper ways of doing hvac work so I don't forget what I have learned so far. I've been watching instructional videos on youtube. I'm trusting and believing in Christ to open doors for me soon. I've applied to every entry level position I found through hvacagent.com & many job search engines as well as filling out applications.

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JERONE32 in Fort Washington, Maryland

53 months ago

HAS ANYONE EVER HEARD OF A SCHOOL CALLED ATI?

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ghettoverb in Casper, Wyoming

52 months ago

JERONE32 in Fort Washington, Maryland said: HAS ANYONE EVER HEARD OF A SCHOOL CALLED ATI?

i graduated from there three months ago if you would like to ask me about it email me at ghettoverb@hotmail.com this thing won't let me type the truth its too much so yeah email me and i will let you know.

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Lonely Contractor in Fresno, California

51 months ago

I've enjoyed everyones comments and wish you all the best. I have a few suggestions to help you all with your pursuits of entering the HVAC field. As most of you have already finished or will be soon finishing your school do not expect that you will be paid for having that education. Without experience you can not do many of the tasks required. You can not trouble shoot, change out, and in most cases even properly communicate with customers. I do mostly residential repair about 98% of my business is that and when I send a tech out to someone's house there are things they can not say and ways they can not act even if the customer is talking and acting that way (not just inappropriate behavior but things like saying, "your system is old")Little things like this are learned from experience. You will have to pay the piper and work for minimum wage or a little above it until you prove yourself. I always hire recent grads and interview about 60 to find one that isn't the things I don't want them to be more than one that has all the experience. Attitude, ability to learn, personable, easy to talk to, humble, and admits that the education they received is only a necessary step are some of the major points I look for. I have had guys come out and work for me for free for a week because they were so desperate to find a job, and those guys thought they were hard workers, smart, tough, etc. but by the end of the week they always say there isn't enough money in the world to get them to keep up in the field. Too bad they didn't come work a little before the went to school. If you are not smart, have a hard time keeping your temper, and find it difficult to talk to people then work on those areas before you apply. Nobady wants to admit they are a dime a dozen, but that is what new HVAC grads are. Work on your people skills, and be willing to work from the bottom up. If you can not do this then you had better have some contacts.

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New HVAC guy in Elkton, Maryland

51 months ago

Lonely Contractor is exactly right. I drove Tractor Trailer for 14yrs, and wanted a change. I went and got my EPA cert, and started a apprenticeship. I then started putting resumes in with companies. Not one call in 6 months. I knew that being 39yr old ex trucker with no schooling had everything to do with it. I redid my resume to include i would work for free for 10 working days. 2 weeks later i was carrying nitrogen tanks and vacuum pumps onto roofs for techs. 2 weeks after that i was hired on as a install helper. Now i am riding in service till my apprenticeship starts back up in sept.

My father did HVAC before he passed in 1989. I had a pretty good idea of what i was getting into when i started into it. The work ethic that was taught to me by my father is the only reason i broke into this industry. No schools teach that! You either have it or you don't!

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ghouck1@verizon.net in Chalfont, Pennsylvania

51 months ago

wade carter in philadelphia pa in Bensalem, Pennsylvania said: I am a 41year old hard working adult with a back ground in carpentry, plumbing , and alittle electrical. worked building ships , yard closed. wanted a career change, went to school , cant find job to get me started in this new career, not job but career, why is it so hard if there are so many hvac jobs

I am hiring please e-mail me ghouck1@verizon.net
Hope to see you tomorrow night.

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Goverment Funds Wasted in Yonkers, New York

50 months ago

HVAC training is a scam there is no placement assistance companys have no interest in hiring someone without minimun 2 to 3 years experience these schools are promising the world to students and once your out the door you are on your own.the goverment carreer centers directing people from unemployment are just as bad no way should you direct someone close to 40 or over for a physicaly punishing job I am 46 and no way can I climb ladders or crawl into attics I wonder if some of these centers are getting kickbacks?there should be an investigation into this obvious waste of retraining funds.

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Stefen_G in West Mifflin, Pennsylvania

49 months ago

Herre are couple stats worth looking at. "The HVACR Industry is at the moment 367.000 people short nation wide, and projected to loose another 60% within the next ten years. the adverage age of a/an HVACR tech is 40" this comes from the trade mag from the union I get every month. And I really believe that is true, we cannot even fill our apprenticeship programs every year.
One would think that the lack of tech and more work would cause the wage to increase, well it does for your employer not for you. I got into the union only because it is the only place short of selfemployment where you are going to make a good living. think about this your employer may charge as much as $90.00 or more for your labor. of which you are getting what $18.00, and then ofter 8 hrs and on weekends he is charging overtime rate for you and you are still making $18.00 so he is making more and you are making less. it is almost as if you are paying your employer for working there. I REFUSE TO WORK NIGHTS, WEEKENDS, AND HOLIDAYS FOR STRAIGHT PAY! trust me your employer doesn't either thats why he has you, and is making more for your sweat than you are.
with the bad pay, bad or no bennies, no sick days, not retirement, it is no wonder the numbers I have quoted are like they are.
I have been a HVACR tech now for 22 years, and I am telling you if you want to make a real living and be respected, you either need to work for yourself, or you need to be in a Union shop. these mom and pop companies are in it to make mom and pop money not you, rememeber you are not the one going to retire of the profits of the place, so do not kill yourself, you still get paid the same weather you do or not

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Orienteering in Brevard, North Carolina

49 months ago

Stefen_G: So much of your arguement is ignorance. Granted, I do not know the companies who were willing to hire you or their practices but $90/hr does not cover the cost of running a HVAC business in many markets. In fact, it is not a wonder they can't offer you a fair living wage, benies, and regular work. Yes...HVAC has a low cost of entry but a successful company does not have a low cost operation. You may actually be surprised at what we actually need to charge to get a 4% net profit.

I do agree that this industry is short handed, and its attrition rate is enourmous...and this is sometimes the fault of the small businesses unable or unaware of how they contribute to the problem. HVAC as an industry is in state of flux right now....and I have said it here many months earlier in this thread. The basic problem with tech schools (in general cause there are some great ones) is they do not prepare the person to know the full scope of the industry. I routinely get requests for our apprenticeship program, but they truly decline after a full explaination of what we expect after that 4 years. And many do not realize you really have to be a people person, with communication skills, and a real desire to help and "fix the customer."

We will hire techs right out of school, but they have to demonstrate a passion and a basic ability. They also have to understand that they have much more training to do and willing to invest, this industry while we have cheapened it ourselves really is the master of plumbing and electrical as well (and this means, realizing where you draw the line to local rules and regulations--shoot--shall I say it, we have the potential of making people sick or much worse, kill them.) Tech school is not a turn key to a new career...period. It does take extracurricular networking and hopefully finding a mentor. Then it can truly be rewarding, both in feeling good about what you do day in and day out but financially as well.

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Mike in Sagamihara, Japan

49 months ago

HVAC or Refrigeration maintenance is in a state of flux right now because allot of the Service managers never spent any time or enough time learning the trade. The technician is only a commodity to be exploited, just like the sales team and marketing team, call center. The service man doesnt get any credit and gets burned out from it. Its mostly a management/touch feely problem. Everybody wants to be the manager these days, and get the money.

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Mike in Sagamihara, Japan

49 months ago

Also, for those of you having a hard time finding HVAC work, look outside that. Food service equipment companies need people that know refrigeration. There are dozens of them out there. Be prepared for long hours and service calls though. speciality shop display case mfgs, Ice cream makers, Grocery store display cases, beverage dispensers, reach in coolers, etc. Some of the use distributors to handle their maintenance, so you can hit them up as well. Also hotels/resorts need refer techs, as well as cargo ships and cruise ships. Allot of refer companies need techs year around. Refrigeration and HVAC is a little different, but RSES can get you trained on that. From what Im seeing here HVAC is just not the place to be, I dont know, but I think Im staying away from that.

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Jeff in Foxboro, Massachusetts

49 months ago

I was wondering if it is possibe to get into the HVAC/R Field with a CORI?I went to schooland workedhard,did well, but now I find out I can't get a job!All I realy need is someone to giveme a chance,and the will NEVER be sorry the hired me!

I am a good guy,and an honest guy,just part of an unfortunate situation, and I realy need some help finding a way into the field.

Thanks,

Jeff

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Mike in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania

49 months ago

The way I see it, there are several problems in the HVAC field, one of which is the fact that the so-called "trade schools" are mostly a huge scam. They sign you up for student loans totalling tens of thousands, then when you graduate (even at the top of your class) you're lucky if you can find a job at all, let alone one that pays enough to re-pay your student loans. This isn't limited to HVAC; my fiance went to beauty school and is facing the exact same problem. Once they have your money, they don't care whether you get a job or not. Their "placement services" are a lie as well; mine (Triangle Tech in Greensburg, PA) supposedly sent out a bunch of resumes for me and guess what- I never got ONE phone call.
The other problem is that the HVAC companies are mostly scam-artists as well. They charge astronomical rates to the customer, pay the technician chicken feed, and pocket the rest. I'm all for making money but cheating your employees is another matter entirely. And now, with the job-seeking market well above the saturation-point, they want to hire only techs with 5 years or more experience and pay them crap... because they CAN, and they KNOW it. They, like most other companies, are taking advantage of the recession to low-ball employees. Pay in this field, especially considering the amount of knowledge a tech needs, is pathetic to say the least. Honestly, given my personal experiences and those I've been reading on here, I would advise anyone thinking about going into HVAC to find something else. All you're going to do is wear out your body and get filthy every day, and you'll be lucky to make enough money to make ends meet. Not worth it at all in my opinion...

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MIKE in Yokohama, Japan

49 months ago

Well put. Austrialia is in need of HVAC techs I hear. Allot of growth in Asia (not Japan or korea) but pay is cheap there.

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Bryan in Inwood, West Virginia

48 months ago

I fully understand the aggravation from seeing every HVAC job asking for 3 plus years. I was an aerospace ground equipment mechanic in the Air Force for five years. Troubleshooting isn't hard for me soon as I learn the sequence of operation. I have already repaired 10 residential air conditioners and a refrigerator this summer while I am taking apprenticeship classes. The gi bill paid for my trade school and my AAS degree, so I wasn't scammed. I knew I wanted to be in HVAC long before I got out of the military. We did do some hvac type work on our portable diesel a/c units and heaters. It makes me happy knowing I have taken a few calls away from the local companies who talk a ton crap about how busy they are, but aren't hiring. That is why I am taking a small business course and working for myself here soon enough. You don't need to be a genius to do this kind of work, but every company seems to think it will take years to be in your own van. What they fail to realize is the equipment may be new to me, but troubleshooting is not. My friend I was stationed with got out a year before I did, went to work for an HVAC company, and was in his own van in 3 months. I have plenty of experienced HVAC techs to ask for help when and if I do need it. For those of you who are unemployed create an account on hvac-talk.com, get your pro membership, because there is much to learn from those guys on there. The bit about trying to work for free just to get in the door doesn't work either, so for those trying don't waste your time with that. I have a friend who works for himself in HVAC and he has maybe called me to come with him 3 times in the last year. I never slowed him down when I was with him and there were times I found the problem before he did. I don't care what career you go to school for, finding a job will not be easy in this economy. Everyone is looking for experienced only because they don't want to train anyone.

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HVACTipz in Aurora, Colorado

48 months ago

Bryan Said: "It makes me happy knowing I have taken a few calls away from the local companies who talk a ton crap about how busy they are, but aren't hiring."

This is exactly what you need to do if no companies are hiring. I can't tell you how many times I have received offers to work for HVAC places after they found out I fixed problems for some of their customers. You need to ask people what they pay to make sure their ac/Ref work and then let them know you will do a better job at a cheaper price. Side note: YOU HAVE TO DO A GOOD JOB! If these HVAC places do not want to help you you have to dip into their customer base and take it for yourself. Most of the reasons they wont hire is because you look to ghetto or they cant afford you. It will always be some BS excuse. Your best bet is to join a Union or Apprenticeship through the Dept of Labor. Don't give up. By the time you are 69 you could have your own set of employees and HVAC business to pay for your retirement. You just need to have 5 or ten year plans that you can adhere to.

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suzi in Irving, Texas

48 months ago

Call Kelly's Heating and AC in Dallas TX. www.kellysac.com

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John in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania

48 months ago

Was looking at the above link, and thought of another problem... too many HVAC companies are trying to do too much, i.e. plumbing, electrical, etc. What happened to "do one thing and do it well"? The company above says they ONLY do HVAC... that seems to be a foreign concept in many areas, and creates problems for prospective employees in that the company wants someone who can do plumbing, electricity, gas piping AND HVAC! How many people out there are REALLY qualified to do ALL of these jobs? Stick with heating, A/C and refrigeration... if you do a good job and earn a good reputation, there's no need to have so many irons in the fire...

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Mike in Isehara, Japan

48 months ago

sometimes you got to leave your comfort zone.

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john in Port Orange, Florida

47 months ago

Well mike, if you are telling us to move to japan then forget about it

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Derek in Valrico, Florida

47 months ago

John, they are looking for people who can do all those things, because they are REQUIRED to install a unit, if you can not work electricity how can you wire or troubleshoot a unit that runs based on electricity? If you don't know plumbing how can you run a drain line so it will not leak or otherwise back up into the unit? If you don't know gas piping how can you fix a gas leak to a furnace or install a furnace? HVAC Is not JUST working on the unit, if that's what you think it is, that is rather narrow-minded. They are just things that actually tie into the job of installation and repair.

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Tyler in Downers Grove, Illinois

47 months ago

I am looking into getting my hvac cert to do some work on the side any suggestions on how to go about this after completing school?

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broke and in debt in Wood River, Illinois

47 months ago

Paul in Topeka, Kansas said: I think the dude you're referring to is really a 'dudette' (Helen), but your point is well taken.

The thing that I keep wondering about as I read this board, is why all of these people that are coming out of school with lots of hvac training, and no job opportunities, aren't doing the same thing (starting their own businesses).[QUOTE]

i have been thinking about doing that exact thing. and i want too very badly - believe me.
but what it takes - is alot of MONEY!!!
you have to have insurance.
you have to have tools (you just have too)
you need at the very least - just to do light residential service - besides all of your basic tools like thermometers, meters, screw drivers,nut drivers, small sheet metal tools, wiring tools,ect... (at least 2 or 3 toolboxes stuffed with a few thousand dollars worth of tools just for a BASIC set) ... you need a recovery machine, a vacuum pump, an oxy/acetelene torch rig, some ladders, a truck to haul it all around in, refrigerants of course, AND a LINE OF CREDIT AT THE PARTS HOUSE lol.
not to mention a secure place to keep it all - also keeping in mind you don't want to just leave tanks of refrigerant sitting around some hot garage or in a service vehicle on hot summer days lol.

but i completely agree with 314 pipe welder!
my school in st louis also told me they had "98% job placement within 6 months of graduating" and that they were going to help me above and beyond in finding a job and this that and the other, and every bit of it was just plain old B/S to get me to borrow 25 grand and give it to them.
this kind of sh*t should be illegal.

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broke and in debt in Wood River, Illinois

47 months ago

314 Pipe welder in Chicago, Illinois said: The college that I went to is a non-profit organization so funding money is no problem at all. Ranken is considered to be the the best technical college in the midwest of the united states. This college is nationally accredited so my intentions were to go to tthis school and receive a great job when completed. So I still find it hard to believe that students from that tradeschool are getti ng jobs with companies with no problem. This HVAC market is a matter of who you know and not what you know to get your foot in the door. Maybe your just taking up for the schol being you are apart of the staff there and you just wants to defend the school. That's okay but you just have to face reality that for the most part this HVAC is a scheme and that companies stereotypes others and that isn't fair to someone who is young and trying to do something positive with their life and want to be successful. I could have done negative things in my lifetime but I chose not to because I have toprovide for my family and then when you doing good deeds in your lifetime and it's like the doors are constantly closing and nothing isn't opening then you look at life like things are just failing.

you went to ranken?
lol i did too - and i feel the exact same way you do.
imagine that LOL

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Mike in Yokohama, Japan

47 months ago

"to get me to borrow twenty five grand and give it to them."

Dude,

Your to blame if you even paid two thousand dollars for any of that crap. twenty five grand? what was you thinking? You can get all the NATE certifications and the RSES CM status for under fifteen hundred $. Shoot, I would go buy a junked system and disassemble/assemble it 50 times, read the service manual and take an exam and be just as good as some school trained tech.Your right, that is criminal but you just as bad for buying into that one. Id never pay any of those people squat.

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Paul in Topeka, Kansas

47 months ago

broke and in debt in Wood River, Illinois said:

Yeah, I hear you. As I read your post I was thinking about all the stuff you didn't mention: A squedge tool (however you spell that), clamp meter, a stomp shear and a brake and a place to put them, pipe threader, a computer, a business phone, multiple gauge sets, and most of all, CUSTOMERS.

I'm sure it all sounds impossible, and I don't mean to minimize the difficulty, but you shouldn't maximize it, either. Anything can be done if you can just figure out how. For instance, you probably had classmates in HVAC school that are in the same shape you're in. Maybe you could pool your resources and get something started. You might have to ride together for a while, but if you're both rookies, that wouldn't be all bad.

Maybe you have a relative that could front you some money to get started (be prepared to pay them well for taking a chance like that.)

Maybe you could find someone who is already in the business, but is getting older, and is ready to slow down, or get out of it entirely. The advantage of that situation is that you could have someone who you could call up and ask questions while you're learning the ropes, AND you could inherit a customer base, too. Having a mentor is one of the best things you can do to increase your chances of success.

The thing is, you have to be creative, and you've got to want it bad enough to do whatever it takes to get it. If all you want is for someone to give you a job, and to work your 40 every week, and never think about work from Friday afternoon to Monday morning, then you don't have enough ambition to pull it off. Only you can know that.

The truth is, despite all you hear about the terrible economy, and how nobody's hiring, and all the other excuses, America is still a land of opportunity for those who are willing to try hard enough.

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Nick L in Medford, Massachusetts

47 months ago

Mike in Yokohama, Japan said: "to get me to borrow twenty five grand and give it to them."

Dude,

Your to blame if you even paid two thousand dollars for any of that crap. twenty five grand? what was you thinking? You can get all the NATE certifications and the RSES CM status for under fifteen hundred $. Shoot, I would go buy a junked system and disassemble/assemble it 50 times, read the service manual and take an exam and be just as good as some school trained tech.Your right, that is criminal but you just as bad for buying into that one. Id never pay any of those people squat.

Porter & Chester institute wants $27,000 for their 14 month program and plays up this 'shortage' in HVAC. The admissions reps are more like used car salespeople. They opened two new campuses in Massachusetts but have no career placement office but say you are eligible for lifetime career placement.

The reality is that there are no jobs for inexperience HVAC techs or for that matter anyone in the trades without experience. Those who are in their 20's getting all the $30 an hour jobs know someone to get them in.

I was almost sucked into the trade school scam from all the kool aid they dish out regarding BLS (bureau of lies) statistics and forecasts. Check out unemployment rates in HVAC & other trades and unemployment rates for those with BA degrees in regular white collar professions

Too all those who are thinking of doing this -- RUN THE OTHER WAY. Get a real college degree in a field that is in demand--- Healthcare, Biotech or IT.

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tom in Wood River, Illinois

47 months ago

Mike in Fujisawa, Japan said: Some of these schools are charging 10000 USD for training. Thats criminal. You can pick up the EPA card in a weekend. Pick up any good HVAC-R book and mentor under somebody. Take the NATE exams. Its all I needed. Some people need to be spoon fed. If your one of those types, I suggest you look elsewhere. If you can do it on your own and really love learning about it, I dont see why you need a school. Only thing I can think of is maybe for safety issues. There are some programs out there that are cheap, sponsored by the city, state or whatever, I come across them occasionally. Be careful about some bootcamp b.s. or all that. Hit up Amazon.com for the best HVAC-R books. There is one I used to study and basically memorized the whole book. RSES has some outstanding DVDs also. What it boils down to is that the sh-t is really pretty basic but its tough work. You have to be aware of safety also at al times.

yeah who needs schools for anything. people should just read books until they're ten years old and then go to work. lol
yeah HVAC is just all basic.
especially the control circuitry of high efficiency furnaces and larger commercial systems.
no one should need any schooling for that.
lol
tear one unit down and re-assemble it 4 or 5 times and you know everything there is to know about HVAC.
lol
you sound like one of those douchebags who think they know a whole lot but don't really know much at all lol

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Mike in Isehara, Japan

47 months ago

Know enough not to pay 27 thousand for a school, thats for sure. Call me what you want, but thats just straight up dumb. You can learn everything you just said on the job. In some cultures they dont even have schools, they do it all by the mentor system. So your saying in a 3 month school your going to learn all that? Save the name calling for yourself, you still gots lots to learn. You took and passed any RSES exam? They are tough, you dont learn all that from just study.

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tom in Wood River, Illinois

47 months ago

who said anything about a "3 month program"?
i know i didn't lol.
i have a college degree in HVAC/refrigeration, a two year associate of technology degree.
i had to take all of the other classes required for an associates degree as well. you know - algebra, physics, business, composition 1&2, ect,ect.... we didn't just study hvac either, we had mostly shop time every day actually. albeit it was fairly unorganized with a lot of immature 18-24 year olds in it, but it was there if you wanted to work on units.
if you're going to cry about name calling i'd suggest you don't start it in the first place. but then that would take a certain amount of common sense and an IQ of over 25 to understand, so i guess i'm wasting my breath lol.

"some cultures don't even have schools" huh? LOL
yeah that really sounds like a brilliant idea lol.
who needs to go to college for anything?
LOLOLOL

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Mike in Isehara, Japan

47 months ago

Your just talking out your azz. I have a degree also, none of it is applicable to the trade. The OJT I have done with many MNCs and the gov is where I learned and through trade organizations. You can even have allot of your training paid for by the company or distributor if you know how to do it. In Japan for example, they hire fresh people that know nothing at all and teach them on the job, it must be working because your buying allot of what they make. I think you need to leave your little comfie zone and get out and see how things really are.

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tom in Wood River, Illinois

47 months ago

i'm "just talking out of my azz"?
are you for real here? or are you just trolling this forum for a few laughs. seriously you really can't be this idiotic can you?
maybe you just don't understand what i'm saying.
i have an associates degree, with a technical specialization in HVAC. HVAC was the majority of what i studied and worked on in college. explain to me how that is "not applicable to the trade" LOL
i am full well aware that there are OJT programs and apprenticeships at some employers.
and yes i'm also aware that american consumers purchase products manufactured in other countries.
i'm thinking you're either just a troll, or maybe english is your second language and you don't really understand what you're reading too much.
i don't know maybe you dropped out of school at 9 years old and you really are this slow lol.
either way i'm just going to ignore you now.
bye.
lol

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Mike in Isehara, Japan

47 months ago

I sometimes think that the individual that said getting a degree in something un-HVAC related is right, there are just too many morons with low self esteem in this industry. This is the second time I have encountered one here, the other one contradicted everything he said when I challenged him on any issue and it just turned into some childish back and forth crap. You just keep repeating the same thing, You have this or that, or you know this or that, but dont really back it up with any substance because you dont have the experience. I asked you if you had taken any of the more challenging RSES exams, no answer. I still think your at a very basic level and wish to remain there.

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Nick L in Medford, Massachusetts

47 months ago

Mike in Isehara, Japan said: I sometimes think that the individual that said getting a degree in something un-HVAC related is right, there are just too many morons with low self esteem in this industry. This is the second time I have encountered one here, the other one contradicted everything he said when I challenged him on any issue and it just turned into some childish back and forth crap. You just keep repeating the same thing, You have this or that, or you know this or that, but dont really back it up with any substance because you dont have the experience. I asked you if you had taken any of the more challenging RSES exams, no answer. I still think your at a very basic level and wish to remain there.

I already have a degree in something 'un HVAC' I even have an advanced degree. I have been unemployed for a few months but have over $100,000 in savings and more money from profit on real estate sale so I can afford to retrain.

With that being said, I can smell BS a mile away and find it almost criminal the lies that these 'trade schools' are giving these kids age 18-24 and how the state unemployment office is also dishing out this kool aid as well and encouraging 'retraining' at many of these fly by night schools like Porter & Chester, Kaplan and other scam trade schools that charge over $10,000.

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Nick L in Medford, Massachusetts

47 months ago

Mike in Isehara, Japan said: Your just talking out your azz. I have a degree also, none of it is applicable to the trade. The OJT I have done with many MNCs and the gov is where I learned and through trade organizations. You can even have allot of your training paid for by the company or distributor if you know how to do it. In Japan for example, they hire fresh people that know nothing at all and teach them on the job, it must be working because your buying allot of what they make. I think you need to leave your little comfie zone and get out and see how things really are.

OJT really doesn't exist much here in the USA when unemployment is 9.6% (and higher in trades & construction) when they know they can find someone with the exact experience they are looking for in terms of industry, certifications & other knowledge. It is even harder if you are older (note that age discrimination in the USA begins in your 30's now) and not some twenty something who has generations of family in this business

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