Why are resumes still requested in Word format, rather than in PDF formats?

I'm just wondering about this, because I have had bad experiences where someone would request my resume in Word format, and then literally 'steal' my layout. I went on an interview, got the job, then saw that my resume was saved on their desktop. Wondering why my personal information was saved on a computer that was easily available to other employees, I opened it - one of the other assistants replaced my name and jobs with her information!

When I asked her about it, she said, 'Oh, how embarassing - I just loved your layout and format'. I won't get into why the HR department was so unprofessional about the lack of privacy, but that's another story for another day.

And aren't FREE versions of PDF/Adobe readers available for download all over the internet??

It concerns me that employers are so closed-minded with new software these days.

A lot of people in the business world are still very wary of new programs. Adobe Acrobat has been around for 10-20 years now and it is surprising that more offices haven't adopted it for resumes acceptances. In your office's case, try bringing the issue up with who ever handles the computers/tech side of the office, and maybe s/he can go about installing the program on everyone's computer. Offer to help people learn the program (which is easy!) to try to get them to get over their fears.

I will say that I've noticed that many tech/design/etc firms are more program friendly and do want resumes in pdf format. I think non-creative focused business still have a long way to go. :)

MorningGlory in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania said: I have had bad experiences where someone would request my resume in Word format, and then literally 'steal' my layout.....

Look at it this way. You could submit a .pdf version of your resume. Someone could print it and still steal your layout.

Your feelings are understandable, but you can't do much about it. Resume layouts aren't copyrighted.

MorningGlory said:
It concerns me that employers are so closed-minded with new software these days.

You should be more concerned that employers are closed-minded about training candidates on their software.

I applied to a local airline for a technical writing job. To my great surprised, the airline called me. It asked if I had experience with its software. I responded that I had several years of experience with PCs and Macs, including installing, uninstalling and reinstalling PC operating systems, and experience with multiple word processing software. I said I can learn their software. The HR person said the hiring manager did not want to train. The airline finally removed the opening after several weeks. It could have had its writer sooner if it would have given me a chance.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: Look at it this way. You could submit a .pdf version of your resume. Someone could print it and still steal your layout.

Your feelings are understandable, but you can't do much about it. Resume layouts aren't copyrighted.

You should be more concerned that employers are closed-minded about training candidates on their software.

Actually, if it were in PDF format the person could not alter the format (i.e.: put their name in place of yours) unless they had the professional version of Acrobat and had also left the document unlocked. PDF makes it harder for people to take your name out, put their name in and distribute your resume as though it were their own.

My employer trained me on their software, but only because it is proprietary. I couldn't go an take a class in their software or buy it off the shelf. If there is a way for you to obtain training in the software that a company is requiring you to use, then you need to get that training out of the way before you submit your resume. Because why should a company waste their time training you on software that you could buy and practice on at home when they could hire someone with the same skills as you who already knows the program? You have to stay competitive and not expect to be trained on job - many companies are not doing that anymore.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: Actually, if it were in PDF format the person could not alter the format (i.e.: put their name in place of yours) unless they had the professional version of Acrobat and had also left the document unlocked. PDF makes it harder for people to take your name out, put their name in and distribute your resume as though it were their own.

I guess I wasn't clear. My point is one can copy the format by printing the document and typing it from scratch. Or else one could scan the document.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: [W]hy should a company waste their time training you on software that you could buy and practice on at home when they could hire someone with the same skills as you who already knows the program?

I guess I wasn't clear, again. I did not list the particular software on my resume. The airline called me anyway. The airline wouldn't have called me if it wasn't interested in my background. And, here again, the airline could have had its technical writer sooner if it had given me a chance. It chose to wait. Its problem; not mine.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: I guess I wasn't clear. My point is one can copy the format by printing the document and typing it from scratch. Or else one could scan the document. I guess I wasn't clear, again. I did not list the particular software on my resume. The airline called me anyway. The airline wouldn't have called me if it wasn't interested in my background. And, here again, the airline could have had its technical writer sooner if it had given me a chance. It chose to wait. Its problem; not mine.

Right, your wording was a little fuzzy.

It might be more your problem if you are looking for a job immediately in that field, though. If you are not interested in becoming a technical writer in any capacity then you are absolutely correct in saying that it is not your problem that they were unwilling to train on the job. However, if you are interested in this field...then that's another story all together! :)

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: It might be more your problem if you are looking for a job immediately in that field, though. If you are not interested in becoming a technical writer in any capacity then you are absolutely correct in saying that it is not your problem that they were unwilling to train on the job. However, if you are interested in this field...then that's another story all together! :)

I had enough quals for them to call me, including aviation experience; ergo, they must have thought I was qualified for the job. It's as simple as that. Period. ;->

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: I had enough quals for them to call me, including aviation experience; ergo, they must have thought I was qualified for the job. It's as simple as that. Period. ;->

Um, I'm not trying to insult you. Period. I was merely pointing out that some professions require specialized software knowledge. It's good advice, in my own humble opinion, to brush up on as much industry specific/specialized software as possible when going into a job. For example, I'm looking to jump into a profession myself. I want to get into graphic design, so while I am getting the art and software knowledge I need for that field, I am working at a different job. No need to get huffy. It's just something that some people have to do before getting into another field. Clearly you're above that. Good luck in your job hunting.

You would have a point if I didn't have basic computer experience and/or common word processor experience, such as Word or WP. I had technical experience and writing background sufficient to rate a phone call. Software can be learned if one is given the chance. Just companies don't want to provide such chances. And that's my point.

Good luck with your plans.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: You would have a point if I didn't have basic computer experience and/or common word processor experience, such as Word or WP. I had technical experience and writing background sufficient to rate a phone call. Software can be learned if one is given the chance. Just companies don't want to provide such chances. And that's my point.

Good luck with your plans.

I realized that and agreed with you, actually, no one will train you on non-proprietary software. I lean toward the side of the company on that one. Why should they have to pay you to learn the same software that many applicants already know?

My point was that in order to stay competitive in a field where you might need to learn new software suites you have to go out on your own and take classes to learn them. Some places don't use windows office software as their writing tools. Many use Adobe tools. Like instead of using MS Publisher you use something like Adobe InDesign. Stuff like that. If you're unwilling to learn then you're just going to end up getting a lot of no's until you find the agency that does just use windows. It puts you at a disadvantage. I'm not trying to be rude, I'm just trying to be honest.

MorningGlory in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania said: I'm just wondering about this, because I have had bad experiences where someone would request my resume in Word format, and then literally 'steal' my layout. I went on an interview, got the job, then saw that my resume was saved on their desktop. Wondering why my personal information was saved on a computer that was easily available to other employees, I opened it - one of the other assistants replaced my name and jobs with her information!

When I asked her about it, she said, 'Oh, how embarassing - I just loved your layout and format'. I won't get into why the HR department was so unprofessional about the lack of privacy, but that's another story for another day.

And aren't FREE versions of PDF/Adobe readers available for download all over the internet??

It concerns me that employers are so closed-minded with new software these days.

I'm wondering if you "protect" your document and save it as "read-only" if that would be helpful?

I understand your point, but I don't think you understand mine. It's not an unwillingness to learn; it's an unwillingness to train when the company could. And, here again, that airline apparently kept looking for several more weeks before it found its technical writer, It could have given me a chance and had its writer sooner. Its problem.

I stand by my comments.

Once again, good luck with your plans.

dovey in Saint Louis, Missouri said: I'm wondering if you "protect" your document and save it as "read-only" if that would be helpful?

Still wouldn't matter. The recipient can print the document and use it as a template or form to prepare his/her document from scratch. Or, as I wrote, above, the printed document can be scanned.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: I realized that and agreed with you, actually, no one will train you on non-proprietary software. I lean toward the side of the company on that one. Why should they have to pay you to learn the same software that many applicants already know?

Actually, my wife's former law firm trained all new-hires on its software during their first few days, whether or not they knew it already. The firm also conducted periodic in-service training for updated software.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: Actually, my wife's former law firm trained all new-hires on its software during their first few days, whether or not they knew it already. The firm also conducted periodic in-service training for updated software.

Like I said above, if it is proprietary software (meaning, software that the company owns exclusively or created themselves) then it is not uncommon to receive on the job training. If it a common product, that can be learned on one's own or learned in a class at a college, then they likely won't train you in job for it.

In your wife's case they may have needed to do massive hiring right away and were willing to train. However, and I will stress this, that is not so usual anymore. Most of the companies I have worked with prefer not to train you, because 1.) it takes you away from the job the hired you for and 2.) even after you learned the new software you're still not an "expert" at it.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: I understand your point, but I don't think you understand mine. It's not an unwillingness to learn; it's an unwillingness to train when the company could. And, here again, that airline apparently kept looking for several more weeks before it found its technical writer, It could have given me a chance and had its writer sooner. Its problem.

I stand by my comments.

Once again, good luck with your plans.

The thing is that you cost the company money coming in if they have to train you. When they do that they are basically paying you to learn software that you could learn on your own time? It's a waste of their time and money. Also, when people are posting jobs online they are often doing so with a window of time in which to fill it. They probably had no problem what so ever having people who already work there cover the extra work load until they found the applicant that they did end up hiring.

The work place is changing. If you don't want to believe that and hold on to the hope that a company is going to hire you then pay you to learn off the shelf software then that is actually going to end up being a detriment to you finding a job. The companies, I assure you, could care less. If this is a job you're interested in then learn the programs on your own, if you can. If you're just putting obstacles in front of yourself (i.e.: they won't train me on the job) instead of getting down to business and filling in the gaps in your resume and experience then..start looking into other professions.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: The thing is that you cost the company money coming in if they have to train you. When they do that they are basically paying you to learn software that you could learn on your own time? It's a waste of their time and money.

I don't recall the job ad specifying software requirements - and, again, why would have I been called if it wasn't interested in my background.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: Also, when people are posting jobs online they are often doing so with a window of time in which to fill it.....

The job had been open for a few months.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: The work place is changing. If you don't want to believe that and hold on to the hope that a company is going to hire you then pay you to learn off the shelf software then that is actually going to end up being a detriment to you finding a job....

Please don't patronize me or lecture me. I'm fully aware the workplace is changing and I don't need you or anyone to advise me.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: [I]f it is proprietary software (meaning, software that the company owns exclusively or created themselves)....

Spare me the explanation. Perhaps you didn't read that I wrote I have several years of computer experience, on PC and Mac platforms. I understand the meaning of "proprietary software."

Continued, below....

Continued from above....

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: ....then it is not uncommon to receive on the job training. If it a common product, that can be learned on one's own or learned in a class at a college, then they likely won't train you in job for it.

There was no "massive hiring" going on in my wife's firm at that time. The software were primarily common Microsoft products, which most people know or should know. Nonetheless, despite any prior experience, the firm trained all new-hires on these products as part of their orientation.

Another firm I know gives new-hires an online Microsoft Office test, whether or not they have prior experience with Office. The firm does it to assess their knowledge and identify any areas which need training.

I appreciate your comments.

By going into Word's Tools>Options>Security, you can click a box to prevent modifications to your resume. I'm sorry your layout was used by someone too lazy or incompetent to make their own.

Here again, all anyone has to do is print a copy of the resume and type it from scratch while following the format, or scan it as text or Word document and fix the spacing.

Once again, resume layouts are not copyrighted. Resume formats are there for the taking all over the internet. Writers of resume books expect readers to cop their formats. As the expression goes, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Thank you all for your comments. I do understand that resumes, in any format, can be copied; this can not be prevented. This is something that is out of my control. I was just wondering why most employers still request word docs over pdf's - still doesn't make any sense to me. I just like the integrity of my resume being kept the way I created it.

But thank you all.

MorningGlory in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania said: I just like the integrity of my resume being kept the way I created it.

You didn't say if the incident happened during an interview or other pre-employment event. Nonetheless, that person was tacky to display your resume on her desktop and admit to you she was copping it.

Actually, some resume formats can be rather complex if I may play the devil's advocate. People in creative fields usually add their own touches to their resumes to capture the feeling of their site or portfolio. There are exceptions to the rule, Displaced.

I would be bothered if someone had my resume up and was entering their own information in on top of it. Which is what was happening if you care to read the original post. It's an invasion of privacy. If she liked it so much she could have asked Morning Glory to help her re-create it.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: [S]ome resume formats can be rather complex if I may play the devil's advocate. People in creative fields usually add their own touches to their resumes to capture the feeling of their site or portfolio. There are exceptions to the rule, Displaced.

Which rule, Lore? Your statement is fuzzy.

Lore said: I would be bothered if someone had my resume up and was entering their own information in on top of it. Which is what was happening if you care to read the original post.

Speaking of reading posts, Lore, if you haven't already, please read my original response to MorningGlory. I acknowledged her feelings - but stated she couldn't do much about it.

Lore said: It's an invasion of privacy. If she liked [MorningGlory's resume] so much she could have asked Morning()Glory to help her re-create it.

I agree. Did you not read my post, above, Lore, in which I wrote that the person exhibited very poor taste in displaying MorningGlory's resume on her desktop? I further agree with you that the person could have asked MorningGlory to help her with her resume.

Candidates' employment materials are often regarded as company property upon submission. There would be invasion of privacy if this other person did not have had rightful access to MorningGlory's personal information. But, once again, Lore, in case you did not read my earlier post, resume formats are not copyrighted. Accordingly, Lore, look below. You'll see ads for resume templates, a free resume builder and resume examples. Clearly, Lore, these advertisers expect people to copy their formats, use their templates and, perhaps, add their individual creative touches to them.

Finally, Lore, you needn't patronize me. You've already proven via your well-crafted remarks that you are smarter than me. ;->

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: You didn't say if the incident happened during an interview or other pre-employment event....

My bad. MorningGlory wrote the incident happened after she was hired. Nonetheless, it was tacky.

I would expect that your co-worker having any resume on her desktop, would eventually draw attention. It is tacky to take someone else's formatting, tacky to update your resume on company time, and a warning to you that she is not above claiming your work as her own.

Take it as a red flag.

Updating a resume on company time and on the company's computer is tacky in the extreme. So is saving a resume on the company's hard drive. Great point. I wouldn't be surprised if that person would take credit for the OP's work.

In the aviation business, there is a basic pilot resume format. The format sets forth information in a particular order. With few variations, professional pilots follow that format. They follow it because pilot recruiters expect to see information presented in that format. Pilots share resumes all the time. No one squawks if a pilot borrows another pilot's format.

OMO, but copying a resume format is no big deal.

Actually Displaced, I was giving advice based upon my personal experience in the work force and with layout editing. Not all resume layouts are created equally, and not all of us download free ones from Microsoft or use the ones that came with Word. Some of us take the extra time to make sure that the document looks clean, sharp and original. I've had good luck with the resume that I designed so far, and I would be bothered if I found it on someone's desktop with their information added in. It's frustrating to see something that you've put a lot of time into taken without even asking.

Also, in your future responses please refer to the disclaimer at the bottom of the page "Be Reasonable! Be Polite!". Your response to me was rude and uncalled for. I understand that you do not agree with my responses, and I don't expect you to. But do not stoop to implying that I am stupid to make your point.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: Also, in your future responses please refer to the disclaimer at the bottom of the page "Be Reasonable! Be Polite!". Your response to me was rude and uncalled for....

You should take your own advice, Lore, before lecturing others about reasonableness and politeness, E.g.,

Lore said: Um, I'm not trying to insult you.

Lore said: No need to get huffy.

Lore said: The work place is changing....

I have agreed with you on a couple of points, Lore, but you conveniently ignore that so you can give me 'tude.

Lore said: But do not stoop to implying that I am stupid to make your point.

Here again, Lore, the same goes for you. You needn't patronize me to make your points. I understand English just fine. Okay?

You are putting negativity into my statements. I meant no offense with them and I'm sorry you took them that way. Online communication is prone to misunderstanding, and that is what is happening here.

Please calm down and try not to take everything so personally. I really meant no harm.

Perhaps you didn't intend your remarks to be harmful, Lore. But consider how you would feel if someone addressed you with the tartness you have used toward me.

Just so you know, Lore, I worked for nearly forty years. I have worked successfully in professional positions in three industries. I like to feel I've acquired at least a modicum of savvy through my experiences and I believe I know what I'm talking about. You are entitled to disagree.

I didn't consider them to be tart. I think you just might be holding a grudge against me because I didn't agree with your statements.

Just so you know, I have worked hard to get through college. I took college courses in high school. I worked hard in the career I was in and have even won awards within my field because of my hard work before making the decision to switch. I may be young, but that does not mean that my contributions are any less valid. I have grown up with computers and have worked in technologically savvy fields. I like to think that I know a little something about certain software packages.

Also, if you wish to ignore the way the work force is changing, then that is your choice. But like I said above there is no reason to be rude to me and/or degrade me simply because you disagree with what I have said here. You have done nothing but take what I have said as a personal attack when they were not meant to be as such, then turn around and call my statements "tart" when I try to give you some insight as to how I meant them exactly.

And in all seriousness, no rudeness meant, I think you may want to work on your anger issues. I can't help my age or position in life. All I wanted to do here was share some of what I have learned. The world is not against you and neither is the younger generation. Try to find some happiness in life.

Good day sir, and good luck on your job hunt.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: I didn't consider them to be tart. I think you just might be holding a grudge against me because I didn't agree with your statements.

Not at all. I stand by my comments regarding your attitude.

Lore said: I can't help my age or position in life....The world is not against you and neither is the younger generation.

There you go again, Lore. You wouldn't have made that remark if I hadn't written about my work experience or alluded to my age. Your remark was uncalled for. I had no clue as to your age until you said you were younger and I could have cared less.

Good luck, Lore.

You have brought nothing but negativity to this thread, honestly. I try to help and you get defensive because I bring in fresh ideas. Then you go on tangents about how "rude" I am. I stand by my comment - you are a very angry individual who obviously has a chip on their shoulder. With all due respect, perhaps this attitude of yours and the victim game you're playing is what is keeping you from getting started in a new career. I've noticed here that you are frustrated over the lack of on the job training for basic/intermediate software programs, and I've noticed on another thread that you're upset about ageism.

If I may put the two together - perhaps it isn't your age but your unwillingness to learn new software that is keeping you from employment right now? I work with many people over 50-60 and they are always having to learn new programs.

Instead of getting mad at me, perhaps you need to look inside and change a little. Holding grudges and refusing to change isn't going to do you any favors in life. Especially when you're in need of a job.

Lore in Orlando, Florida said: I've noticed on another thread that you're upset about ageism.

You're damn right I'm upset about ageism, Lore. So are many other older people who post on these fora. It's easy for you to be smug about ageism because you, Lore, by your own admission, are young. You have not experienced age discrimination. Wait 'til you do.

BTW, that is very much off-topic for this discussion.

Lore said: If I may put the two together - perhaps it isn't your age but your unwillingness to learn new software that is keeping you from employment right now? I work with many people over 50-60 and they are always having to learn new programs.

Did you not read my comments about my willingness to learn software earlier on this thread, Lore? Or are you simply ignoring them because they inconvenience your misguided, ungrounded arguments? In any case, to refresh your recollection, here are my comments:

Displaced Legal Professional said: I applied to a local airline for a technical writing job. To my great surprise, the airline called me. It asked if I had experience with its software. I responded that I had several years of experience with PCs and Macs, including installing, uninstalling and reinstalling PC operating systems, and experience with multiple word processing software. **I said I can learn their software.** The HR person said the hiring manager did not want to train.(emphasis added)

Clearly, Lore, I had told that airline, and have written here as well, that I was perfectly willing to learn the software. I look forward to learning software. Your ridiculous comments are unfounded, and you know it. Perhaps you would not have made them had you read or re-read my comments.

In the future, Lore, please read posts before you consider firing off misguided invective. I am not mad at you, Lore, but I am somewhat disdainful of your lack of maturity and smugness you have exhibited.

Actually, I work in a building with people of all ages. All of the companies I have worked with in the past had no problem hiring "older" (I'll use your term here) people. I'm sorry, but I just don't see it because the fields I have worked in don't subscribe to it. Sorry. Maybe it's just the state (Florida) that I live in.

I felt that it was on topic because I was pointing out that you seemed to have a lot of rage. I feel that your anger is twisting your responses to me and to other users here.

I did read your previous comments. You would be more then happy to learn new software so long as the hiring company would train you on them. That was the whole point of our previous discussion - I said that many companies don't offer on the job training anymore and you seemed to feel (based on your wife's experience in a law firm) that they still do and definitely should if they want you on board. **You will likely not get trained on the job, so you may want to enroll in a course at a community college to get ahead of the curve** I honestly think that your mentality regarding training is holding you back. I only say that to /help/, and not to insult. I've been doing that from the start and you took it as an insult.

My comments are not unfounded. You are stubborn and it is holding you back. The difference here is that I put in the extra effort to learn programs on my own time and get hired. You're waiting until a company is willing to train you and...well..I'm sure you see where that is going.

But you don't want to take my word for it. That's fine. I think the results speak for themselves, though. (And yes, this time I did intend to be snarky. Your "pity me" attitude is getting old. I don't feel sorry for you and if you're still looking for a job then it is your own fault. You're clearly a smart individual who is letting roadblocks get in the way of getting a new job. That's just sad.)

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: I understand your point, but I don't think you understand mine. It's not an unwillingness to learn; it's an unwillingness to train when the company could. And, here again, that airline apparently kept looking for several more weeks before it found its technical writer, It could have given me a chance and had its writer sooner. Its problem.
[QUOTE]

Case in point. You lost out on a job because you were not familiar with the software. If this is software that you could have taken a class on, then you lost out on what could have been a fantastic opprotunity. If that had been me and I was seriously interested in getting into technical writing then I would have done whatever I could to learn the software on my own before applying to the next place.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: In the aviation business, there is a basic pilot resume format. The format sets forth information in a particular order. With few variations, professional pilots follow that format. They follow it because pilot recruiters expect to see information presented in that format. Pilots share resumes all the time. No one squawks if a pilot borrows another pilot's format. [QUOTE]

You have obviously neither worked in the creative field nor known anyone in a creative field. While many job applicants choose to keep their resumes simple or even choose to use a downloaded template, many choose to personalize their resumes. Many of my friends have customized their resumes to fit into their websites and portfolios. Many have used their own logos (copyrighted items) on their resumes. I'm just trying to bring in a different perspective, which you have disregarded again and again.

Lore in Stone Mountain, Georgia said: I did read your previous comments. You would be more then happy to learn new software so long as the hiring company would train you on them. That was the whole point of our previous discussion - I said that many companies don't offer on the job training anymore and you seemed to feel (based on your wife's experience in a law firm) that they still do and definitely should if they want you on board. **You will likely not get trained on the job, so you may want to enroll in a course at a community college to get ahead of the curve** I honestly think that your mentality regarding training is holding you back.

Thank you for your thoughtful and, no doubt, well intended advice, Lore. I will certainly take everything you've said under consideration. You can bet on it.

My point was the airline may have had its technical writer sooner had it been willing to train me. No guarantee that I would have been hired, but it could have interviewed me further in-person. No connect to my wife's law firm. I fully realize some companies won't train. Some will.

Lore said: My comments are not unfounded. You are stubborn and it is holding you back....

Hey, whatever you think, Lore. You certainly have much more wisdom and greater insight into myself than I do. FYI I know the software I need to know for my current industry. I stand by my comments regarding the airline job.

Lore said: But you don't want to take my word for it. That's fine. I think the results speak for themselves, though. (And yes, this time I did intend to be snarky. Your "pity me" attitude is getting old....

Again, Lore, whatever you think. And, Lore, I agree with you again. You certainly are snarky. You've been for most of this discussion. Took the words right off my keyboard.

Lore in Stone Mountain, Georgia said: You have obviously neither worked in the creative field nor known anyone in a creative field.....

Not true, Lore. I worked in radio for nineteen years. Radio is a creative field, full of creative people. I understand creative people.

Here again, did you not read my response to MorningGlory that I understood her feelings? You can page up to read them again.

Lore in Stone Mountain, Georgia said: Many have used their own logos (copyrighted items) on their resumes.....

Copyrighted items are one thing. I agree with you there. In that situation, you are absolutely correct. But, until now, you weren't that specific - fuzzy, as it were. But, in and of themselves, resume FORMATS are not copyrighted. That is my point.

You've put the snark into my words the entire time, and frankly that is your damage. I'm sure if I agreed with you the entire time you would have thought that I was perfectly nice. I guess you're not used to dealing with people who don't agree with you.

And you know the software for your current industry. Great. I know the software for my previous industry too. I decided to leave it and realized that I was going to have to learn a whole lot (and by that I mean 8+) or programs to have a better shot in the work force. I don't expect to go in and have my new employers train me on the Adobe Creative Suite. Good luck getting that dream job in a new field with absolutely no training in it. Hahaha!

And Displaced, maybe you're dispaced for a reason. Your nasty nasty attitude is keeping you from getting hired. You seem like an unhappy and bitter individual who takes even well meaning advice as an insult. What a sad life you must live. I take back what I said before - I feel sorry for you.

Lore in Stone Mountain, Georgia said: You lost out on a job because you were not familiar with the software. If this is software that you could have taken a class on, then you lost out on what could have been a fantastic [opprotunity]. If that had been me and I was seriously interested in getting into technical writing then I would have done whatever I could to learn the software on my own before applying to the next place.

For the final time, Lore, the airline called me about the job. It saw something in my background that was appealing or it would not have called.

You'll learn as you get older, Lore, that it sometimes pays to apply for jobs for which one is mostly qualified. You never know. Companies will sometimes call candidates who may not meet every qualification but most of them. They will at least bring them in to see if they have potential. Doesn't happen much anymore - after all, the workplace is changing, you know - but it happens from time to time. I would agree they won't bring in candidates who don't meet essential qualifications, such as, e.g., basic computer competency.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: Not true, Lore. I worked in radio for nineteen years. Radio is a creative field, full of creative people. I understand creative people.

Here again, did you not read my response to MorningGlory that I understood her feelings? You can page up to read them again.

Copyrighted items are one thing. I agree with you there. In that situation, you are absolutely correct. But, until now, you weren't that specific - fuzzy, as it were. But, in and of themselves, resume FORMATS are not copyrighted. That is my point.

Radio and graphic design don't have much in common. Sorry. I don't think you understand a graphic artist. I just happen to know a lot of them, and I have seen many of their resumes.

Templates are not copyrighted, you are right. I brought that up because, hypothetically, if someone where to use your resume with your personal logo on it and went on to distribute it that way then they would be violating a copyright law. If they took the logo out, then they would not. Regardless, it is still crappy that someone would do such a thing without asking. That much, at least, we can agree on.

My other point in all this is that not everyone uses a template and that if it was something you designed (not threw some clip art into or downloaded from the microsoft site) then you would be upset. I was pointing out that not all resumes are the typical cookie cutter crap that you might see in aviation or radio. An example: www.stephengates.com/Blog/2007/05/creative-visual-resume.html

Lore in Stone Mountain, Georgia said: Your nasty nasty attitude is keeping you from getting hired. You seem like an unhappy and bitter individual who takes even well meaning advice as an insult. What a sad life you must live. I take back what I said before - I feel sorry for you.

Once more, Lore, whatever you think. But as far as nastiness and snarkiness is concerned, don't throw stones if you live in a glass house. And try to tone down the argumentativeness. Creative people must learn to get along with the more mundane.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: For the final time, Lore, the airline called me about the job. It saw something in my background that was appealing or it would not have called.

You'll learn as you get older, Lore, that it sometimes pays to apply for jobs for which one is mostly qualified. You never know. Companies will sometimes call candidates who may not meet every qualification but most of them. They will at least bring them in to see if they have potential. Doesn't happen much anymore - after all, the workplace is changing, you know - but it happens from time to time. I would agree they won't bring in candidates who don't meet essential qualifications, such as, e.g., basic computer competency.

Here's a little story for you. At one point I really wanted to work at a university. If I worked at a university, then my tuition would be either partially or fully covered and they would work with my class schedule. So I go to my local state's website and look around and start applying at entry to mid level positions. Positions I was qualified for. I got called in three times, and was really excited each time! And every time they went with another applicant. After the third time this happened I asked a friend of mine who used to do work study at the university I had been applying to. She told me that they usually have some one all ready in mind (usually a work study student) for the position before posting it, but they're required to bring in other applicants for interview. I was that other applicant, every time.

Maybe they had another candidate in mind. Maybe your resume did speak to them. But at the end of the day you lacked something they were looking for just like I did with the college jobs. I lacked previous employment in the office and you lacked software knowledge. In my case I couldn't really fix it..but you can. That's why your stance on training boggles my mind.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: Once more, Lore, whatever you think. But as far as nastiness and snarkiness is concerned, don't throw stones if you live in a glass house. And try to tone down the argumentativeness. Creative people must learn to get along with the more mundane.

I don't live in a glass house. I wasn't being snarky (unless stated). And I wasn't implying that creative people are somehow better then the (as you said) "mundane". You're putting words in my mouth. Okay? So now you know that what you interpreted from my words was wrong. How about we move /forward/ with this conversation? Learn the new interpretation and move on.

Also, if I am coming off as argumentive it is because you are pushing that button. Try to stop accusing me of things that I did not do and I'll try to be less "argumentive". Kay?

Lore in Stone Mountain, Georgia said: I was pointing out that not all resumes are the typical cookie cutter crap that you might see in **aviation** or radio.

I know an extremely well credentialed, experienced and successful resume writer who would resent that comment, Lore. She specializes in aviation resumes but writes them for all other industries.

You really should relax and/or tone down the "rhetoric," Lore.

Lore in Stone Mountain, Georgia said: Also, if I am coming off as argumentive it is because you are pushing that button. Try to stop accusing me of things that I did not do and I'll try to be less "argumentive". Kay?

That's fine, if you'd like, Lore. But age and experiences teaches one how to stay calm most of the time and not let the button be pushed. Just some food for thought as you get ready go to lunch.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: That's fine, if you'd like, Lore. But age and experiences teaches one how to stay calm most of the time and not let the button be pushed. Just some food for thought as you get ready go to lunch.

But..I haven't seen you stay calm during this discussion.

Displaced Legal Professional in Denver, Colorado said: I know an extremely well credentialed, experienced and successful resume writer who would resent that comment, Lore. She specializes in aviation resumes but writes them for all other industries.

You really should relax and/or tone down the "rhetoric," Lore.

We're not talking writing, we're talking layout. Bit of a difference. You should try to learn the "difference", Displaced.

See, Lore, there you go again. Being argumentative. Think about it. Enjoy your lunch hour.