AUTOMOTIVE TECHNICAINS DONT GET PAID WELL !

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

Another thing that really pisses me off about warranaty work; they don't want to pay diag time for anything anymore. Everybody knows that. Well this is how I see it. We work on cars for a living. Repairing automobiles is our JOB. A JOB is something you get paid for. If it is our JOB to repair automobiles doesn't it make sense that we should get paid for the diagnosis? We don't get out of bed every mornnig and go to WORK to WORK and not get paid. Make sense anyone?

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steven in Baltimore, Maryland

73 months ago

i have come to the conclusion that the auto industry is slowly dying. the dealerships are becoming corporate autogroups run by politicians not car guys. the mom and pop sjops are disappearing because they dont have the money to compete with coporate giants. the really sad thing about this is that going back to colleger to learn a new skill really wont help you either. college degrees have very little pull in the world at this time.
i have come to the conclusion that the best way to predict your future is to create your own.i am going to start my own company and it will not be auto related.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

steven in Baltimore, Maryland said: i have come to the conclusion that the auto industry is slowly dying. the dealerships are becoming corporate autogroups run by politicians not car guys. the mom and pop sjops are disappearing because they dont have the money to compete with coporate giants. the really sad thing about this is that going back to colleger to learn a new skill really wont help you either. college degrees have very little pull in the world at this time.
i have come to the conclusion that the best way to predict your future is to create your own.i am going to start my own company and it will not be auto related.

Here here!! I believe the automotive industry has already died and is rotting!!! The rotting stench is flat rate or as I perfer to call it "flat rape." My college degree hasn't helped me one bit yet. I really intend to get out of this business.

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flatrateslave in Lincoln, California

73 months ago

yeah i hear you but if your service manager is like mine you will be looking for that noise until you finally shotgun something and hope it fixes it.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

My service manager can be a pain in the ass however, I make it very clear to my writer and manager that I do not throw parts at cars nor do I work for free.

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flatrateslave in Lincoln, California

73 months ago

well sometimes you got to roll the dice. last pay period i worked 72 hrs got and got paid for 62.ten hours of free labor thanks to no diag time and terrible warranty times.how is this legal?

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stevenrdl in Charlottesville, Virginia

73 months ago

People in comissioned sales positions really dont have a fighting chance. Flate rate is an old pay plan that was started way back during the war factories and it no longer works in a modern society. Todays cost of living is very expensive, and every worker should at least get a guranteed salary based on education, skills, and abilities. Flate rate, commission, or however you want to put it, provides very little stability, and in order to plan for your future, you need stability. Flat rate pay is almost like working for yourself, so you may as well start your own company and reap all of the rewards of your hard work. Right now, there is not much anyone can do. A college degree for example wont even get you a job right now unless it is something medical. If you dont want to go to college for medical, or you dont feel ready to launch your own venture, then goverment maybe the other option. The only problem with applying to goverment, is it could take months before you hear anything.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

I have come to the conclusion that for me, getting out of the business is only thing that's gonna fix it for me.

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jean

73 months ago

well i have given up on the auto tech idea and im decinding to pursue a web design degree and possibly a computer science degree later on. thank you for the advice and info. :)

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BK in Chagrin Falls, Ohio

73 months ago

Good choice !I wish you luck in your new career.

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A. L. in Sun City Center, Florida

73 months ago

All I can say is after 17 years in this business I have watched my pay go steadily downwards year after year for about the last 10 years. Things were good when I got in this but with all the extended warrantys, crappy flat rate times it realy sucks now. I haven't worked in a shop for almost 6 months now and don't ever plan on going back. It's just not worth it. They have taken away our weekends just about everyone works Saturdays now and the new thing is work on National hollidays 4th of July/Labor day/Memorial day come on enough is enough. I AM DONE. anyone looking to get in this lousy field realy think first there are much better choices. I wish is was this bad when iI got in woulda never stayed this long

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BK in Chagrin Falls, Ohio

73 months ago

I hear ya' loud and clear, I've been out of the biz since January and don't plan on ever going back.I spent 20 years working in Ohio and another 5 in the "deep south". If you think it's bad for an indigenous tech try being a "Yankee" working with a bad economy and some ignorant Southern hatred thrown in. I was expected to work whenever, for whatever wage they wanted to give and do any job that had to be done.I know I'm off the main subject here but it let me know how bad things can get and what I would eventually be facing as this economy worsens.Sure enough after getting back North the economy continued to dive and so did the paychecks, I said enough is enough, now I just trade stocks, heat with wood, grow and hunt some food and don't even need the side-work to get by.I down sized a LOT to cut expenses so I'll never have to put up with that condescending dealer BS again.I'm not saying everyone should go to these extremes but it worked for me and I was able to adapt even at 50.Now I stay home ,continue to bank money, and just keep my own stuff running, and I'm much,much happier.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

Yeah you guys have hit the nail on the head. I will be look for a new career from here on out. The extended warranties have really screwed things up. Yes they are supposed to increase sales but, you get people that only want thier free work done and take thier car to quick lube places for maintance. It's all BS.

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Phil in Gaithersburg, Maryland

73 months ago

weel, has been a little time since I was last here. Hope everyone is finding a new outlook on the automovtive front. A new job. Yes I have seen the warranties take away a good job and make it a bad one. We have a added extra warrant that will go to 8 years and 100,000 all for factory time. Well I just made up some of the skills that "NEW" tech's will need to master if they stay in the bussiness.
Here they are:
Job requirement skills for auto technicians

Be able to read mind: O’yes the noise was at 13.5 miles per hour on Thursday @ 1:15 PM in the rain. O yes I think there was a dog in the road after I went by and heard the yelp. Can you find this. By the way I don’t want to pay for diagnostic time.
Repair order read: noise at low speed.

Have x-ray vision: What do you mean that it could be rod knock, piston slap or just carbon knock. Can’t you tell. Again no diagnostic time paid for.

Must make estimates to the penny.

Must repair cars faster than a speeding bullet.

Must be able to here that clicking noise (rock in the tire), even with the muffler off the car. No I don’t have the money to fix the exhaust.

Must be independently wealthy, to work on factory flat rate time. Of course most after market time is done from the factory time. God help them if they ever really checked to see what the real time was. That the diagnostic took 2.00 hours to replaced the part for .20 hours with included diagnostic, but there was only 15 pages of diagnostic trees to go thru with no conclusion at the end except replace with known good part and retest.

Side bar: Who in there right minds breaks down an hour in to 100’s anyway.

Side bar: After 5 months and the Technician figures out a better way to do the job, they drop a 3.00 hour job down to 1.20 hours because the CEO needs another 1.3 million to not quit, even thought the company lost 23 billion last year.

Hoping to add to this list of skill. If you come up with a addition pls post
.

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BK in Chagrin Falls, Ohio

73 months ago

OK, here's a few winners that I've looked at over the years.I had to make copies of the repair orders so I wouldn't forget the exact phrasing, for every one of these there were hundreds more that I never had a chance to save.
1) engine revs up when driving-comes back down when stopping-seems to do it all the time-advise
2)wipers quit midstream at times-WORSE WHEN RAINING-check and advise
3)scraping noise from under vehicle-customer states may be antenna-advise
4)customer states A/C is inop. when weather is hot-cools when weather is cool-advise
5)check underneath vehicle-while driving in a corn field owner pulled out some of the stalks and a lot of grease was present-advise
You can't make up this stuff! Just add this to all the other BS like doing alignments 3 times because the customer thinks the vehicle pulls right even though you set it to micro-specs, had everyone in the shop test drive it with no problems .... most of the day is spent trying to satisfy the customer and explain geometry to them while you only get paid the hour for the first alignment.And after all that the customer STILL leaves disgruntled thinking that they were ripped off by some stupid grease-monkey.
Of course management says they'll make it up to you.....

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danoct in Crown Point, Indiana

73 months ago

You must not be very good.. I know about 3 people that make over $100,000 a year

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BK in Chagrin Falls, Ohio

73 months ago

Yeah but I don't use a gun when I work..LOL

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dis believer in Binghamton, New York

73 months ago

id like to see that 90hrs pay stub 2000$ a week put the pipe down something is distorting your judgement

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dave in Bristol, Connecticut

73 months ago

get out! let them pay that newcomer 9.50 an hour find an hourly shop I did! I peaked out at 83k a year 4 years ago in a new car dealer but that came down considerably I made the choice to get out of the dealer in march have I lost my touch not on your life its the economy and do you want to hear the crazy part I enjoy working on cars again I work on all makes and I go home with a little more knowledge every day not the same make everyday and I dont miss those factory recall jobs that pay 2 tenths of an hour

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

danoct in Crown Point, Indiana said: You must not be very good.. I know about 3 people that make over $100,000 a year

Are you for real?!

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dave in Bristol, Connecticut

73 months ago

EB in NY in Schenectady, New York said: Are you for real?!

explain

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

BK in Chagrin Falls, Ohio said: OK, here's a few winners that I've looked at over the years.I had to make copies of the repair orders so I wouldn't forget the exact phrasing, for every one of these there were hundreds more that I never had a chance to save.
1) engine revs up when driving-comes back down when stopping-seems to do it all the time-advise
2)wipers quit midstream at times-WORSE WHEN RAINING-check and advise
3)scraping noise from under vehicle-customer states may be antenna-advise
4)customer states A/C is inop. when weather is hot-cools when weather is cool-advise
5)check underneath vehicle-while driving in a corn field owner pulled out some of the stalks and a lot of grease was present-advise
You can't make up this stuff! Just add this to all the other BS like doing alignments 3 times because the customer thinks the vehicle pulls right even though you set it to micro-specs, had everyone in the shop test drive it with no problems .... most of the day is spent trying to satisfy the customer and explain geometry to them while you only get paid the hour for the first alignment.And after all that the customer STILL leaves disgruntled thinking that they were ripped off by some stupid grease-monkey.
Of course management says they'll make it up to you.....

It's amazing how many problems begin at the desk. Here one you might enjoy. This is going back about five years ago when the Chrysler 300 first came out.
Customer state vehicle pulls left and right. WTF!!! The advisor told ME I didn't know what I was talking about! Unbelievable!

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

dave in Bristol, Connecticut said: explain

Explain what?

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Josh in Wasilla, Alaska

73 months ago

Sounds like the dealerships r a real pain. Now i think bout my buddys that bought new dodges with the unlimited mileage warrenty and yea...well if u dont pay the techs what they are worth who is really working on ur dodge? I work for a small company and am fairly happy with what i make. i get paid hourly not flat rate. but yea seems like dealerships r no good for work. i have been thinking about leaving and working on the north slope then opening my own shop.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

The lifetime warranty is a joke. I can just see myself doing a set of ball joints and frt axle u joints ten years from now on a 300,000 mile truck. Being that I work in the heart of the rust belt that should be lots of fun!!!! Oh yeah in ten years I'll be well into my forties. Yahoo!!!!! Do you think Chrysler gives extra time for rust? Fat chance.

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Joe in Sandwich, Illinois

73 months ago

I think the warranty is only on the power train, not everything else, otherwise they would be in even more trouble than they already are in !

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

Yes the warranty is only powertrian. Which would cover a alot of stuff. But you know what's gonna happen. We won't see these vehicles until there is a problem. They'll go to quick lube places or indepedant shops for service work and we'll get stuck doing all the warranty sh!@. It's not fair.

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stevenrdl in Charlottesville, Virginia

73 months ago

Greetings my fellow technicians. I for the most part still enjoy working on cars. What I dont enjoy is the politics of big automotive groups. The bickering, backstabbing judgemental pre-madonnas I work with would make any one re-think thier career choice. However, I love cars and I have even written articles about them and that eventually got published.

I would love to put down the wrench and pick up the pen to pursue automotive journalism as a full time career. So why dont I? Because the news papers sold people subscriptions, and then put all their stuff online for free. Add that to a bad economy and people cancelling their subscriptions, and well I am still freelancing for now. They dont have any money.

What I think would fix the technician shortage and retain technicians, is getting rid of flate rate. Flate rate may have been great at one time, but in reality it was actually started way back in the war factories and was not meant to last.

Because of its pay structure, it creates turmoil amongst fellow colleagues, it cause turnover, and well promotes fraud. We are never going to go back to the 55 Belair, todays cars are advanced to a point where constant training is necessary.

I just recently finished my first chapter of my book, and sent it off for a publisher to look at. I would be cool to see it go into production. Until that point in time, I will keep wrenching because that is what I enjoy doing. I do feel however that dealerships are becoming stagnant. What was once run by car guys, are now being run by corporate politicians, CSI reports, and factory reps checking up on their brand names.

Their will never be any easy answers, and my only advice is to look into the independents, start your own shop, or just get out completely.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

Like I have said before, getting out is all that will do it for me. Flat rate will never go away because the suits running the dealerships won't let it die. I've never considered an independant shop and at this point it's too late for me. I want out. I used to love cars. Now I could care less. I wish all of you the best of luck in any venture you maybe after. If you still enjoy working on cars good for you. I'm glad someone can profit from it.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

jean said: well i have given up on the auto tech idea and im decinding to pursue a web design degree and possibly a computer science degree later on. thank you for the advice and info. :)

Smart move. Best of luck to you.

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stevenrdl in Charlottesville, Virginia

73 months ago

Watch out for IT careers because they can be sent overseas. The good thing about your decision is that with computer and web design training, you may be able to launch your own company. Best of luck to you in your future.

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stevenrdl in Charlottesville, Virginia

73 months ago

With domestic car companies in trouble, and flate rate making it harder to make a living doing this, the future in this industry is really shaky. It is a hard decision to make. Dont give up what you know, or roll the dice and start over? It is a scary proposition. If you are completely dying, and you are not making any money at all then starting over maybe the best option. Believe it or not, sometimes a new start as scary as it may seem, may wind up being the smartest thing you ever did. The risk? You wont know until you do it.

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danoct in Crown Point, Indiana

73 months ago

dis believer in Binghamton, New York said: id like to see that 90hrs pay stub 2000$ a week put the pipe down something is distorting your judgement

I'm dead serious.. One Mechanic I know made roughly $120,000 at peak.. They all work at new car dealerships in Chicago.. If you seen the things they own and the money they spend, one would have to be making $100,000 to afford it.

Do a little research and you will see it while it isn't common, it isn't that uncommon... I'm sure with the economy in its current state, they aren't pulling that much in now.

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dave in Bristol, Connecticut

73 months ago

I can believe it I know a mazda tech that peaked out at 102k 3 years ago it can be done but keep this in mind that guy wasnt doing everything the customer was paying for and also a lot of short cuts taken on repairs ! these shortcuts I have seen and these are ones that I would never think about doing , if some of these customers only knew it would get ugly for all even us honest ones

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flatrateslave

73 months ago

i dont know about your shop but where i work no one can afford to bring customer pay work to our shop because they have the labor rate at 175 an hour so that the shop can get more from the factory on warranty work since they pay on a percentage of the shop labor rate. so they get all they can from the small amount of cars that come in annd the techs starve doing mostly warranty and losing most upsales to independant shops. you wouldnt even have to shop around, the first place you called would be cheaper. you would probably have a hard time finding a more expensive place.the techs at my shop bring this time after time at meetings but the manager swears we are compettive. and since we are owned by auto nation our manager cant do anything about it anyway.

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flatrateslave

73 months ago

chrysler isnt giving anyone any more time for anything. in fact they recently cut times on all jobs across the board wich is insane since its already impossible to do most jobs in the alotted time. let alone come up on any time like your supposed to be able to on flatrate. also if you and alot of other techs do start getting better at a job and start flagging under and making some money they lower the tim its like getting punished for getting better at your job!what other industry works this way.and how can chrysler just cut all labor times across the board when they are supposedly set by time studies of how long each job takes? they diddnt re-study them they just cut them because they are on hard times.

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steve in Plano, Texas

73 months ago

YOU ALL ARE CRAZY ,STOP WORKING AS A BODY MAN AND A MACHANIC ,GO TO SCHOOL AND FIND OTHER WAYS TO MAKE MONEY ,A DAY WILL COME THAT THERE WONT BE ANY ONE TO WORK ON CARS AND THAN THERE WILL BE A DEMAND FOR A MACHANIC AND A BODY MAN THAN YOU CAN ASK WHAT YOU ARE WORTH ,LET ALL THIS COMPANYS GO DOWN FIRST ,THINK HARD ,WHY KILL YOUR SELF FOR THEM ,DONT WHINE ,STOP IT NOW AND YOU WILL GAIN LATER ,LET THIS (M FU ) GO DEAD FIRST .

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

Chrysler cutting labor times is bulls#!t. Minivan racks used to pay 3.1. Now they pay 2.2! WTF!!!! Another thing that drives down warranty times is people going to school and braging about how they beat warranty times on certain jobs. Thoes instructors here this stuff and go back to thier bosses. They probrably get credit for it. I also agree that it is nearly imposible to get people together to unoinize, no matter how much they complain. Isn't it funny though sometime you'll find the biggest complainers are the ones making the most money.

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EB in NY in Schenectady, New York

73 months ago

flatrateslave said: chrysler isnt giving anyone any more time for anything. in fact they recently cut times on all jobs across the board wich is insane since its already impossible to do most jobs in the alotted time. let alone come up on any time like your supposed to be able to on flatrate. also if you and alot of other techs do start getting better at a job and start flagging under and making some money they lower the tim its like getting punished for getting better at your job!what other industry works this way.and how can chrysler just cut all labor times across the board when they are supposedly set by time studies of how long each job takes? they diddnt re-study them they just cut them because they are on hard times.

They cut times because they could. Just remember sh!@ time begets sh!@ work.

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stevenrdl in Charlottesville, Virginia

73 months ago

The domestic auto makers are a bad bet right now. How do you think you guys would do with an Asian import brand? Until flat rate goes away, the automotive service industry will always be a hard avenue to travel. Flat rate simply causes turmoil, turnover, and promotes fraud. It is an old fashion pay system that no longer works in a modern society. What was once a decent career has been ruined by flat rate, greed, and technology.Cars have become appliances, another gizmo overloaded with crap you just dont need. I once had to remove a rear bumper and replace one of the back up cameras because even with a camera, the customer still hit something.

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RMarshall in Mississauga, Ontario

72 months ago

Hello everyone i am 25 i have been in the trade for 5 years i work in a private shop and take home a salary of 40 hors a weeks at $20 a hour. the trade has been good to me i find that if you just go into work with the mindset that i am a good technician and i am valued and you just get to work you will do well you just need to keep a positive attitude.

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BK in Chagrin Falls, Ohio

72 months ago

I needed that, I really did Mr. Marshall. Keep your chin up and just continue the great work up there in Smallville. Someday all techs will develop that positive attitude and things will be just peachy.

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stevenrdl in Charlottesville, Virginia

72 months ago

You make a good point about how positive attitude can change your enviorment. I think most of these complaints are coming from domestic dealer techs, in which case you have to see their side of it because with the restructuring of Chrysler and GM, Domestic techs are having a hard time at the moment.

Dealerships are very good at promoting politics, and in that kind of enviorment it is sometimes very hard to stay positive. I like the dealership because of all the traininmg that is provided. IT is very hard for a private shop owner to send their technicians to school. They do not have the resources to do so in most cases.

My opinion is this; If you like working on cars, then that is what you should be doing. All jobs have a dark side, but there is nothing worse then being in a job you cannot stand.

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Josh in Wasilla, Alaska

72 months ago

RMarshall in Mississauga, Ontario said: Hello everyone i am 25 i have been in the trade for 5 years i work in a private shop and take home a salary of 40 hors a weeks at $20 a hour. the trade has been good to me i find that if you just go into work with the mindset that i am a good technician and i am valued and you just get to work you will do well you just need to keep a positive attitude.
Do you get any benifits? Im doin the same as u, 23 in the trade for 3 years at a private shop with 40 hours a week at $20 an hour. All we get is One week paid vacation.

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Dan in Mentor, Ohio

72 months ago

The key to the 2 previous comments that were positive was both of these techs work on salary or hourly. After working in this business for over 30 years ( 27 in dealer), I agree with all of the negative comments on flate rate. The unfortunate fact at the dealers is the more you learn the less you earn.

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kev in n.h.

72 months ago

I like this forum and the disappointments are nothing new. I've been in the field for many years,I worked for dealers,independents and chains. The problems will never change until techs unionize like other trades,look at what electricians,plummers,construction trade people make compared to us, the benefits,real retirement pensions,annuities,etc. Organize people! Another thing. A.S.E. is a bunch of crap. They are supposed to be non profit,Ya-right.They came around 25 plus years ago and sold us a line of bull,we all certified and now we all make less money than we used to. Stop giving them this kind of power over the trade, they are becoming a licensing agency and multiple choice tests that cost you time and money is baloney,wise up people and unionize.

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iwyl22 in mon, Pennsylvania

72 months ago

Ha i graudauted a trade school for automotive nearly 7 months ago and im still unemployed and looking for a job. I was told that hey go to school and get the paper work haha. I got paper work and both state and emissions licenses and all i get told non stop is you need x amount of years experience. Well how do i get it? I know i dont know a lot and am slow at jobs but i dont have 20 years.. So honistly this field isnt worth all the money i put into my tools and education..

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flatrateslave

72 months ago

i agree with this dude.i know people have good and bad things to say about unions and i have never worked in a union shop but right now the dealership has all the power and seems to do whatever they want and that is usually screwing the employee.

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flatrateslave

72 months ago

yeah is that true salary and not flatrate because there is a big difference i used to like my job when i was hourly and got paid to do it!

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flatrateslave

72 months ago

restructuring or not chrysler has always screwed techs on warranty work.j

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