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Sister Rose M. in Dexter, New York

73 months ago

Prevailing wage but the Union rate is about the same.

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Nickp67 in Surprise, Arizona

72 months ago

Sorry to read about all you folks struggling. Times are hard, the economy is in the dumper, but you people blaming & knocking the (carpenters) union are off target. First, the unions job is so secure good wages & working conditions.Finding members a job isn't their main function, tho most locals WILL try to help. I've been a member for 40 years straight. I've gone thru times like this when you couldn't BUY a job.But things will get better, I know it's hard right now but please, for your own future, don't turn your back on the Union. One day when you're my age you'll have some sort of pension if you do.The Union can't find you jobs that aren't there...

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

72 months ago

K, dont let my Brasilian nickname fool you, I am American, just into Brasilian culture.

Well, after starting as an apprentice in the union 10 yr ago, I've been a journeyman for 6 yrs and at this point I can say by an large as a 'career path' being a union carpenter is pretty much a joke. I'm not saying carpentry or the idea of a union is a joke, I am saying that the way things are set up LOGISTICALLY for the majority of union carpenters IS A JOKE!

First of all, the apprentice school out here was average at best, but you learn mostly on the job so whatever.

But the biggest thing to know if you are new to this game is that the union is ONE BIG SKILLED LABOR POOL! It's like day labor except that the 'days' hopefully last for weeks or if you are lucky months. So, in other words, most union carpenters are TEMP WORKERS, with the exception of the few that have become part of the buddy system with the contractors and have become 'steady company men'.

But anyway, the contractors do not give a rat's ass about you as a person or a union carpenter. They, like all capitalist owners of companies are just in the whole thing to make large some of $$ for themselves off the backs of whatever labor they can find.

Back to logistics though, you basically have to keep trying to procure work since the contractor has little regard for you. You dont know when a job starts or ends until the 11th hour most of the time so it's difficult to plan your life.

The union has no real orderly way of controlling the #s of carpenters they let in, so when there's a ton of work, they let a bunch of guys in, and then when the work slows down you have surplusof labor.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

72 months ago

So anyway, now I'm waiting around to hear if the VT nuke plant is going to pick me up NEXT MONDAY, of course I won't know until the last minute or I'll have to call them tommorow to find out that I'm not part of the 1st 20 guys they are taking.

Our BA in Springfield says it's not even worth going over there to see if the few jobs going are hiring.

So, it's been 2 more months I've been sitting on the bench and it sucks because I like the work FTMP, just want to work.

If I have to change careers though I will, this temp work/'day labor' mentality in construction is for the birds.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

72 months ago

Nickp67 in Surprise, Arizona said: Sorry to read about all you folks struggling. Times are hard, the economy is in the dumper, but you people blaming & knocking the (carpenters) union are off target. First, the unions job is so secure good wages & working conditions.Finding members a job isn't their main function, tho most locals WILL try to help. I've been a member for 40 years straight. I've gone thru times like this when you couldn't BUY a job.But things will get better, I know it's hard right now but please, for your own future, don't turn your back on the Union. One day when you're my age you'll have some sort of pension if you do.The Union can't find you jobs that aren't there...

I mostly agree with you, but the union is in no way a 'secure' job, unless you have become a company man or one of the union bureaucrats, then yes, it can be a very good job. But for most union guys, there are going to be down times of weeks and months where your income is sliding, so its up and down, etc, hard to grow fiancially with it.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

72 months ago

Disgusted Wife in Chicago, Illinois said: I have been supporting my family alone and watched as my husband struggles as a TOP NOTCH - drug free experience journeyman carpetner who is reliable sit home and apply for jobs that don't exist. The wonderful union has dumped our family with regard to benefits and won't pay the claims when we were covered without a huge fight. However, the hand is out for union dues - greedy morons. I am sick to death of there only being work for 3-4 months out of the year and have encouraged him to change jobs. Everyone gets a hand out - you know those auto workers who only get laid off for a few months? Where the heck is the handout for the trades who have had no work since housing took a dump back in June?

God help us all.

Oh, I'm getting a hand out, that is, the IRS has got their hand out for the back taxes I owe them.

But agree with you regarding the union work, I made some remarks below.

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brock in Walton, New York

71 months ago

cant compete in Uniontown, Ohio said: hey michael wake up move to northeast ohio and see how easy it is to find work kid.

move to western ny and you wouldn't be writing this... kid!

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brock in Walton, New York

71 months ago

brock in Walton, New York said: move to western ny and you wouldn't be writing this... kid!

i am a journeyman, and know what you all are talking about. if you all are looking for a good, steady job. move to rochester, ny and look up a company called rochester davis-fetch. we are also starting a company in albany. guess the name. albany davis fetch. if you are willing to stay in a hotel some weeks, great job.

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Rose in Lowville, New York

71 months ago

I am no longer in the Carpenter's Union, that may be a problem. I live between Rochester and Albany. I have no problem staying at an
hotel. I am currently attending college working on my BSBA with a concentration in Project Management. I felt that I needed more,
education to work in the construction industry.
If the company is open shop I may have a chance. Contact me again
and let me know what is the deal. I would like to talk to you further,and see what can be done. I really appreciate your kindness
to share this information with me and other wed members.
Thanks! Sister Rose

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

I suppose if this Albany thing is real I will look into it as I live about 45 mins from there. Will make a call to the local there in fact, but the last few times I've tried to get work out of the Albany local they said they already had 80 guys on the bench--last spring/summer.

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Bill in Providence, Rhode Island

71 months ago

sister rose,you dropped your book wow,they must of broke you in new york.Rose if you want to come to Rhode island maybe I can help you some how,even know I havent worked in 13 mths,Rose if I was you and going to school I go for mri person its not that hard and they always need help forget carpentry for a living,get in the medical part .......I got in the union 1983 and tell you what its no way to live,anyone in the trades earns there money and puts up with alot of bad conditions

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

It's too bad that alot of us who want to do carpentry, who enjoy carpentry, find it is a difficult way to make a living and the crap you have to put up with is beyond what the average person would ever want to deal with.

It's too bad that the working man/woman, even those earning a union wage, are forced to go to college to become a white collar worker--a suit, a supervisor. I want to be union carpenter, in large part on princinple, but yea, I'm considering all options at this point. I don't want to work in the computer industry, but that seems like where most of the remaining jobs are in this country.

It's extremely unfair that the few union carpenters can become company guys, never do squat for the union--not even go to meetings--while the majority are faced with a struggle to procure work and get buy.

We had a union meeting last week where they want us to volunteer and get involved in our local town zoning commitees, etc, meetings to try and procure work for union contractors, hence union carpenters. All volunteer. It's a good idea, but if I help procure that work for nothing, in all likelihood the work is going to be had by the company guys of the contractors that get the jobs--i.e., I probably won't see any of the work myself, unless it's a huge job.

So why should I do that? Let the company guys who have the luxury of a steady job and good income bust their asses and do that stuff, they're going to get the work anyway.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

I think that's the way to go to be a project manager, at least you can potentially get a 'real job', be hired like a normal person and work steady for a company. Barr and Barr, outta NYC, has most of the contracts here in the Berkshires and they are mainly a construction supervisory company, and let me tell, they have alot of supervisors on their jobs.

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vindog in Oakland, California

71 months ago

michael in Wentzville, Missouri said: u guys are probably lazy crybabys if you work hard you will always have a job,i am 22 been in for 4 years and a journeyman/ foreman in st. louis ive worked for 12 companies and have 4 that i jump back and forth between and havent missed a day due to layoff in 2 yrs. you have to work for what you want. when i got laid off i called everyone on that list 3 or 4 times a week... and it all paid off, i show up at job sites dressed in whites and hardhat and found three jobs by just asking..... if you really wanted to work you would.... i want to work to keep what i have and get more, im 22 have 2 kids and a house, boat, 2 cars and love my job...maybe being a carpenter isnt for most of you...

re-read what this guy says, right it down, practice it and get out there in your truck and show up and ask again for that f'g job. It's definetly tough out there, don't cry about $20 bucks a month or whatever. non members cant step foot onto a professional jobsite to even ask for a job, you can. As for mr. know-it-all, never use the word "always" as in "work hard and you'll always have a job. Only youngsters say that. Actually, if you are one of the harder workers, be respected amongst carpenters, get phone numbers, generally be cool, you'll have the best chance of gettin hired when you do for whatever reason (and it happens bro) you find your self out of work. when you're young and good you're HOT, enjoy it tomorrow, it'll be over soon. whatever, you're lucky i've spent my time "splaining this 2 u foo's" consider your selves "schooled"

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

Let's see, well, right now if there were any jobs going on to go to attempt to procure work....i.e., there aren't any in this area for the last 3, 4, 5,.. months. Both my BA and area organizer have told me there are no jobs, realistcally, to go to check out work right now, and that's the 1st time that's ever happened for me. I never had much problewm finding work up through '07, but '08 was up and down, and '09 has kicked off with zilch.

There are about 175 guys on the bench right now in our local, so, obviously, if there was a job to go check out, you are going to be there looking with about 50, 75, 100 guys. The nuke plant picked up 20 a few weeks ago and gonna take 20 more sometime but I haven't been able to get in there either this time around even though they were 'lovin' me the last few times I was up there.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

Oh, there ARE some jobs going on here and there, but they've been staffed for months now. Our BA sorta projects the attitude right now that he doesn't want so many guys showing up to sites 'bothering' the contractors since nobody's hiring. Wait it out, wait it out....blah blah blah.

I was miraculousy called by the Organizer yesterday to go to a 3-5 day job refitting one of those pharmacies, so I showed up yesterday all ready to go and the foreman told me there was some confusion and that they didn't really need anybody 'til maybe 3 weeks from now, and then, for only about 2-3 weeks tops. Then he proceeded to tell me how he was in the union for years and got so sick of all the 'looking for work' b.s., and politics, that he took a supervisors' course and become a company job supervisor doing these pharmacies.

No, the union is on paper a good thing, but logistically speaking, it's pretty much a bumblehead, chrony filled organization.

That guy up there that said we are 'whiners' is probably outta work now anyway, LOL, 'hotshot'! LOL.

Well, Happy New Year all you company men, you are doing the union 'proud'....you guys never help a brother though... mercenaries.

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Rose in Lowville, New York

71 months ago

Thanks for getting back with me. I know that if I go through the
Albany, NY local I can get in and get a job, they prefer member's to live closer to them to make it to work on time. Although it is
Winter, there are contractor's working in the cold.

I did not want to mention it on the website, I am Native/Afro American, when I show up on some of the jobs I experience problems.
I various areas worker's are very bias. There was this one gay carpenter he was just "NASTY" and came at me trying to punch me.
He did not like woman and minorities. Although I have Heart tourble, back problems and Rhumatoid Arthritis now I still would work. I was a Labor Foreman at one government construction site.
When I injured my risk and forearm, I refuse to report it. I did not want to lose my job. It did not help because on guy hated manorites and he gave me the business. I quit! that was an open shop job. I have gone through a lot of foolishness. I tried to tell another guy about what happend to me in the forum and some rude smart mouth SOB, said he's wiped his rear end more than I have worked in the Union. I told him not to write me and he continued to do so, finally I ignored him and he stopped. That is the kind of point that I try to make. All that is beside the point, you are nice and thoughtful. If you can gather some phone number's and names at Davis-Fitch I will be more than glad to contact them about work. I have a Lap Top so on breaks I can do some of my lessions if I have to or while on the road.
You can give me a way to reach you directly about work too.
Not to cut you short but I am in the middle of my lessons and have to turn them in. This is the last week of class for one of my professor's. and next week for the other one. I hope to hear from you and happy valentine's day!

Sisiter Rose

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Rose in Lowville, New York

71 months ago

The only place I know of that is hiring is Fort Drum Army base but it is a mixture of government work and there are contractor's out there. WARNING!!! the cold is terrible, you may want to wait about April to work out there. There work is open to Union and non-Union. There is over time as well.
Depending where in Watertown those same contractor's have work sites around town. You can try the Watertown department of Labor.

Rose

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Disgusted Wife in Chicago, Illinois

71 months ago

I live in the state of INDIANA with the highest unemployment rate in the entire UNITED STATES - trust me when I tell you there is NO work here or in the near Illinois / Chicago area unless you are a non-union guy. We are going on 10 months of no work other than side jobs here and there.

My beef with the union is they don't want to pay when you head to the doctor and dentist - they fight every single claim - WTH? If you pay your dues, it should not be necessary to fight with them over 5 family members claims.
Being a carpenter is just about the worst job you can have, I put up with it (FOR NOW) because my husband truly loves what he does.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

Sister Rose,

Good luck with your classes! Yes, there are as many jerks in the trades as good people, about 50/50 is my experience. The overall problems stem mainly from systemic logistcal issues as I have described.

Anyway, I'll make a call over to Albany tomorrow, see what's up. I was supposed to work yesterday for a whole week!, but I told how that went down.

Catch you later...

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

Hmm, I haven't had a problem with health insurance, but I never use it so I'm not the 'rule'. I know other members are always complaining about coverage issues though.

It kind of surprises me that Chicago has no work since it's a big city and a liberal--hence, I would think union--town. Seems like most of the big new construction has been going on further west. Seems like Des Moines and Omaha always have alot of construction going on when I'm out there, but the unions aren't that strong--'right to work' states. My rep says I should move to Las Vegas, lol, like we should all move to Las Vegas.

I like carpentry, I like the union when there's work, I can handle most of the b.s.

But I'm considering all options at this point.

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Non-Union FTW in Norwich, Connecticut

71 months ago

No, It's a fact..

Most Union Carpenters are very very LAZY!!

They are masters of standing around "Looking Busy". They are so worried about job security that their job performance is forgotten.

I've been a self employed Carpenter for around 16 years..Now I don't claim to know everything but I've seen plenty of Union Carpenters come and go...

They bounce between Union and Non-Union Jobs.. They collect unemployment while working the under-the-table non union jobs.

In my experience, Union = Unemployed..

Don't get me wrong I have nothing personal against Union folks, As I have met plenty of them over the years, Nice guys and all... but everyone knows Union people are blatantly lazy.

It's all part of the "Union" to be lazy and milk the job as long as possible.

My "non-union" boss would NEVER put up with the extreme laziness that the union carpenters bring to the table.

These union guys come onto the job bolstering about how "Union" they are, but when push comes to shove they end up getting fired because they are so accustomed to being lazy that they just constantly complain about how hard the work is. LOL

I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything , but it's a well known fact that Union carpenters are extremely lazy and take job security for granted.

I'm more then happy to be working Non-Union.. As benefits and wage don't mean crap when your sitting home with your thumb up your ass. Does it now?

What would you rather be a Union guy making 23 an hour with no work or a Non-Union guy making 15 an hour with plenty of work?

In today's economic situation it pays to be NON-UNION.

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BTRndll in Beaverton, Oregon

71 months ago

Non union,

I have worked non union and union and must say not all union carpenters are lazy and the ones that are lazy are the ones who are not working and that usually goes on both sides. But I liked working non union in custom homes I think the old timers are better craftsman than the old timers who spent there whole career in the union. The problem being non union, out west at least, is the low wage with all the illegals, it really drives you towards the union wage just so you can support the family. From working on both sides I think if you want to make a career in construction its tough not to have that union wage and benefits especially if you have a family unless you have and run your own business. For me I saw the union being to political not always the best carpenter in charge but usually the guy who goes under the table the most. Non union work just did not pay enough to support my family. Its a tough situation I ended up going a totally different direction and now work from home wouldn't change that for nothing. Now I build for charities and just about to start building my own home, anyways good luck to all you construction workers its a tough life, I miss hanging out with the guys.

God Bless,
Brian

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Bill in Providence, Rhode Island

71 months ago

BTRndll in Beaverton, Oregon said: Non union,

I have worked non union and union and must say not all union carpenters are lazy and the ones that are lazy are the ones who are not working and that usually goes on both sides. But I liked working non union in custom homes I think the old timers are better craftsman than the old timers who spent there whole career in the union. The problem being non union, out west at least, is the low wage with all the illegals, it really drives you towards the union wage just so you can support the family. From working on both sides I think if you want to make a career in construction its tough not to have that union wage and benefits especially if you have a family unless you have and run your own business. For me I saw the union being to political not always the best carpenter in charge but usually the guy who goes under the table the most. Non union work just did not pay enough to support my family. Its a tough situation I ended up going a totally different direction and now work from home wouldn't change that for nothing. Now I build for charities and just about to start building my own home, anyways good luck to all you construction workers its a tough life, I miss hanging out with the guys.

God Bless,
Brian

Let me educate you about the union,im been in this Racket for 25 years and its not what you know its who you know,Ill bet my house and my truck that I can out work you and out smart you as a carpenter ok....people out of work are lazy YOU say....Thats a ignorant statement

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Bill in Providence, Rhode Island

71 months ago

Non-Union FTW in Norwich, Connecticut said: No, It's a fact..

Most Union Carpenters are very very LAZY!!

They are masters of standing around "Looking Busy". They are so worried about job security that their job performance is forgotten.

I've been a self employed Carpenter for around 16 years..Now I don't claim to know everything but I've seen plenty of Union Carpenters come and go...

They bounce between Union and Non-Union Jobs.. They collect unemployment while working the under-the-table non union jobs.

In my experience, Union = Unemployed..

Don't get me wrong I have nothing personal against Union folks, As I have met plenty of them over the years, Nice guys and all... but everyone knows Union people are blatantly lazy.

It's all part of the "Union" to be lazy and milk the job as long as possible.

My "non-union" boss would NEVER put up with the extreme laziness that the union carpenters bring to the table.

These union guys come onto the job bolstering about how "Union" they are, but when push comes to shove they end up getting fired because they are so accustomed to being lazy that they just constantly complain about how hard the work is. LOL

I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything , but it's a well known fact that Union carpenters are extremely lazy and take job security for granted.

I'm more then happy to be working Non-Union.. As benefits and wage don't mean crap when your sitting home with your thumb up your ass. Does it now?

What would you rather be a Union guy making 23 an hour with no work or a Non-Union guy making 15 an hour with plenty of work?

In today's economic situation it pays to be NON-UNION.

ok guy,open you eyes and ears this is 2009 and what company going to pay a guy 52 dollars a our to lean on the wall....you young,keep working for with no health care or pension

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Bill in Providence, Rhode Island

71 months ago

lost MB and Son job said: Don't give up. Find little ways to keep going. This will pass. Thats what I'm doing.

Thanks for the chins up,hows things?

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wife of unemployed carpenter

71 months ago

Bill in Providence, Rhode Island said: Thanks for the chins up,hows things?

Hanging in there. Waiting for things to pick up. This is not the end, it will get better someday. Here in St Louis, if you are lazy you will not last a week. 17 years at one company, been out for a year now-it is the economy. Tried non-union work the last year-horrible joke. Both jobs had no benefits, so that brought them to the equivalence of a walmart job w/benefits.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

Non-Union FTW in Norwich, Connecticut said: No, It's a fact..

Most Union Carpenters are very very LAZY!!

They are masters of standing around "Looking Busy". They are so worried about job security that their job performance is forgotten.

I've been a self employed Carpenter for around 16 years..Now I don't claim to know everything but I've seen plenty of Union Carpenters come and go...

They bounce between Union and Non-Union Jobs.. They collect unemployment while working the under-the-table non union jobs.

In my experience, Union = Unemployed..

Don't get me wrong I have nothing personal against Union folks, As I have met plenty of them over the years, Nice guys and all... but everyone knows Union people are blatantly lazy.

It's all part of the "Union" to be lazy and milk the job as long as possible.

My "non-union" boss would NEVER put up with the extreme laziness that the union carpenters bring to the table.

These union guys come onto the job bolstering about how "Union" they are, but when push comes to shove they end up getting fired because they are so accustomed to being lazy that they just constantly complain about how hard the work is. LOL

I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything , but it's a well known fact that Union carpenters are extremely lazy and take job security for granted.

I'm more then happy to be working Non-Union.. As benefits and wage don't mean crap when your sitting home with your thumb up your ass. Does it now?

What would you rather be a Union guy making 23 an hour with no work or a Non-Union guy making 15 an hour with plenty of work?

In today's economic situation it pays to be NON-UNION.

It's not my experience that union carpenters are lazy, in fact the opposite is true, so I completely disagree with you. You are stating more of a stereotype, but hey, thanks for 'sharing'.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

Non-Union FTW in Norwich, Connecticut said: No, It's a fact..

Most Union Carpenters are very very LAZY!!

They are masters of standing around "Looking Busy". They are so worried about job security that their job performance is forgotten.

I've been a self employed Carpenter for around 16 years..Now I don't claim to know everything but I've seen plenty of Union Carpenters come and go...

They bounce between Union and Non-Union Jobs.. They collect unemployment while working the under-the-table non union jobs.

In my experience, Union = Unemployed..

Don't get me wrong I have nothing personal against Union folks, As I have met plenty of them over the years, Nice guys and all... but everyone knows Union people are blatantly lazy.

It's all part of the "Union" to be lazy and milk the job as long as possible.

My "non-union" boss would NEVER put up with the extreme laziness that the union carpenters bring to the table.

These union guys come onto the job bolstering about how "Union" they are, but when push comes to shove they end up getting fired because they are so accustomed to being lazy that they just constantly complain about how hard the work is. LOL

I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything , but it's a well known fact that Union carpenters are extremely lazy and take job security for granted.

I'm more then happy to be working Non-Union.. As benefits and wage don't mean crap when your sitting home with your thumb up your ass. Does it now?

What would you rather be a Union guy making 23 an hour with no work or a Non-Union guy making 15 an hour with plenty of work?

In today's economic situation it pays to be NON-UNION.

LOL, this doesn't even dignify further response. Have fun working @ $15/hour, you obviously don't have a clue...

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

BTRndll in Beaverton, Oregon said: Non union,

I have worked non union and union and must say not all union carpenters are lazy and the ones that are lazy are the ones who are not working and that usually goes on both sides. But I liked working non union in custom homes I think the old timers are better craftsman than the old timers who spent there whole career in the union. The problem being non union, out west at least, is the low wage with all the illegals, it really drives you towards the union wage just so you can support the family. From working on both sides I think if you want to make a career in construction its tough not to have that union wage and benefits especially if you have a family unless you have and run your own business. For me I saw the union being to political not always the best carpenter in charge but usually the guy who goes under the table the most. Non union work just did not pay enough to support my family. Its a tough situation I ended up going a totally different direction and now work from home wouldn't change that for nothing. Now I build for charities and just about to start building my own home, anyways good luck to all you construction workers its a tough life, I miss hanging out with the guys.

God Bless,
Brian


It's just a different 'genre', so to speak, in the union, if you wanna be a woodworker and do wood framing and house building, yeah, stay non union.

However, the union carpenters that I know who work for millwork installers are on the average, BETTER, than non union, but most of them cut their teeth early on working residential because it's difficult to get woodworking, wood framing, cabinet making, etc, coming up through the union. The vast majority of commercial union jobs are large construction projects that require a strong production mentality. But the jobs center around metal and 'synthetics'. I've gotten some good trim/millwork package experience at this point, but it's the exeption...

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

BTW,
the non union residential carpenters and contractors in my area are also feeling the economic crunch, most of them are crying about lack of jobs, or at least the normal amount of jobs that they are accustomed to. I know plenty of them seeking options as well.

Personally, I had constant work, almost too much some years, in the union, up thru '07, but it's fallen off drastically since the.

As far as being a 'rank and file' carpenter, the non union world, as a whole, cannot come close to what the union provides as wage and benes, professionalism, and safety standards. It's a joke, actually. Now, if you are a private contractor--i.e., construction 'retailer'--that's a different thing, obviously that's where you make the big $$, but union contractors make huge $$.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

But, to the people that experience union carpenters as 'lazy, well, there might be some validity to that in the large cities like Boston, NY, Chicago, etc. I've heard they do things a bit 'differently' there, but I don't work in a huge city and out here the union carpenters are as a whole very good, very hard workers.

There are exceptions, but they don't last long.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

BTRndll in Beaverton, Oregon said: Non union,

..... The problem being non union, out west at least, is the low wage with all the illegals, it really drives you towards the union wage just so you can support the family. From working on both sides I think if you want to make a career in construction its tough not to have that union wage and benefits especially if you have a family unless you have and run your own business. For me I saw the union being to political not always the best carpenter in charge but usually the guy who goes under the table the most. Non union work just did not pay enough to support my family. Its a tough situation I ended up going a totally different direction and now work from home wouldn't change that for nothing. Now I build for charities and just about to start building my own home, anyways good luck to all you construction workers its a tough life, I miss hanging out with the guys.

God Bless,
Brian


All of this ^^^ is true.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

wife of unemployed carpenter said: Tried non-union work the last year-horrible joke. Both jobs had no benefits, so that brought them to the equivalence of a walmart job w/benefits.

yep, sucks, lol!
I've been considering going non union for awhile 'til the union picks up again, have 'interviewed' with a few contractors, it IS a joke, the low pay and lack of benes. But they are are 'high and mighty' about things of course.

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Rose in Lowville, New York

71 months ago

Thanks so much for getting back with me. I just completed one of my assignments and received a B+. I am very unhappy that I
missed out by not completing a question to turn the assignment in
on time, that result in missing out on a "A" grade.

I worked very hard when I worked as a carpenter. I AM NOT LAZY GUYS!!!!!!!!! people take me as a liar and lazy. I don't care how
good you are and how hard you work, there are people that just do not like certain groups of people period. I was up on a pier during a concrete pour when one carpenter asked me, what are you doing up hear? who told you that you can come up here? I stated the
superentendant, he said get the f..K back down the ladder. One of the labor's stole some of my tools and when he was caught he was so pissed, that he had to bring them back to work and give them to me. I worked down in PA, I worked late into the night with a another carpenter foreman from another local. The carpenter's from NYS,they went off on me stating I made them look bad. I was called ugly names.
I have showed up on jobs as a carpenter. I was not allowed to do
carpentry. I was sent to do clean up duties and let a male labor's
to carpentry work. I resent that I am referred to as being a cry baby and lazy. Those carpenter's are directing those comments directly to me. Those guys are not Native or Afro American Female.
When I have worked I work when I am suppose to. I work overtime,weekends when asked. I do not give anyone trouble,think like this I do not fit in. I live in a little one horse town called,Lowville,NY to show how racist they are here I went into McDonald's a little over two years ago and asked for an application and was denied. I have gone to places and turned away.
I went to Best Western Hotel and applied for a maid job. When the manager read my resume, he said you are practically an engineer. I stated I was not an engineer but have taken engineering courses. He said you are over qualified.

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unemployed carpenter

71 months ago

michael in Wentzville, Missouri said: i work for the CDC of St. louis local 1987 most of my work is millwright or general contracting...maybe you should become a more likable person, but there are way to many jobs out there to kiss anyones ass...

In st louis there is a food pantry at the union hall for members only, since so many have been out of work a year. The residential has been hit hard and the commercial barely affected. No one has known of any jobs for a residential journey level carpenter for a year. Had a couple of connections with commercial jobs and once they were hiring and found out I had no commercial experience they said I would not be considered.(McCarthy was one)I guess thats how it is. Still going to apply for commercial jobs I guess since they are the only ones hiring-but probably a waste of time. Oh, and Rose, I think they are saying any unemployed carpenter is lazy and whatever, they just don't know much.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

A millwright is essentially a different trade than a carpenter.....

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BTRndll in Beaverton, Oregon

71 months ago

Bill in Providence, Rhode Island said: Let me educate you about the union,im been in this Racket for 25 years and its not what you know its who you know,Ill bet my house and my truck that I can out work you and out smart you as a carpenter ok....people out of work are lazy YOU say....Thats a ignorant statement

Hey Bill slow down,

that statement about lazy people being out of work is a true statement out west don't know what is going on with the east coast. sounds like you are totally pro union I didn't think I was bashing the union, supported my family for many years with union work, just stating that the old timers in non union had a lot more to teach and that I enjoyed custom home building, Just an opinion. But Your preaching to the choir on the who you know statement, people just do funny things to know the right person was what I was trying to say. Oh and I cant see an east coast boy out working a production framer from the west. Now I know that is going to fire you up!

God Bless

Brian

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

71 months ago

BTRndll in Beaverton, Oregon said: Hey Bill slow down,

that statement about lazy people being out of work is a true statement out west don't know what is going on with the east coast. sounds like you are totally pro union I didn't think I was bashing the union, supported my family for many years with union work, just stating that the old timers in non union had a lot more to teach and that I enjoyed custom home building, Just an opinion. But Your preaching to the choir on the who you know statement, people just do funny things to know the right person was what I was trying to say. Oh and I cant see an east coast boy out working a production framer from the west. Now I know that is going to fire you up!

God Bless

Brian

Well, guess that settles it, west coast carpenters are lazier than east coast carpenters. :)

"Production farmer"? Is that referring to the immigrant/migrant laborers that do all the work? Well out here, there's alot of Jamaicans that do that stuff and those guys are pretty stout, so I dunno. No unionization in that line of work of course.

Not too many farms--'real' farms--on the east coast anyway, not like the midwest and west.

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local 412 in Saint Peters, Missouri

71 months ago

matthew kreitzer in Savannah, Tennessee said: ihave paid a lot of money to be a union member and i made some good money but so far none of local unions has help me much my freinds tell me im crazy for paying the dues and not getting no work out of it but some day maybe they will call and i will be ready to travel ps its all in who you know and un fortionatly i dont so if you decied to join use cation

I know exactley what your saying I just got a letter because I stopped paying my dues and they said they would kick me out of the union if i dont pay them by the end of the month. The carpenters union is so screwed up they have so many people sitting now and they are still bringing people into the union if you ask me this should not even be considered a union.

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bee lu 608 and 225

70 months ago

To all brothers and sisters hang in there better times will come, if u are not working, use time to learn somthing new . Good thing about being in the union ,they teach us for free so learn somthing new, i am in a weilding class it will help. 13 years lu 608 out of new york . good luck and good bless my brothrs and sisters.

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BK in Rancho Santa Margarita, California

70 months ago

Union sucks here in Southern California. Been on the out of work list for over 6 months and not one call. Job sites are setting up security to keep people away because so many people are out of work and begging for a job. Union pay $37, non union was about $25, but now even if you could find a job that was hiring they wouldn't even pay $15. I'd take minimum wage just to avoid losing my truck, but no one is hiring.

Union meetings talk about the jobs out there. Been to every job site and not one is hiring. Same union guys going every day just to get turned away.

There was just a story in the local paper that construction companies have laid-off 80-90% of their crews.

Honestly, If the union is not going to get me any work, I'll have to take non-union because I need to feed my family. No one is looking out for me. Sure the union will take my money, but then hang me out to dry.

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ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts

70 months ago

BK in Rancho Santa Margarita, California said: Union sucks here in Southern California. Been on the out of work list for over 6 months and not one call. Job sites are setting up security to keep people away because so many people are out of work and begging for a job. Union pay $37, non union was about $25, but now even if you could find a job that was hiring they wouldn't even pay $15. I'd take minimum wage just to avoid losing my truck, but no one is hiring.

Union meetings talk about the jobs out there. Been to every job site and not one is hiring. Same union guys going every day just to get turned away.

There was just a story in the local paper that construction companies have laid-off 80-90% of their crews.

Honestly, If the union is not going to get me any work, I'll have to take non-union because I need to feed my family. No one is looking out for me. Sure the union will take my money, but then hang me out to dry.

Right now a guy's gotta do what he's gotta do to survive, whether it be union or nonunion, I wouldn't worry about it.

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Rose in Lowville, New York

70 months ago

Did you see my reply with a job contact here in NYS?

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Rose in Lowville, New York

70 months ago

I understand where you are coming from. You may be better off
relocating to another area. New York state may be a lot better.
I am not rich and I know what it is down and out. If I can give you a hand let me know.

Sister Rose

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Rose in Lowville, New York

70 months ago

Let me know if I can help you out a little.

Sister Rose

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Union Carpenter in Schoharie, New York

69 months ago

I would like to comment on the union carpenter work situation in New York. Bottom line there is little to no work for union carpenters in New York at this time. Rochester LU 85 has 1/3 of their membership out of work right now (yeah that's where Ft Drumm is located). As with other locals Newburgh LU 19 has about 4-6 month wait for work. Hawthorne LU 11 has about a 4 month wait for work. Long Island LU 7 has over 600 members on their list. Albany LU 370 has about 200 members on their list. So as it is all over the US work here in New York is also scarce. So Sister Rose if you know something that the local union refferal halls don't would you please enlighten us all....

As for the current work situation in the past 12 years that I have been a proud Union Member I have never seen it this bad. Partially because a lot of jobs (private and state) have been put on hold or delayed since most contractors can not get funding (loans) to purchase materials or fund their payrolls. Therefore we will not be seeing a lot of work starting until the economy picks up and lending becomes more available to the contractors.

As for you being out of work maybe it may have something to do with you yourself since Empire State Carpenters has a 5 journeyman to 1 apprentice clause. Accross the state seems as though only the apprentices are the ones who are working....

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Union Carpenter in Schoharie, New York

69 months ago

ze robertinho in Great Barrington, Massachusetts said: But, to the people that experience union carpenters as 'lazy, well, there might be some validity to that in the large cities like Boston, NY, Chicago, etc. I've heard they do things a bit 'differently' there, but I don't work in a huge city and out here the union carpenters are as a whole very good, very hard workers.

There are exceptions, but they don't last long.

Union workers are far from lazy... I can remember as an apprentice seeing non-union guys come on the job and be laid off before coffee because they couldn't make the 'numbers' NYC carpenters hang and screw off about 80-100 boards a day. How bout them dam scabs????

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Matt in Mamaroneck, New York

69 months ago

Hey Union Carpenter in Schoharie, New York.

I'm looking at applying for an apprenticeship with Hawthorne LU 11. If I get in, is there any work to be done as an apprentice?

Times are bad right now, I know, but I thought it might be a good time to break into a new trade and have some skills for better times.

Any advice or insight?

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Rose in Lowville, New York

69 months ago

To the brother at Carpenters Local 85. First of all you do not know me. You never worked with me to determine my personality, work eithics, attendance or if I am lazy. I have been in meetings and members said they never knew of me. I met a Afro-American Union Constractor at the building one day that stated he called to the call several times that past month and was told the Union did not have any first or second year apprentices. He was working on a
job at the Monroe County Airport. I could have been sent out but was not. I have shown up on jobs and worker's have an attitude. So if you want to say it is me well since I am different then I guess your right. Far as me being lazy I don't think so. I remember when I first entered in the Union I worked with the state
out of the disabilities office. Dispite the back enjury from working as a Nurses Aide, I forced myself to work and worked with Economy Payving in Ithaca till the job ended. I went through hell but put up with nonsence,being cursed out. The ladder being shaken when climbing. No matter how bad the pain was I continued to work.
I was put out of the Union then I was able to come back. There has been wrong doings against me that is why the Ithaca local was investigated my Human Rights in 1997. In 2007, I withdrew from the
Union and they contacted me 2/2008 claiming I was being kicked out for nonpayment of dues, well that shows how much people pay attention to things. The only person at that local who ever cared about me is Mr. Alexander. I worked construction for a while back in 1989 and 1994. I ran my own business on a trial basis in 1999.
One member made a comment about me bying a Mercedes, what I owened before I came to the Union and when I was in Germany with my x-husban has nothing to do with the Union. I do not care to discuss
any further with you or anyone else what went on at Local 85. I cannot be sent out and I am told I will not be sent out,well I am not paying dues.Work in Watertown.

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