Walter E. Smithe Crushes Dreams

This is not at all to bash Walter E. Smithe the furniture store, but instead it's to report on their hiring practices. The store does in fact have quality goods. I recently had the opportunity to partake in their rigorous 8 week training "design" program. Design is in quotes for a reason. About every 3 weeks the company hires aspiring interior designers/ decorators wannabe's from all walks of life to fulfill their passion of design. Some of these people leave lucrative careers for this opportunity, for it to be crushed because they were misled into believing that their design sense was important. The ad that is listed on numerous websites says that the position is 50% design and 50% sales. However, it's about 95.5% sales and 4.5% design. You go through a arduous program of pushy selling sessions, with a little bit of design thrown in the middle. The structure of the program is very sound, and efficient, but with that comes a little nastiness. My observation is that they bring in on average about 15 people, and a few get cold feet before training even starts. Then a few drop out in the first week, when they realize that they can't do the obnoxious selling routine that is asked of them. Others aren't able to hang with their computer ordering system, which is complex, but not difficult. Then you have people like me, with all the design ability in the world, but not big on the aggressive selling rituals. I fell into what I will call the "weeding out process". The time when they get rid of people because they don't have enough positions in their stores. They told several people (myself included)that they weren't connecting with clients, which really means that we were not selling. Long story short, if you like to "Sell, sell sell," then the training might be for you, if you're a Designer, do it the right way and go to Design School, because very little design takes place.

I worked at WES as a successful designer. It is 100% sales AND 100% design. You can't design if you can't sell, and you can't sell if you can't design. This goes for ANY type of business whether corporate, retail, or self-employment. I'm now a self employed interior decorator working out of my home. It doesn't matter how much I love design and how good I am at designing. If I can't 'sell' myself and my services to people I meet socially and at networking events, than I don't get the opportuity to be a designer. ALL businesses require the ability to sell yourself and your business. Once you understand this concept, your attitude about sales will change (it won't have a negative connotation), and you will enjoy selling and doing the design you love so much. Even as a designer, when you get a new client, there is a constant selling process going on -- you have to sell them on your floor plans and sell them on your furniture selections, etc. It's all sales, all the time. It's fun when you have the right outlook and attitude.

I agree with former WES designer. ALL business is about selling...selling the concept, the design...whatever. The sales training at WES is the very best in the industry and true...not everyone can cut it. You cant make money sitting around on your ass "designing". Bottom line is money. If you cant sell your "design" it means nothing. WES is a great company, although the economy is hitting it hard...just like most companies nowadays. Ride the storm out because theres potential here. The Smithes are very considerate of their designers and hold them in high esteem. They work with their people and try to help them do the best they can in the company. The "up" system is fair and equal and eliminates unnecessary and negative competition and back biting among designers. Selling/designing is not for everyone. You have to be a problem solver and have a positive attitude.

That was your experience. The Smithe's might nurture, but their trainers(one in particular) did not. I know of a particular designer that was the best in my training class, who they let go (and I'm not speaking of myself). In week 2 of selling, (or maybe week 1)they gave her the boot, because she hadn't sold anything. It was under the guise that she wouldn't make the money that she needed to make. First of all if they were really about training designers, they would have guided her. However, they were not concerned with her success. They didn't bother to see how many proposals she had on the table, they just pushed her out the door as they did others. I'm so over this subject, I've moved on.

Here's the thing. They are constantly hiring and training people only to expect the majority to leave within 6 months. What a waste of money and bad management, but they dont care. The more designers they have on the floor, the less each has the potential to make goal or 125% thereby putting more cashola in their pockets. No matter how many "designers" they have on a floor, the sales will be relatively the same for WES. 4 people will sell the same amount as 10 with the same amount of ups, but those 10 will be making less money for themselves overall. Get the scam? Ive seen it where 6 designers are sitting around doing NOTHING because noone is walking through the door. You wait 2 hours for an up sometimes.
2 or 3 people could handle that as well as 6 or 7 and make more money.

One other thing. Practically every other big box retailer carries the exact same lines at cheaper prices generally. They're not staying above the competition and they're relying on their oh so "cool" image to sell the same stuff everyone else has. Most of the selling is out of catalogs because the smaller stores dont have enuff on the floor. The merchandising looks like a flea market with furniture piled on top of furniture and clients get confused with so many choices and dont want to shop out of catalogs.
Theyre also creating competition between their own stores.
Not a great way to treat your employees.

Thanks for your perspective. I have since moved on to new topics, but it is good to see other views of their business practices.

Done with it in Schaumburg, Illinois said: Here's the thing. They are constantly hiring and training people only to expect the majority to leave within 6 months. What a waste of money and bad management, but they dont care. The more designers they have on the floor, the less each has the potential to make goal or 125% thereby putting more cashola in their pockets. No matter how many "designers" they have on a floor, the sales will be relatively the same for WES. 4 people will sell the same amount as 10 with the same amount of ups, but those 10 will be making less money for themselves overall. Get the scam? Ive seen it where 6 designers are sitting around doing NOTHING because noone is walking through the door. You wait 2 hours for an up sometimes.
2 or 3 people could handle that as well as 6 or 7 and make more money.

One other thing. Practically every other big box retailer carries the exact same lines at cheaper prices generally. They're not staying above the competition and they're relying on their oh so "cool" image to sell the same stuff everyone else has. Most of the selling is out of catalogs because the smaller stores dont have enuff on the floor. The merchandising looks like a flea market with furniture piled on top of furniture and clients get confused with so many choices and dont want to shop out of catalogs.
Theyre also creating competition between their own stores.
Not a great way to treat your employees.

I worked for WES from 1990 to 1994 & yes you are acurrate. They are overpriced and messy & they don't care. Just ruthless. Can't imagine that there are so many women in Chicago that want to be a designer & get taken advantage of. Shame on you ladies. Have some self respect!!!

You ladies just don't get it. This is a 100% commission sales job. You have sales goals and if you don't make the goals, then the job is not a fit for you. It's no different than a sales job for a Fortune 500 company. I have done both. I had a great experience at WES. I have a great friend who has been at WES for 5 years and she is making great money and enjoying her job. It's just not a job that everyone is cut out for. People with negative attitudes won't survive. It's definitely the glass is half full half empty sydrome here. WES provides excellent training and support, but then YOU have to sell. It's that simple. It's a sales job. You are not a designer in training at an interior design firm.

These kinds of companies have nothing really to do with "design.' Its a "word" they put in place to make the public think that's what's going on at their stores, when its really just hard driving sales. If a real driver of a salesperson without the title of "designer" gets their teeth in the same customer, that customer's going to buy. Using the word "design" just makes it more attractive & palitable to the consumer to be shaken down by a hard driver. These so-called designers wouldn't know a presentation board if it hit them in the face and said "here's your design plan."

DebDen in Illinois said: These kinds of companies have nothing really to do with "design.' Its a "word" they put in place to make the public think that's what's going on at their stores, when its really just hard driving sales. If a real driver of a salesperson without the title of "designer" gets their teeth in the same customer, that customer's going to buy. Using the word "design" just makes it more attractive & palitable to the consumer to be shaken down by a hard driver. These so-called designers wouldn't know a presentation board if it hit them in the face and said "here's your design plan."

That's right. They made us go to hard hitting sales seminars every quarter. And misrepresent their pricing. It's all about the money. And I was good at it. I was top seller in my store. But it wasn't design & based on all the complaints, you can tell they just hire 200 newbies every year and they have little understanding of scale or form or fit or function. And we didn't even get breaks. The whole thing must go against the labor code. Can't imagine it's even legal.Any place with a 80% turn opver rate is not the place to be.

Ladies, it's a sale job. It's selling home furnishings. After working there for 4 years, I left and started my own design business. You have to know how to sell to have your own business, and you have to know how to design too. It's both. If you wanted just a design job, you need to go to an interior design firm. But believe me, the owners of those design firms have to sell and get new business every day, so they are sales too. Retail establishments are about selling, period. WES does not have deceptive selling practices. I don't know where you got that from. And when it's not your turn to be "up" waiting for someone to walk in the door, you can do whatever you want, including taking a break in the break room.

Former WES Designer in Chicago, Illinois said: Ladies, it's a sale job. It's selling home furnishings. After working there for 4 years, I left and started my own design business. You have to know how to sell to have your own business, and you have to know how to design too. It's both. If you wanted just a design job, you need to go to an interior design firm. But believe me, the owners of those design firms have to sell and get new business every day, so they are sales too. Retail establishments are about selling, period. WES does not have deceptive selling practices. I don't know where you got that from. And when it's not your turn to be "up" waiting for someone to walk in the door, you can do whatever you want, including taking a break in the break room.

It actually does a great dis service to the design professional. They should be honest and call them consultants. Nothing to do with design. And yes I have had my own business since 1981 in commercial design and now in residentail remodels. I only worked there when the kids were young and I didn't want as much pressure. But they were very
rude to their employees and all about making the sale . That in the long run stops you for getting referrals and repeats. I have also been told from people that work there still that their stores are empty.

C'mon...You're spinning. We all know in all fields in business there's some degree of selling either yourself or a service, product or a idea. It's the "type" of selling and you know it. WES wants go for the wallet, get them while they're there, used car type sales people. I've been independant, too. We all know you have to be able to "sell" if you want to call it that, yourself & your design plan. No one's that stupid, so quit acting like they are. It's a smoke screen for the real deal which is hard ass selling based on what they like to call "killer greetings and rapport building relationship selling." What a crock of you know what! It's slick willy selling they want & that wouldn't fly in a one to one independant designer-client relationship.
If youre really have your own design business you'd know that and know the difference between what they want & what you do as a independant to get the project done. At WES, there's no project. It's a hard driving sales scene between a salesperson & a customer....not a designer & a client.

My comment was for Former WES - We hit at the same time LIZ.

DebDen in Illinois said: C'mon...You're spinning. We all know in all fields in business there's some degree of selling either yourself or a service, product or a idea. It's the "type" of selling and you know it. WES wants go for the wallet, get them while they're there, used car type sales people. I've been independant, too. We all know you have to be able to "sell" if you want to call it that, yourself & your design plan. No one's that stupid, so quit acting like they are. It's a smoke screen for the real deal which is hard ass selling based on what they like to call "killer greetings and rapport building relationship selling." What a crock of you know what! It's slick willy selling they want & that wouldn't fly in a one to one independant designer-client relationship.
If youre really have your own design business you'd know that and know the difference between what they want & what you do as a independant to get the project done. At WES, there's no project. It's a hard driving sales scene between a salesperson & a customer....not a designer & a client.

I am guessing you are related to the Smithes
as your comments are not objective and very emotional. I will not be responding anymore. Too busy. Too much work to do.

Are you kidding?!!! I'm not related and I'm not a "former disgruntled employee" who was fired! I just got tired of the drill & pressure! I resigned 8 years ago and started my own design business, which was very successful. I had to sell out to my partner to move because of my husbands job and have been in and out of the business for the last 2 years so I'd have more time for my kids. I think my comments are extremely objective having been at WES 5 years!

Hello, I have just interiewed at WES and wondering if I should be looking elsewhere. I was actually really excited about the position, but after reading all your comments I'm not so sure. I have always loved design but did not go to design school and thought this would be a good start at WES

Read all my comments "Former WES Designer in Chicago, Illinois". It's a great opportunity with the right attitude.

Liz, you are really exaggerating. There is no hard core 'hard selling'. The only pressure I felt was from myself to make my goals which were ALWAYS reasonable and easy to achieve. The hard part is exceeding the goals and really making good money, but it was never difficult to make the minimum goal over the course of a year. I averaged 125% of goal over the course of a year each of the 4 yrs I worked there. That didn't amount to making much money, but making the goals was not difficult. Some months I didn't make goal and others I super-exceeded the goal, so over time my avg was 125%. Again, a sales job is not for everyone's skill sets. You have to be a very positive person and appreciate the job itself. Obviously you didn't do any of that. And believe me, I'm not related to the Smithes and I wouldn't even say I'm fond of them. I just liked the job, had a great time there, and made some great friends there too.

Personally I did go through the "Process", they weeded me out on career day. I came from a hard core furniture sales atmosphere and I have been in the industry in various positions for years but, for some reason, I didn't have the qualifications compared to the dreamers of design. Also, I am of color and I noticed that many of the "designers" aren't hardly of my persuassion. And DO NOT tell me I'm playing a card. When I have experienced and seen it with my own eyes! So explain and prove that theory! Because I will go further with it!!!

I really don't have any proof that race was a factor. I do think that it was more or less an issue of them hiring people that they feel that they can hang out with, or that mirror their clients which are older and suburban, rural white women. However, in my training group there were 3 African-American women, and in the two groups ahead, there was one in each session. However, If racism was the case, I don't think that Walter E. Smithe would've hired a black man to be their General Manager of all of the stores. If race was an issue it wasn't coming from the top, more so the trainers.

That IS exactly what I was referring, I never said that I was African-American. You just assumed that, which just proves my theory. And "people that they can hang" with, or "reflect" their clientele????? That alone is racism. All of the people of color that I have talked to are NOT happy with the way they are treated at Walter E Smithe! And every company needs a "token" in case of lawsuite regarding the GM.

Done with this conversation...have a nice life.

Former WES Designer in Chicago, Illinois said: I worked at WES as a successful designer. It is 100% sales AND 100% design. You can't design if you can't sell, and you can't sell if you can't design. This goes for ANY type of business whether corporate, retail, or self-employment. I'm now a self employed interior decorator working out of my home. It doesn't matter how much I love design and how good I am at designing. If I can't 'sell' myself and my services to people I meet socially and at networking events, than I don't get the opportuity to be a designer. ALL businesses require the ability to sell yourself and your business. Once you understand this concept, your attitude about sales will change (it won't have a negative connotation), and you will enjoy selling and doing the design you love so much. Even as a designer, when you get a new client, there is a constant selling process going on -- you have to sell them on your floor plans and sell them on your furniture selections, etc. It's all sales, all the time. It's fun when you have the right outlook and attitude.

I also worked for WES, really enjoyed going through the design classes and really like the owners of WES. Interior design is something I always wanted to do! Thoroughly enjoy doing this type of work, for me it isn’t work. My challenge was with the store manager in Crystal Lake; I have an extensive background in corporate sales, and owned my own business for years. This was just a true passion for interior design. My first month after completing the training program, I sold over 30K. The store manager didn't like me or was just envious, she started giving me a hard time about the computer system. I had a client that was so excited about the transformation of her home; she just kept coming in to buy more based on my recommendations for each room. This also occurred with about 3 other clients. One purchase of a custom sofa (Victorian) with 8 different fabrics and chairs to match ove

10K for the sofa alone. The store manager on my day off changed the entire order and took credit for it; another words I didn’t get paid! I decided the mentality was just so childish that I resigned. It’s a shame that a manager would do that, if she has great sales people and they are doing great job, why would you do something like that, it is only going to make her look better overall! The Director of HR was wonderful; she called me to offer me another position at different store. But, the mentality of retail sales people is completely different, not professional at all they miss the whole picture. My option is they should have fired the store manager for this; she is only thwarting the sales of the store.

that happened to me in San Diego when I was working for Lane Furniture. The manager stole my sales and gave to another designer.
She accused me of oppressing people BUT of course she was just talking about herself. I quit and went on to make more money and she ended up leaving that store and working with plumbing biz with her husband. That was best for all. It's sad when you meet women that compete and never support each other.

everyone at WES thought that they were THE design resource. nothing could be further from the truth. the two design chicks in the training dept (in their 20s) with no design experience were much smarter than I! they made money and I didn't, because in the real world, a designer who tries to bring out their client's viison will be the winner. I am so much more successful with my core clients, than they could be with their limited client association.
anyway, creative design does not bloom in a stifled and barren environment. there is a lot more to be said for letting the design relationship grow. it builds.
WES has the polk brothers mentality: they only need to sell everyone in chicagoland once...they don't careif their clients come back.

Yes and that is the so called modern day business philosphy. Just make the money and run. It's everywhere, including all levels of government and that's why we are in the mess we are in now. So let's hope that attitude changes and is for the long haul. That way everybody wins. I always beleived in doing the best for my clients and trying to save them money if I could. I go back to commercial spaces done 20 years ago and the products are still wearing well.
So I am never ashamed to run into old clients but happy to see them
even if they are not buying at that time. It's all about pushing up not tearing down people.

I love design although I have no formal training-I dont even mind the sales aspect, but given our current economy, are people still buying that much furniture?

I worked for WES for 13 months. I always made goal, but their strategy is to keep adding designers to the floor, so that no one really can make goal or make the higher percentages of commission. Also, the story they make you recite about what good quality the furniture is and how it is never put together with staples is just lies. Their sofas are made of pine, particle board and staples just like Jennifer Convertibles, only 10x the price. Norwalk Furniture is a pretty low-grade brand. Also, the other designers were absolutely ruthless in trying to make splits out of every sale I had and the managers allowed it. It was a terrible place to work and I hope they tank in this current economy.

i just went through the career day at WES. it seemed like fun! what is the likelyhood they will call you back for the training?

I have been at WES for 5 years now. I never had any sales experience before starting here. My background was in Interior Design itself. I do have to say this IS a design job. Having had my own Interior Design firm before I do EXACTLY everything I did on my own, with the difference that I do write my own orders. I do not freak out about numbers, sales, proposals, splits, etc. I do my job, go in, present close the sale and it is done.

The average salary for a Interior Designer is 55-65K a year. I have to say I have FAR exceeded that working at Smithe. Ending up in the top 5 Designers for the company the last 4 years.

It is not a job if you want supplemental income. Your drive simply will not be there. You are your own boss, Smithe is just a facilitator.

And to the person that posted that Norwalk was crap....then don't sell it! No one is forcing you to sell what's on the floor. I work out of the smallest showroom in the company! We have almost nothing in our showroom!