BSMET vs. BSME

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NavyNuke89 in Goose Creek, South Carolina

70 months ago

I am currently attending Navy Nuclear Power School. I have about 5 years until I'm out on the job market, but I am trying to make the right decisions now. For the education I am receiving now, some colleges are willing to give 90+ credits towards an ABET accredited BSMET. However, from talking to some engineers I know, they strongly recommend going with a BSME degree. The problem with that is I haven't found any schools willing to accept my Navy training towards a BSME. My question is which degree would be best suited for an engineering position (possibly at an oil company)? If I get the BSMET would I be far from reaching a BSME or even a MS in Engineering Management or similar graduate degree? Thanks in advance for the help.

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kiarakitty in Laurel, Maryland

70 months ago

Most Engineering jobs will require the BSME. The technology degree you earn can be applied towards technician or supervisor jobs, but isn't accepted as suitable for an Engineer. I do not know of any former Navy nukes getting an Engineering job without going back to school for the full 4 year degree. I only know of a couple schools giving credit towards Navy training, but they only give out the BSMET degrees. You can still get a great job without the BSME degree.

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Carlos in Brooklyn, New York

68 months ago

I also inquired about the same thing. I'm alittle different from you. I was majoring in applied mathematics and minoring in physics and recently joined the navy. I asked many people about it and they said you can receive a BSMET degree. I would suggest doing the BSMET and then going back to school for the BSME when you leave the navy and you can still use the G.I bill. This is where I'm sorry to disappoint you, but the credits from the BSMET and navy nuke program aren't going to help you at an accredited engineering school. You would have to start from the beginning, but I still suggest doing the BSMET due to the fact that you study material such as thermodynamics, statics, fluid mechanics and etc. Since you have the practical training, it will help you in an engineering program. I hope this helps.

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WilliamAS in ashland, Massachusetts

68 months ago

The BSMET is every bit as good as a BSME for all practical purposes. A BSMET, if duly accredited, qualifies you for any job requiring a BSME. This is a fact. The difference lies in two areas. One, the BSME will allow seamless academic advancement to the PhD. And, two, it is a longer program, more hours, therefore a higher tally in the experience column. I don't know about other states, but in Massachusetts the BSMET is suitable education toward the PE certification. One just needs more experience under one's belt if you don't have the BSME. Again, the difference is more time of learning vs. breath of exposure. The BSMET is what The Wentworth Institute of Technology in Massachusetts has been awarding for decades. There are thousands of Wentworth engineers. Even the US government, which at one time discounted technology degrees out right, says it is acceptable if you can show you have had certain courses (i.e., differential equations) you qualify. Here the government is trying to separate the BSMET’s from the BMET’s.

I think there is still much confusion surrounding the technology degree. One important source of confusion is the BSMET vs. the BMET. Some think they are the same. The difference here is mush greater than between the BSMET vs. the BSME. Don't even consider a BMET (waste of time). The BS signifies a theoretical education.

Don't let anyone fool you. The BSMET is equivalent to the BSME for all practical purposes. Universities that offer both try very hard to distinguish between the two. The reality is many engineers have the BSMET. If you want a PhD in engineering get the BSME, that’s the only way. If you want to stay below that get a BSMET or MSMET (don't think you can get a PhD in MET).

Remember, in the real world, experience counts more than anything. The BSMET will get you in the door and you perform from there.

. . . find your own road.

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Underwater Pirate in Buffalo, New York

66 months ago

It would depend on your eventual goal. For example, in New York, to attain a PE license either will work. The difference is just how much school vs. experience the credit you get toward their 12 year requirement. Currently, with a BSME you get 8 years credit and with the BSMET, 6. It is similar if you want to get into New York Civil Service as an engineer; both will get you in the door and lead to a PE license. A lot of state/county/municipal jobs seem to be that way. You don't need pay a guy is qualified to design the next space shuttle to design a physical plant for the community college.
It also looks like BSMET programs may be fading away. The current program that I'm in, at SUNY College at Buffalo, has been slowly morphing from a BTMET towards a BSME (currently BSMET).
In hind sight, I wish I went straight into a BSME program at the beginning. As a part time student, by the time I get done with my degree, a BSMET may not mean anything. The academics are more of a bugger, but it the end many more doors may be open.
Next, some free advice - Take everything thing you can towards your degree while you're in the Navy. You may even be able to get your degree before you get out with DANTES, CLEP, etc.
(Said as I kick myself in the rear in hind sight - MM2/SS, Naval Nuclear Power School class 9307)

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Paul in Newport, Rhode Island

56 months ago

RPI used to take enlisted powerschool credits towards a BS in nuclear engineering and/or engineering physiscs. I'm not sure if they still accept the credit, but if they do you could easily transfer a portion towards a ME degree instead. I know a few instructors at prototype were doing this program, as well as a few mechanics on my boat.
catalog.rpi.edu/preview_program.php?catoid=5&poid=1098&bc=1

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Steve in Gibsonia, Pennsylvania

54 months ago

NavyNuke89 in Goose Creek, South Carolina said: I am currently attending Navy Nuclear Power School. I have about 5 years until I'm out on the job market, but I am trying to make the right decisions now. For the education I am receiving now, some colleges are willing to give 90+ credits towards an ABET accredited BSMET. However, from talking to some engineers I know, they strongly recommend going with a BSME degree. The problem with that is I haven't found any schools willing to accept my Navy training towards a BSME. My question is which degree would be best suited for an engineering position (possibly at an oil company)? If I get the BSMET would I be far from reaching a BSME or even a MS in Engineering Management or similar graduate degree? Thanks in advance for the help.

I'm a former Navy Nuke and I have a BSMET. I am currently a Sr. design engineer at Westinghouse.

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Travis in Littleton, Colorado

52 months ago

I have a BSMET and sometimes wish I would have gotten a BSME instead. The problem I've had is that outside of the state that I got my degree people are unsure about the BSMET. In-state people prefer the BSMET because engineering is a hands on activity and BSMET's education is more hands on. Also when people hear technology they think of a school along the lines of ITT Tech and Devry. These programs don't hold the same accreditation though.

To tell you the difference in the education, the beginning classes are a bit different for a BSMET (easier). For instance you can take Physics 100 level instead of 200 level. The difference here is that 200 level physics at my school involved calculus whereas the 100 level did not. You also can take 100 level chemistry instead of 200 level. I actually chose to take the 200 level classes just because they were easier to get into. We also had to take 3 terms of calculus and one elective math class (differential equations is what I took). I think the BSME students have to take 4 calc courses and no elective but I'm not sure.

Once you get into your engineering classes the difference swings towards the Technology degree because you will have more time in a lab setting than your theoretical counterparts. I took the same classes as a friend but I'd have to go to lab 3 hours a week in that class whereas he didn't. I think this experience is valuable.

In Oregon you can become a PE with either degree. I also got into a top tier graduate school and am working on my Engineering Management Masters right now.

In all I wish the BSMET degree was more widely known and not associated with Devry and ITT Tech. If you want a more well known and in some cases respected (although there's no reason why it should be more respected) degree than go with the BSME.

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DickJNY

51 months ago

I went to work as a production drafter in 1972 out of the Navy and went to school nights. Graduated in 1981 with a BSMET. I worked as an engineer at the same place until April 2010 when I was terminated. I'm now 2 months without a job and no real hits on applications I've made. Maybe it's my degree, maybe it's age discrimination and maybe it's just that the job market is so flooded with people right now that the employers have their pick. Wish I'd gone to work for my self years ago. At least then I'd be rewarded for what I did, not someone else.
I am going back to school to take Solidworks and look for a design FEA job.

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Dan S in Elkhart, Indiana

51 months ago

I have a BSMET from Purdue. But, I prefer the BSME degree. That's why I have several BSME's working for me :) But in all seriousness.....when I graduated in 1994, the BSMET was not accepted into interviews for all positions where BSME was required. So yes, BSME will open more doors...but once you are in the door, your hard work and performance will get you ahead. I agree with WilliamAS: Study hard, push hard, and accept any job/task assigned to you with enthusiasm. Do this, and you will get promotoed ahead of the BSME's, even those BSME's who have more years of experience. Good luck to all BSMET's....you'll learn the math, and you'll get your hands a little dirty in the lab. That's "real world" education you can use.

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Q in Newport News, Virginia

50 months ago

I have a BSMET from South Carolina State University. I currently work for a defense contractor with no problems with my degree, however, some employers due draw a difference between the two. However I currently attend ODU to obtain a M.S.M.E and only have to make up a couple of courses from the undergrad level before I start taking classes in the graduate program.

I say that you look at ODU for using your navy nuc experience since I know a lot of them have gone to ODU for their engineering degrees at my job. Also, take Calculus 1-3 and Differential equations, and you will be on the same level math wise as any engineer. I don't regret my BSMET at all, actually i am thankful for the hands on experience it provided me, however, now i'm going back to squash all notions by obtaining my MSME.

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someguy in Cheney, Washington

48 months ago

Steve in Gibsonia, Pennsylvania said: I'm a former Navy Nuke and I have a BSMET. I am currently a Sr. design engineer at Westinghouse.

I'm glad to see this, because I am myself going for a BSMET and Westinghouse is one of the companies that I am interested in. Seeing that someone else with the BSMET is at that company makes me feel a little more comfortable. I was actually worried, because I've been looking at job adds and they all say they want a BSME.

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j-rizzle in Vienna, Virginia

47 months ago

I have a BSMET as well and havn't had trouble stepping my foot into federal contractors either.

I used to have the same MET vs ME delima while I was in my undergrads as well, but i think some people are just putting too much emphasis on what each of them are. At the end, I believe the MET degree is more valuable in creating a useful engineer in most cases. You learn about actual systems and cycles used in the word.

There are companies out there that will look down on an BSMET degree, but thats fine if you just go ahead and and take the FE.

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Herr-Kuhn in Fort Thomas, Kentucky

46 months ago

I've done a lot of reading on the arguements between ME and MET. Myself, I'm an MET graduate from University of Pittsburgh at Johnstown (UPJ) and I also have an MBA. What everybody needs to realize is that all MET degrees are not alike, just like all ME degrees are not alike. Would an ME from MIT be able to more quickly locate a job in research than a graduate from say, Pitt with the same degree? Probably so, and the same holds true for MET...some programs are better than others. People who INSIST that an MET degree is not a real engineering degree are simply buying into the arrogance floating around out there. No doubt the straight ME degree is somewhat more theoretical than most METs, but chances are there are VERY few MEs actually doing things like writing CFD programs or the like, rather they are USING already made software for the tasks. On the subject of PE licencing. Most states will allow METs to get a PE licence, but there are some exceptions. A PE licence would be more required for someone in Civil Engineering as compared to Mechanical Engineering so many guys don't bother with it to begin with.

There are a couple of reality checks that these naysayers need to realize. It's hard work, innovation and disciplie that will get you ahead in the workplace...your degree does nothing more than open the door for you. All this talk about sr. level jobs and promotions is hearsay...in the world I've worked in you'll need an advanced degree to get those roles to begin with...likely an MS or MBA, etc. Assuming you'll greatly outpace a BSMET with your BSME just because of your degree is really laughable. When was the last time you saw someone get a promotion because they entered the company with a certain degree? It takes hard work to get there on either side and that's a fact. I've held positions as an Engineer, Product Line Engineer, Product Manager and Director's positions as a result of my education, but mainly because of good old fashioned hard work

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Herr-Kuhn in Fort Thomas, Kentucky

46 months ago

WilliamAS in ashland, Massachusetts said: The BSMET is every bit as good as a BSME for all practical purposes. A BSMET, if duly accredited, qualifies you for any job requiring a BSME. This is a fact. The difference lies in two areas. One, the BSME will allow seamless academic advancement to the PhD. And, two, it is a longer program, more hours, therefore a higher tally in the experience column. I don't know about other states, but in Massachusetts the BSMET is suitable education toward the PE certification. One just needs more experience under one's belt if you don't have the BSME. Again, the difference is more time of learning vs. breath of exposure. The BSMET is what The Wentworth Institute of Technology in Massachusetts has been awarding for decades. There are thousands of Wentworth engineers. Even the US government, which at one time discounted technology degrees out right, says it is acceptable if you can show you have had certain courses (i.e., differential equations) you qualify. Here the government is trying to separate the BSMET’s from the BMET’s.

I think there is still much confusion surrounding the technology degree. One important source of confusion is the BSMET vs. the BMET. Some think they are the same. The difference here is mush greater than between the BSMET vs. the BSME. Don't even consider a BMET (waste of time). The BS signifies a theoretical education.

Don't let anyone fool you. The BSMET is equivalent to the BSME for all practical purposes. Universities that offer both try very hard to distinguish between the two. The reality is many engineers have the BSMET. If you want a PhD in engineering get the BSME, that’s the only way. If you want to stay below that get a BSMET or MSMET (don't think you can get a PhD in MET).

Remember, in the real world, experience counts more than anything. The BSMET will get you in the door and you perform from there.

. . . find your own road.

ALL EXCELLENT POINTS WILLIAM!

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madmack692 in Evans City, Pennsylvania

45 months ago

I have a BSMET and my EIT. I have applied for jobs at Westinghouse for about 2 years and I haven't even gotten an interview. (several people I graduated with work there, don't know how they got in...)

I thought the BSMET degree would offer a better ROI for me than the BSME. I didn't have the math background, and thought that the extra year or two (not to mention the 15-25k) I would need to get through the BSME wouldn't be worth it. Especially since every job description says they want at least 5 years exp. required and BSMET prepares you to work right out of school with no training. Should have done the BSME.

Instead of another bachelors, I am currently taking pre-req courses (undergrad bsme courses) so I can start a masters degree. So far, they are 80-90% of what the BSMET classes where. I even used the same book this past semester.

The problem with engineering technology is everyone thinks you went to triangle tech for 9 months. In industry there really is no difference. I have used calculus a few times at work. Most of the BSME's couldn't solve a derivative because its been so long since they've used it. But, with there being more workers than jobs, I fear that a BSE will beat a BSET everytime.

My advice would be to go with the BSE. If you suck at math, go to community college and learn it. If its going to take you 5 or 6 years to get through college, 3-4 better be at community college. If you want to do "hands on" a BSE won't stop you, if you want to get an engineering job w/ a BSET, you may have trouble. The PE will help you, but with groups of morons like the society of professional engineers, who think the sole purpose of engineering licensure is to provide exclusivity rather than safe guard public wellfare, there may be a time when BSET's can't even sit for the exam.

I would like to see schools offer a distance program where you can take bridge courses and turn a BSET into a BSE. Probably wishful thinking.

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Herr-Kuhn in Fort Thomas, Kentucky

45 months ago

All good comments above. Back in 1993 when I graduated there was not this "movement" to try and prohibit the T guys from taking the EIT exam. As I understand it many are trying to keep Ts from being able to take the EIT right out of school now. It's academia types behind this sort of thing, because afterall, if an MET can pass the FE exam the same as an ME, how is one supposed to be able to differentiate between the two? I highly doubt you'll see programs allowing transfer between two locations towards the E degree...it gets back to the academic types. If you look at the straight E requirements, the only real difference in accredidation is in the requirement for the higher level math courses (dif eq, etc.)

I like your comments on the triangle tech comment...way too true. Many MET and ET programs in general do require the same math classes as the straight E programs. In my case, this was true. But don't try to transfer coursed from UPJ to Pitt Main Campus...it won't work. Remember, university is a business after all.

The real crux of the issue with the T programs these days is that there are a lot of lower end corner schools offering the degrees...but these are not TAC/ABET certified programs...so their resume looks the same as your's, even though they may not have had 50% of what a graduate from an accredited MET has.

Still, in the end it is your hard work and dedication that will get you ahead in life. I don't at all doubt that an ME may open more doors initially than an MET, but after several years the pay range is about equal and by then your experience is looked at before your schooling is anyway.

Both degrees offer you ample opportunities in industry.

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Herr-Kuhn in Fort Thomas, Kentucky

45 months ago

I thought I would add in the criteria by which each of the two programs is judged:

Straight Engineering:
www.abet.org/Linked%20Documents-UPDATE/Criteria%20and%20PP/E001%2008-09%20EAC%20Criteria%2012-04-07.pdf

Engineering Technology:
www.abet.org/Linked%20Documents-UPDATE/Criteria%20and%20PP/T001%2009-10%20TAC%20Criteria%208-27-09.pdf

You can see by reading these that there could be a wide range between the two, or worse yet a wide range between the same degree from two different engineering schools...for example, MIT vs Pitt.

Hope this information is of use.

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Bob in Ambridge, Pennsylvania

45 months ago

Degree does not matter in some cases if you are in the right clique. They will place people having philosophy, art, political science, music or biology degrees - as engineers.

The degree type "required" depends on the hiring management. If you fall out of favor, your nontechnical degree and inexperience will later be a downfall and a potential reason to not promote you or to "redeploy" you.

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Herr-Kuhn in Fort Thomas, Kentucky

45 months ago

Bob...You're comparing an apple to an orange. This is about two forms of engineering degrees, not comparing an engineering degree to a non-technical degree. Honestly, after several years of industry experience, I can't see most places making much fuss between an ME or MET unless it's more of a pure research type role. On the job accomplishments typically carry more weight than a degree form a certain school.

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madmack692 in Evans City, Pennsylvania

44 months ago

I agree Bob,
A BSET is always good enough if you know someone.
I attempted to address this in my previous statement, but probably did a poor job. I just think if an HR rep at the XYZ company is taking resumes for a mechanical engineer and they see that you have a tech. degree, they may think "we need someone with a bachelors degree" or "we have 500 applicants, 300 have technology degrees, 150 have engineering degrees and 50 have masters degrees, lets put a list together of the top 20". How many BSET's will be on that list? I am sure if you had a near identical job at your current place of employment and applied, your experience would matter more than your degree and you may at least get an interview. Or if there was a huge demand for engineers, companies would probably be less selective.
It all comes back to the lack of jobs. Everytime there is a recession more engineering jobs go over seas. The job market is so bad that I have gotten weeded out before the interview process started because I use inventor and they want someone with solidworks experience. Same for FEA packages. But to HR departments, If you can't hit the ground running forget it.
I always laugh when I see a job posting like "must have 20+ years experience with underwater stainless steel pumps with ceramic impellers. Must be reguarded as an expert within the industry" and you think yeah right and apply anyway and then you never hear anything but the same job posting shows up again and again and again every few weeks. Or you apply for a job online (most places don't even take applications in person its all online) and you get an e-mail a minute after you submit it saying you aren't a good candidate but they will keep your resume on file. I bet half the time some computer weeds you out and noone even looks at your resume. What a joke.
If anyone out there is thinking of being an engineer my advice would be to look into being an actuary, dentist, teacher or IT professional.

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Tek Lentine in Greenwood, Indiana

36 months ago

I currently hold an ASMET degree from Purdue University and work as a Design Engineer. I work side by side with both BSME and BSMET majors in the manufacturing industry.

However, I've gone as high as I can with my current degree. The engineering managers and directors at my company hold PE licenses. This is definitely a differentiating factor between my current level and the next level.

In Indiana, a BSMET degree does not qualify to sit for the PE exam. However, if a certain number of calculus-based math and engineering classes are substituted for the requirements of the BSMET degree, then a BSMET major may sit for the exam. I am a senior in the BSMET program at Purdue University, and have made the necessary substitutions to sit for the EIT (FE) exam this coming October.

The moral is this. While some companies may turn their noses up at a BSMET degree, do not fret. Just make sure that you will qualify for a PE license upon attainment of your degree. The PE license is widely respected and will trump any disadvantage the a technology degree has vs an engineering degree.

Even better, continue on to an MBA or MSE degree and then really blow your competition out of the water. The job market is brutal right now, and it's those individuals with advanced degrees and credentials that will land the good jobs. Don't split hairs over BSMET and BSME degrees when it is the higher degrees and credentials that you should be worried about.

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Oil and Gas Employee in Houston, Texas

35 months ago

I am a graduate of The University of Houston College of Technology with a Bachelor of Science in Mechanical Technology. I am currently employed for the last 8 years with one of the world's top 10 Oil and Gas companies. I was recently promoted to a position of Senior Engineer and am on par (position and salary) with BSME graduates. I have also completed a MBA and am preparing to sit the PE exam next year.

I can appreciate the decision of which program to pursue is a difficult one, however, I worked through the ranks from technician to supervisor until I decided to further my tertiary education albeit on a part time basis. I can assure you the experience I gained from my years of prior work experience has certainly given me a pragmatic edge over the BSME folks.

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ZJ4LIFE in Riverside, California

34 months ago

NavyNuke89 in Goose Creek, South Carolina said: I am currently attending Navy Nuclear Power School. I have about 5 years until I'm out on the job market, but I am trying to make the right decisions now. For the education I am receiving now, some colleges are willing to give 90+ credits towards an ABET accredited BSMET. However, from talking to some engineers I know, they strongly recommend going with a BSME degree. The problem with that is I haven't found any schools willing to accept my Navy training towards a BSME. My question is which degree would be best suited for an engineering position (possibly at an oil company)? If I get the BSMET would I be far from reaching a BSME or even a MS in Engineering Management or similar graduate degree? Thanks in advance for the help.

I think the fact that you are having a problem finding schools that transfer your credits toward a BSME should clue you in on the differences and how the industry must value a BSME vs BSMET. From what I researched, the main difference is ME you must understand principles to the point that you must be able to derive equations that govern a particular phenomenon VERSUS just being able to plug in numbers to already derived equations with basic conceptual knowledge (MET). It doesn't take a genius to plug in numbers and employers know this. They want people who really understand what it is thier doing. OF COURSE, there are a number of engineering jobs out there that are more hands-on/technical vs design/research that an MET grad would easily be able to handle. You would be limited on what you could do. Pay is not as great but its not bad either from what I've researched.

Best explaination would be that MEs are the designers/inventors and METs are the FOLLOW-BLUEPRINT-AND-BUILD. Keep in mind that employers know the difference.

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Herr-Kuhn in Fort Thomas, Kentucky

34 months ago

To assume someone with an MET cannot do design and research is flat-out false. I hold a BSMET from the University of Pittsburgh and have held design roles and I also hold 2 US patents with a 3rd in process. I rarely followed a blueprint, rather I made my own designs and concepts and went from there. The few (if any) more courses in engineering and math a BSME program teaches over the BSMET will not cause a new graduate to have the order of magnitude more engineering prowess which you refer to. There are plenty of BSMETs that know what THEY'RE doing, thank you!

The issue with the BSMET degree these days sits with the number of 2 year poor quality corner schools passing them out. It wasn't that was 25 years ago.

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oilguy in Houston, Texas

34 months ago

The oil&gas corporation I work for won't give the title of mechanical engineer to a BSMET. They are interviewing only MS and PhD ME grads. A BSME grad won't get in the door right now. BSMET grads where I work are all mechanical designers. It's actually easier for a BSMET to get work here than a BSME, but the title will not be Mechanical Engineer. Management attitude is basically that you aren't really an engineer unless you have the BSME or higher. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, that's just the outlook where I work.

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Student deciding between BSMET and BSME in Tomball, Texas

33 months ago

Oil and Gas Employee in Houston, Texas said: I am a graduate of The University of Houston College of Technology with a Bachelor of Science in Mechanical Technology. I am currently employed for the last 8 years with one of the world's top 10 Oil and Gas companies. I was recently promoted to a position of Senior Engineer and am on par (position and salary) with BSME graduates. I have also completed a MBA and am preparing to sit the PE exam next year.

I can appreciate the decision of which program to pursue is a difficult one, however, I worked through the ranks from technician to supervisor until I decided to further my tertiary education albeit on a part time basis. I can assure you the experience I gained from my years of prior work experience has certainly given me a pragmatic edge over the BSME folks.

This company that you work for, they consider you an authentic engineer? Aren't you limited in regards to making new ideas and designing them? From my understanding BSMET applies what has already been invented, and from what I've read if you move to another state or country with your BSMET you won't be recognized as an engineer and you would have to go back to school. nhgs.tec.va.us/~jbridges/GAITE%20ES/Workshop%20Handouts%2011.15.08.pdf this is a link explaining the differences what do you think about them?

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jiwat in Hot Springs National Park, Arkansas

32 months ago

I earned a ASMET and was continuing to a BSMET. My passion is Aerospace. I tried to get internships an nothing. I switched to a BSME program and a year later I I have received two offers, one from The Beoing Company Space, Defense and Security in St. Louis and the other from United Launch Alliance. All before Christmas 2011.

Now you tell me if there is a difference. Oil industry and manufacturing a BSMET will suffice. But Aerospace you better have a ME degree or they will not look at you. Besides do you want some one that takes many algebra based courses, no offense, designing your planes and space vehicles.

There is a huge difference in plugging the numbers in and getting and answer and knowing if the answer is right. A BSMET can tell you if the Fluid, Statics, Thermo, Mechanics are all right but they cant tell you why.

There are huge difference in the courses. Fluid Mechanics is far more entailing than is taught in a BSMET course. You only have to look into lift and drag, turbulence and the Navier Stokes Equations.

Each has there own place. But a ME will know more and go further.

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Bucko in Erie, Pennsylvania

32 months ago

Amen.

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Herr-Kuhn in Cincinnati, Ohio

32 months ago

Navier Stokes, yup covered that in my BSMET advanced fluids course. Also wrote some of our own CFD code and that's a fact. The ET programs at Pitt require 3 calculus courses and a course in Diff EQ. Yup, calculus based equations used at Pitt in the MET program (beam deflection, etc.). I love the way the still wet behind the ear BSME boys think they are going to be doing long winded creation of equations in an academic setting. Wake up, you'll be using software and mostly previously created equations. Stop assuming a BSMET has no clue, because many of them do and can calculate and arrive at solutions just as easily as you do. They may actually also understand the fundamentals.

I still can't believe some of you guys actually think because you have a straight BSME degree that you "know more" and will "go further". Listen to someone who has worked nearly 20 years in industry...you will need an advanced degree to advance regardless of the field and in addition you still have to prove yourself with fact based RESULTS. A degree opens the door, the rest is up to you and you have to PERFORM! Nobody looks as two candidates and determines who to advance simply by their undergraduate degree. If you believe your degree will automatically get you future promotions, you are in for a rude awakening. While you're at it, it would be a good idea to learn office politics as well...you'll need that to get ahead too.

I'm glad to know that you believe your BSME degree qualifies you to design aircraft right out of school. You clearly have some proving to do before they let you come close to TOUCHING a critical aircraft part my friend.

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The Facts in Statesboro, Georgia

31 months ago

I have 30 years of experience in the international engineering and construction industry, and I have an undergrad in CE, two master's degrees in management, an earned PhD in CE and an earned PhD in economics - all from top accredited schools in the US. My firm only hires PhDs because a lesser educated person does not have the academic qualifications / basic understanding to complete the high level work we complete. Many types of work simply cannot be learned "on the job." In addition, I have taught both CE, CET, ME, and MET courses as an adjunct for 10 years (at the BS - PhD levels). That being said, I can assure you that in all schools of which I am aware, there is NO difference between the BS in engineering and BS in engineering technology, outside of a single course - differential equations, a course that any ET student could easily pass as they do with their other classes.

In nearly all cases, students take the same idential courses, including the calculus courses (2-3 courses). They both complete calculus based physics courses (3 courses), and all of their engineering or ET courses are calculus based. Trust me, I have taught this same students in the same manner, using the same exact criteria and methods for over 10 years.

There is no difference between the two. So, from a engineering graduate, don't become boastful because your transcript reads engineering as opposed to engineering technology. They are identical, and either will qualify you for industry or consulting AND an MS or PhD program.

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Herr-Kuhn in Cincinnati, Ohio

31 months ago

Finally...someone who is qualified to weigh in on the subject....in lbm, of course ;)

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TheBrotherDuck

31 months ago

I am taking coursework in a BSMET program. I work as a manufacturing engineer; because of work obligations and the limited academic programs in my area I could not attend a BSME program.

Is there a program that would allow me to progress from a BSMET to either a BSME or a MSME degree? I know that bridge coursework, e.g. advanced calculus, calculus based physics, calculus based engineer mechanics would be required.

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madmack692 in Zelienople, Pennsylvania

31 months ago

No, I searched for years. There are no bridge courses, and most schools will laugh at you when you try to apply for a masters. I finally got distgusted, quit my job and I am currently finishing the BSME. It is terrible the lack of night courses. If you aren't too far along, you may want to consider switching to a BSME. UND offers an abet accredited degree online. You may want to try them.
If all else fails, try to take the regular calc, calc based physics and as many regular ME classes as possible. They should count for MET classes.

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madmack692 in Zelienople, Pennsylvania

31 months ago

The Facts in Statesboro, Georgia said: I have 30 years of experience in the international engineering and construction industry, and I have an undergrad in CE, two master's degrees in management, an earned PhD in CE and an earned PhD in economics - all from top accredited schools in the US. My firm only hires PhDs because a lesser educated person does not have the academic qualifications / basic understanding to complete the high level work we complete. Many types of work simply cannot be learned "on the job." In addition, I have taught both CE, CET, ME, and MET courses as an adjunct for 10 years (at the BS - PhD levels). That being said, I can assure you that in all schools of which I am aware, there is NO difference between the BS in engineering and BS in engineering technology, outside of a single course - differential equations, a course that any ET student could easily pass as they do with their other classes.

In nearly all cases, students take the same idential courses, including the calculus courses (2-3 courses). They both complete calculus based physics courses (3 courses), and all of their engineering or ET courses are calculus based. Trust me, I have taught this same students in the same manner, using the same exact criteria and methods for over 10 years.

There is no difference between the two. So, from a engineering graduate, don't become boastful because your transcript reads engineering as opposed to engineering technology. They are identical, and either will qualify you for industry or consulting AND an MS or PhD program.

Id like to know where an MET can apply for an MS or PHD program. I have tried for years and was turned down by all schools in the area.

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TheBrotherDuck

31 months ago

madmack692 in Zelienople, Pennsylvania said: No, I searched for years. There are no bridge courses, and most schools will laugh at you when you try to apply for a masters. I finally got distgusted, quit my job and I am currently finishing the BSME. It is terrible the lack of night courses. If you aren't too far along, you may want to consider switching to a BSME. UND offers an abet accredited degree online. You may want to try them.
If all else fails, try to take the regular calc, calc based physics and as many regular ME classes as possible. They should count for MET classes.

Thank you for your reply. I have reviewed the UND program, but it is very cost prohibitive. There are two schools within driving distance, one 40 minutes the other 70 minutes, to my home and work. I consulted both of them and was told that neither had night classes in their BSME programs, and neither would look favorably on a candidate for upper level classes that was not a full time student. I understand they are expecting a commitment to the program, but some people are working adults with family commitments and not young adults straight out of high school.
I have seen a couple of masters of engineering (MSE) programs that "advertise" about accepting ET graduates; however, when you look at the "meat and potatoes" of these programs, there really nothing more than Engineering Management programs. One school I have looked at UW Stout does have a MS of Manufacturing Engineering that will accept candidates with an engineering technology BS degree. At this point this is an acceptable alternative for me; however probably not to others here.

Some people have talked about PE registration for both BSME and BSMET. My state (TN) is one that will not allow you to sit for the PE exam without a BSME degree. Would a comparable registration for BSMET graduates (not NICET) make a difference?

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workforit in York, Pennsylvania

30 months ago

While some employers may act out of simple policy prejudice, there are many others who will be more thorough.
I obtained a Technolgy Degree (Electromechanical Engineering Technology Degree from Penn State).
During those years as an adult student with a family I worked full time and also attended college full time. 4MET and 4EMET and 4ME students sat in the same classes learning the same content. (I admit there were just a couple where the 4ME students had an extra 1 hour session during the week.)
As a technology student I worked to learn and retain EVERY bit of information to which I had access during those years, graduating with a 3.94 GPA. I provided TUTORING for several of those shared classes including calculus, differential equations, physics (x2), statics, dynamics, thermodynamics, etc. I had THE highest scores in very nearly all of those technical classes. Yes, I tutored ME students.
Years later, I work as an engineer and provide my specific expertise to customer's ME's, EE's, and PhD's during design and production phases for medical, aerospace etc. I present clear data, methodology, conclusions, suggestions and strategies so have only ever been asked once or twice by those customers what specific degree I had (small talk).
The point is not to declare "yeah me."
The point is to assert that while one additional or missing letter might make a difference in opening a few of the first doors, what one has actually accomplished with one's knowledge is more important.
Graduating with C's from an ME program, perhaps not even retaining content, does not provide a free pass.
Knowledge applied successfully during years of responsible ongoing professional development will lead to a successful career.
Their are brilliant hard workers with each type of degree.
Many people have limited access. Qualify the school; qualify the programs more diligently; learn everything!
(If you want to demonstrate your exceptional degree, use proper grammar and punctuation.)

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workforit in York, Pennsylvania

30 months ago

While some employers may act out of simple policy prejudice, there are many others who will be more thorough.
I obtained a Technolgy Degree (Electromechanical Engineering Technology Degree from Penn State).
During those years as an adult student with a family I worked full time and also attended college full time. 4MET and 4EMET and 4ME students sat in the same classes learning the same content. (I admit there were just a couple where the 4ME students had an extra 1 hour session during the week.)
As a technology student I worked to learn and retain EVERY bit of information to which I had access during those years, graduating with a 3.94 GPA. I provided TUTORING for several of those shared classes including calculus, differential equations, physics (x2), statics, dynamics, thermodynamics, etc. I had THE highest scores in very nearly all of those technical classes. Yes, I tutored ME students.
Years later, I work as an engineer and provide my specific expertise to customer's ME's, EE's, and PhD's during design and production phases for medical, aerospace etc. I present clear data, methodology, conclusions, suggestions and strategies so have only ever been asked once or twice by those customers what specific degree I had (small talk).
The point is not to declare "yeah me."
The point is to assert that while one additional or missing letter might make a difference in opening a few of the first doors, what one has actually accomplished with one's knowledge is more important.
Graduating with C's from an ME program, perhaps not even retaining content, does not provide a free pass.
Knowledge applied successfully during years of responsible ongoing professional development will lead to a successful career.
Their are brilliant hard workers with each type of degree.
Many people have limited access. Qualify the school; qualify the programs more diligently; learn everything!
(If you want to demonstrate your exceptional degree, use proper grammar and punctuation.)

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workforit in York, Pennsylvania

30 months ago

While some employers may act out of simple policy prejudice, there are many others who will be more thorough.
I obtained a Technolgy Degree (Electromechanical Engineering Technology Degree from Penn State).
During those years as an adult student with a family I worked full time and also attended college full time. 4MET and 4EMET and 4ME students sat in the same classes learning the same content. (I admit there were just a couple where the 4ME students had an extra 1 hour session during the week.)
As a technology student I worked to learn and retain EVERY bit of information to which I had access during those years, graduating with a 3.94 GPA. I provided TUTORING for several of those shared classes including calculus, differential equations, physics (x2), statics, dynamics, thermodynamics, etc. I had THE highest scores in very nearly all of those technical classes. Yes, I tutored ME students.
Years later, I work as an engineer and provide my specific expertise to customer's ME's, EE's, and PhD's during design and production phases for medical, aerospace etc. I present clear data, methodology, conclusions, suggestions and strategies so have only ever been asked once or twice by those customers what specific degree I had (small talk).
The point is not to declare "yeah me."
The point is to assert that while one additional or missing letter might make a difference in opening a few of the first doors, what one has actually accomplished with one's knowledge is more important.
Graduating with C's from an ME program, perhaps not even retaining content, does not provide a free pass.
Knowledge applied successfully during years of responsible ongoing professional development will lead to a successful career.
Their are brilliant hard workers with each type of degree.
Many people have limited access. Qualify the school; qualify the programs more diligently; learn everything!
(If you want to demonstrate your exceptional degree, use proper grammar and punctuation.)

- Was this comment helpful? Yes / No Reply - Report abuse

workforit in York, Pennsylvania

30 months ago

While some employers may act out of simple policy prejudice, there are many others who will be more thorough.
I obtained a Technolgy Degree (Electromechanical Engineering Technology Degree from Penn State).
During those years as an adult student with a family I worked full time and also attended college full time. 4MET and 4EMET and 4ME students sat in the same classes learning the same content. (I admit there were just a couple where the 4ME students had an extra 1 hour session during the week.)
As a technology student I worked to learn and retain EVERY bit of information to which I had access during those years, graduating with a 3.94 GPA. I provided TUTORING for several of those shared classes including calculus, differential equations, physics (x2), statics, dynamics, thermodynamics, etc. I had THE highest scores in very nearly all of those technical classes. Yes, I tutored ME students.
Years later, I work as an engineer and provide my specific expertise to customer's ME's, EE's, and PhD's during design and production phases for medical, aerospace etc. I present clear data, methodology, conclusions, suggestions and strategies so have only ever been asked once or twice by those customers what specific degree I had (small talk).
The point is not to declare "yeah me."
The point is to assert that while one additional or missing letter might make a difference in opening a few of the first doors, what one has actually accomplished with one's knowledge is more important.
Graduating with C's from an ME program, perhaps not even retaining content, does not provide a free pass.
Knowledge applied successfully during years of responsible ongoing professional development will lead to a successful career.
Their are brilliant hard workers with each type of degree.
Many people have limited access. Qualify the school; qualify the programs more diligently; learn everything!
(If you want to demonstrate your exceptional degree, use proper grammar and punctuation.)

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workforit in York, Pennsylvania

30 months ago

workforit in York, Pennsylvania said:
...lead to a successful career.
Their are ...

I meant "there."
I only selected submit one time so apologize for the multiple postings 0 minutes apart.

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The Facts in Statesboro, Georgia

29 months ago

madmack692 in Zelienople, Pennsylvania said: Id like to know where an MET can apply for an MS or PHD program. I have tried for years and was turned down by all schools in the area.

There are multiple universitites that will accept MET graduates into ME graduate programs. I am not aware of any who will not. Admissions decisions are not made based upon the fact that your transcript says MET over ME, there are several factors. However, in most cases you are required to either 1) have successfully passed certain courses in an MET program, such as the Calculus (2-3), Physics (3), Statics, Dynamics, Mechanics, etc, as well as all of your MET courses, such as Thermodynamics, etc. OR 2) make up for any deficiencies in your graduate program (MS or PhD). If your undergraduate GPA is acceptable (GPA=2.5+, depending on the school) and your coursework was analogous to that of a regualr MET/ME program, you should be accepted.

There are lots of online MS degree programs in various engineering disciplines today, as well. Consider Purdue University, Penn State University, Georgia Tech, etc..... Go to: www.gradschools.com/search-programs/engineering

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madmack692 in Erie, Pennsylvania

29 months ago

The Facts in Statesboro, Georgia said: There are multiple universitites that will accept MET graduates into ME graduate programs. I am not aware of any who will not. Admissions decisions are not made based upon the fact that your transcript says MET over ME, there are several factors. However, in most cases you are required to either 1) have successfully passed certain courses in an MET program, such as the Calculus (2-3), Physics (3), Statics, Dynamics, Mechanics, etc, as well as all of your MET courses, such as Thermodynamics, etc. OR 2) make up for any deficiencies in your graduate program (MS or PhD). If your undergraduate GPA is acceptable (GPA=2.5+, depending on the school) and your coursework was analogous to that of a regualr MET/ME program, you should be accepted.

There are lots of online MS degree programs in various engineering disciplines today, as well. Consider Purdue University, Penn State University, Georgia Tech, etc..... Go to: www.gradschools.com/search-programs/engineering

I graduated with a BSMET (3.1 GPA) from Penn State. My dear old alma matter would not accept me into their masters program. I got conditional acceptance to one school, and it was online. Im sure if I apply to companies and they see my MET with a masters degree online, my resume will be at the bottom of the pile, in the garbage, or weeded out by a computer before anyone sees it. At any rate, in order to even apply for the masters, I had to take a years worth of ME classes. And guess what, none were offered in the evening. I still have yet to hear anyone say "yeah, I had a BSMET and I went to xxxxx for my MSME." And after trying to find a decent job for 3 years, I just gave up and figured I would go to school till I could actually find a job that didn't suck and I could support a family with. Got tired of lousy offers for 15 bucks an hour for a 6 month temp job. Im glad things are working for you guys, but I just haven't had any luck.....

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SCfeedback in Orangeburg, South Carolina

29 months ago

I'm a BSMET graduate from SCSU with over 12 years experience. I must say years ago I was worried about the BSMET vs. BSME controversy. BSMET was my best option for scheduling plus company tuition assitance. I have yet to regret my choice for obtaining my BSMET (comparing strictly BSMET to BSME only-not considering pursuing graduate school). I have several friends with BSME degrees, and I can honestly say that I see no "upper hand" they have over me in both the engineering career field and general knowledge of technical and theoretical competency. I've worked in various areas/fields from machine design (from concept)and build, engineering design consulting with such companies as Westinghouse and Trane, to project management and mechanical design at Michelin Tire Corp. My BSMET curriculum consisted of several mandatory calculus math courses along with mandatory calculus based Physics I and II coupled with several machine tool courses and labs (unlike most ME programs), which I think has drastically helped with my machine design skills. From what I've experienced-hard work, dedication, good work ethics, and being a motivated professional in your field of interest will get you further than the BSMET vs. BSME degree in most career fields (with possible exceptions to aerospace and extreme R&D fields)as I have no desire to obtain my PE as it will not benefit. Currently, I have a senior level engineering position for a manufacturing company that I must say has treated me very well from a "pay" and job duty perspective (just as well as a ME).

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The Facts in Statesboro, Georgia

29 months ago

madmack692 in Erie, Pennsylvania said: I graduated with a BSMET (3.1 GPA) from Penn State. My dear old alma matter would not accept me into their masters program. I got conditional acceptance to one school, and it was online. Im sure if I apply to companies and they see my MET with a masters degree online, my resume will be at the bottom of the pile, in the garbage, or weeded out by a computer before anyone sees it. At any rate, in order to even apply for the masters, I had to take a years worth of ME classes. And guess what, none were offered in the evening. I still have yet to hear anyone say "yeah, I had a BSMET and I went to xxxxx for my MSME." And after trying to find a decent job for 3 years, I just gave up and figured I would go to school till I could actually find a job that didn't suck and I could support a family with. Got tired of lousy offers for 15 bucks an hour for a 6 month temp job. Im glad things are working for you guys, but I just haven't had any luck.....

I reviewed the curriculum at Penn State for you. While there did not appear to be any significant differences between the MET and ME degrees, Penn State faculty and administrators apparantly try to force a difference by having seperate programs. This is academia... Most have no real world experience. they only have a PhD, and they hang their hats on that alone. But they do not know how to actually design an engine, piping system, HVAC system, etc. They are only teaching you what they themselves have read about in other books. that being said, there were some small differences but nothing that would prohibit you from easily competing in a graduate level ME program. Nothing.

If all you find is the MSME on-line, go for it. Your diploma will say, Master of Science in Mechanical Engineering form So and So University, and your transcripts will say the same thing.

Aside for the MSME, I strongly suggest you consider getting an MBA. The MBA will open more doors for you.

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Njaneer in Lake Worth, Florida

28 months ago

Like it or not, there is a big discrimination going on in the job market if you do not have a BSME, many jobs in the market are stating a BSME is required, I even see some that say "Not Engineering Technology". From my experience whether or not you get considered is based on the hiring manager, they will either toss your resume in the trash or serious consider it.

It does not matter if you have a Engineering Technology degree and 10-15 years experience as an Engineer with the title to go with it. They won't even overlook your experience. You can meet 99% of the job requirements and still be trashed based on our degree.

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Harsh Times in Irving, Texas

24 months ago

If you live in a state that allows all ABET (BSME or BSMET) to sit for FE & PE and you earn the PE license then you will be on par with any engineer on the block. If you don't then you can expect that the engineers will design and manage and the technologist's will supervise. Potentially two very different career paths unless the PE is thrown into the mix. I have seen BSMET's manage BSME's in the construction environment but not in any other field.

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Jerry Wade Page in Lyons, Georgia

17 months ago

ZJ4LIFE in Riverside, California said: I think the fact that you are having a problem finding schools that transfer your credits toward a BSME should clue you in on the differences and how the industry must value a BSME vs BSMET. From what I researched, the main difference is ME you must understand principles to the point that you must be able to derive equations that govern a particular phenomenon VERSUS just being able to plug in numbers to already derived equations with basic conceptual knowledge (MET). It doesn't take a genius to plug in numbers and employers know this. They want people who really understand what it is thier doing. OF COURSE, there are a number of engineering jobs out there that are more hands-on/technical vs design /research that an MET grad would easily be able to handle. You would be limited on what you could do. Pay is not as great but its not bad either from what I've researched.

Best explaination would be that MEs are the designers/inventors and METs are the FOLLOW-BLUEPRINT-AND-BUILD. Keep in mind that employers know the difference.

I have a BSMET and have been out of college for over 20 years. I recently took a new job as a Senior Engineer and decided to take the EIT/FE with 6 coworkers that were recent BSCE and BSME graduates. Out of the 7 that took it, I am the only one that passed. I also passed the PE afterwards. 2 of my coworkers passed the EIT on their 2nd try. It depends on the individual as there were only two math classes different between a BSME and a BSMET which are Calculus 3 and Differential Equations. Get your nose out of the air as college is not everything and it mostly comes down to hard work and experience.

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John in West Chester, Ohio

17 months ago

More and more logic here. Don't you love the BSMEs who listen to their academic leaders who pound into their heads how much smarter they are as compared to BSMETs? It's such a joke that these guys actually think when they get out of school that they will be working in some think tank, where they will spend years coming up with the next set of equations. They take the job, then the reality hits that they will only have time to look up a beam deflection formula in the cover of their Beer and Johnston Mechanics of Materials book and that furthermore, nobody really cares.

Like you I graduated 20 years ago from Pitt with a BSMET. The degree never held me back, though I did have one boss who was a real douche and insisted I wasn't a qualified engineer. The most funny part was that I wasn't even working as an engineer and to further the stupidity, one of his BSMEs with a PE license tried to tell me the 2nd integration of the position-time plot represented the acceleration plot. Wow, really...how is it that a guy can get a PE license when he doesn't know these basic concepts? How's that BSME working for you?

The fact of the matter is that there are many people who have this bad attitude, yet when it comes time to design, create, implement, test, or even theorize, they are effectively useless in the work force. Perhaps the worst part is that after college, you come to realize that lip service and BS seems to get people further in life than any degree. I was married to a gal who had a dual degree from U South Carolina in business and economics. When I asked her what an L-M curve was, she didn't know. This never held her back at P&G where she now makes 3X what she's worth and got there off of BS and lip service.

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TBD

17 months ago

Mechanics is brute force and ignorance.

Mechanical engineering technology is finding the right balance of the two, for each situation.

Mechanical engineering is finding a set of equations to understand how they got it to work.

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