how many sticks can one phlebotomist do on one patient?

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Jenny in San Diego, California

71 months ago

No, one phlebotomist do 2 times, if he can not do it, they call somebody...the point is same person try twice,...you do not come back some other time, they will find other phlebotomist to try to do it. Imagine if people go and then come back?!?!?! And when come back? What if the doctor need lab results today to prescribe medication or continue with diagnostics...."O patient will come back...some time"

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Linda in San Diego, California

71 months ago

sandy waller in Cleveland, Ohio said: please reply with this answer a nurse poked me 6 times and i know there is a rule somewhere but i need it in writing anyone know where i can find it?

You are allowed to make two attempts before getting help, however, if the patient asks for someone else after the first attempt, and the phlebotomist/nurse makes another attempt anyway, he/she can be charged with assault and battery.

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PHLEB in Stockton, California

71 months ago

the policy everywhere that i know of is 2 phlebotomist 2 sticks per phleb if phlebs cant get it... it then goes to the nurse if nurses attempts fail it then goes to the dr. though there are different circumstances for different situations. though the line is as follows 2 phlebs 2 sticks an rn also 2 sticks 2 rns then dr if at anytime you dont feel comfortable you need to speak up only you are your own advicate. but trust me there are many situations where you are put on the spot whether its phleb,rn,dr,resp,where you dont have a situation you just pray

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nancy in High Point, North Carolina

71 months ago

sandy waller in Cleveland, Ohio said: please reply with this answer a nurse poked me 6 times and i know there is a rule somewhere but i need it in writing anyone know where i can find it?

only sticks per phlebotomist after two phlebotomist try not suppose to touch the patient for 24 hours that is the policy. now rn is different i dont know about them.
hope this will help

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sandy in Chicago, Illinois

71 months ago

sandy waller in Cleveland, Ohio said: please reply with this answer a nurse poked me 6 times and i know there is a rule somewhere but i need it in writing anyone know where i can find it?

Generally, nurses or doctors don't draw blood very well. If the phlebotomist sticks you twice and misses, Ask for the most experienced phlebotomist to come and get your blood. This advice is coming from someone who has been working in hospitals for 18 years, and has seen many cocky doctors and nurses leave huge bruises and hurt arms on patients that were not difficult sticks.

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Connie in Bolingbrook, Illinois

65 months ago

Depends on what you are calling a "stick". If you are meaning a "stick" as in drawing blood to obtain a sample of blood that is one thing. But in the case of someone sticking a needle through the skin to start an IV, it depends on if there is an Emergency. If there is an Emergency and there is the need to get a medication started. (Such as when my daughter had a status seizure and needed the medication to stop it) There truly is no limit. In my daughters case, thankfully they kept trying, she was stuck with a needle over 40 times in one arm alone (yes I actually counted while I was watching) and they had 4 people working on her at the same time, 1 on each arm and 1 on each leg. It took them almost 4 hours ( had even called the anesthesiologist on duty who was also trying) to get that IV started. Her veins are huge, except when she is sick, then they collapse and are very hard to find.

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julie.trevino@ymail.com in Escondido, California

65 months ago

Hello;
I recently finnished my intership...and had a very good Supervisor . The rule was to try TWICE, then call someone else. This rule applied to the EXPERIENCED PHLEBOTOMISTS . For me, I (whlie training) was to try only once---if not successful....CALL SOMEONE ELSE, thus a total of 2 times. Good luck.

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thecropchick in baltimore, Maryland

65 months ago

My understanding is one tech is allowed to try twice, then get a "pro"

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Kelly Anne in Rancho Cucamonga, California

63 months ago

The general rule is to try twice, but if they have your permission they can keep on trying.

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quest in West Covina, California

63 months ago

NO MORE THAN ONE TIME, BUT IF NECESSARY I WILL DO IT TWICE

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thecropchick in baltimore, Maryland

63 months ago

My understanding is 2 but my personal limit is 1

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maria in Worcester, Massachusetts

60 months ago

I have been working in a hospital for 30 yrs and the rule is; Try to draw blood two times, if you are not succesfull another phleb can try only once. If the second phleb was not succesfull the patient will be unabled for a day to the same hour. End of the story.

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shawna in Sanford, Florida

60 months ago

their is only two stick in a arm then get some else or you can try the other arm.

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Lori in Hollywood, Florida

59 months ago

the rule of phlebotomy is (2)twice then get some one else to try; with there permission only you can try again in the other arm or with a butterfly. if its a person with very bad veins.

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todd in Marianna, Florida

54 months ago

I realize this was started 17 months ago, but wanted to give some info in case this could help someone else.

Just wanted to point out that while many people have given great advice I do not believe we have answered what the poster was looking for. He seems to be looking for some sort of legal documentation for which there are none. As most of the above stated many many times training programs and laboratory policies often dictate that a phelb should only stick twice then ask for help from someone else. There is no Law regarding this issue. So a simple lawsuit you will not find. However if you feel a legal action is necessary you would need to take an action surrounding physical abuse. Pictures should have been taken and submitted to your lawyer. If the hospital is privately owned the lawyer will need to file for a seizure of hospital procedure policies. You will then have to pray that the person signed off that they have read and understood the form during their training. If they have not signed off (which in the medical world would not surprise me) you will then have a bigger problem on your hands directly attempting to prosecute a hospital. Unless they gave you DVT or a blood clot you wont have a great chance in court. If this was an emergency critical situation the 2 stick rule does loose its merit as Doctors need those results ASAP/STAT.

I also would like to mention you as a patient have rights. Please encourage anyone you know in a situation like this to be vocal in a polite manner, and ask for someone else. IV's and blood sticks are by no means a perfect science.

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Cathy Meadows DiSantis in Willoughby, Ohio

47 months ago

sandy waller in Cleveland, Ohio said: please reply with this answer a nurse poked me 6 times and i know there is a rule somewhere but i need it in writing anyone know where i can find it?

Hi Sandy! A nurse is suposed to only attempt an insurtion twice. It is not a law, but a general policy--meaning, most places where one may recieve such a service would have such a policy. Most, but not all. It is only a recomendation by JHACO.

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rlelam in Tucson, Arizona

45 months ago

sandy waller in Cleveland, Ohio said: please reply with this answer a nurse poked me 6 times and i know there is a rule somewhere but i need it in writing anyone know where i can find it?

i'm a philbotomist sandy,YOU have the right to choose who you want to stick you. if you have someone that does'nt know what they are doing,you can request someone else,IT'S YOUR RIGHT BY LAW. there's nothing aganst how many times you get stucked. that's up to you. you can stop it at any time. and report that person to their boss. unless you have bad veins,then you need to find someone that is good at their job.

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melinda in Tampa, Florida

43 months ago

the school i go to we need 50 sticks to get certified they want us to get stuck 4 time a day for the next 3 weeks what do you think? please advice..

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momsgirl in Winston Salem, North Carolina

43 months ago

Yes, i'm state certified of N.C. an been in phlebotomist for 7yrs1/2an yes you do need from 100 to 50 sticks, but not on yourself though. Now finger sticks you its not really a big issue however though you can ask Dr.'s or Nurses or other students to get in your finger sticks.

However if i understand what you are asking then the answer is no.
You need to go to Cap.org or ASCP.org an read up on Phlebotomy to get your true readings of Phlebotomy an also you can become state ceritified through ASCP.Org or ASPT.Org which Tech ll pays a little more.
When ever you not certian of something or unsure always go back an read your phlebotomy book or manual or go online.
hope this helps you out.

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melinda in Tampa, Florida

43 months ago

hi than u for your reply we have been sticking ourself almost everyday 4 and 5 times everyday i though that was not normal,,just because we didnt have enough people to stick i started feeling lots a pain and bruises on hand/arms i really needed a break so finally the instructor brought students in the class for us to stick AMEN TO THAT! WELL THANK YOU AND HAVE A GREAT DAY!

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pincushion in Stockton, California

43 months ago

can someone tell me if a person is placed on a 51/50 hold, do they have a right to refuse to give blood....there was a situation where a lady at the hospital in modesto ca was placed on a 51/50 hold for allegedly taking a lot of pills...she was taken to the er....she has baby rolling veins which means she is an extremely hard poke....she advised the nurses of this and was ignored...they used large needles and poked her 21 times...8 times the needle was jammed in her foot...they still was unable to get a line....she screamed for them to stop but they wouldnt...all this while she was shackled.... whats really crazy is that they found no medication in her system....was this legal...can someone advise please...

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ndnstar in Reno, Nevada

42 months ago

You're are allowed 2 attempts then you ask the patient if they would like to have someone else try, if they say no then you notify the Dr.and let them know the situation, however depending on the circumstance they may ask you to try again. I always go for back up.

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Tgore in Pensacola, Florida

39 months ago

How many patients per hr are ya'll allow to draw?
thanks
PS if anyone knows where there is a rule or regulations please let me know.
Thanks
Tommy

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Tgore in Pensacola, Florida

39 months ago

How many patients are ya'll allow to draw per hr/ If anyone knows of any rule or reg stating how many patient you can draw per hr/per shift please let me know.
thanks
TG

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PHLEBOTEK in Chicago, Illinois

38 months ago

The general rule of thumb is 2 sticks per phlebotomist.

Now if you are a good phlebotomist that can stick 99 out of 100 people apply with us today and we will have a job for you.

Please submit your resume at www.phlebotek.com. We are a nationwide staffing agency that strictly focuses on Phlebotomy.

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carolyn in Lancaster, Pennsylvania

38 months ago

My question is how many sticks are Phlebotomists expected to get in an hour is there a rule? I was shocked when my supervisor called me in and said I never made any mistakes and my patient care was great but that I need to get at least 6 or 7 sticks an hour. Now I rush trying to get a better evaluation within the next 4 weeks. The patients comment on how gentle and how they hardly felt the needle. I am striving to so mord an hour. Has anyone heard of piece work when it comes to sticks in the work place please let me know. Thank You! carolyn

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liz in Chandler, Arizona

38 months ago

Carolyn, I don't know if there is a rule but my supervisor told me 6-8 sticks an hour but also where I work we see over 200 patients a day.

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carolyn in Lancaster, Pennsylvania

38 months ago

Thank You!
I was concerned because my Supervisor told me at my new phlebotomist job that I had only did 28 sticks in an 8 hour period I was taken back because our early morning collections start at 3AM till 7AM Even though the shift is 11PM to 7AM I am only working within a 4 hour window. That would give me the 7 an hour requirement Thank You Carolyn

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HCOG in Naples, Florida in Cape Coral, Florida

37 months ago

In this country the Rule of Two as it is commonly known is followed by most trained and certified Phlebotomists. This Rule needs to part of the Standard of Care for your facility and must be a policy in your Phlebotomy Manual. It is equally important to train all staff in policies and procedures and to employ corrective action when rules are not followed.

Newly trained Phlebotomists need to try once and then turn the draw over to a Lead or Seniou Phlebotomist.

The reason behind this rule is for both: Patient Satisfaction and Patient Safety.

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carolyn in Lancaster, Pennsylvania

37 months ago

Hello
Could you be more clear on the answer to the question, are you saying that the standard of care is equally important if not more and amount of sticks only second? There are great phlebotomists but more concern is put on how fast rather then the quality of care even though the stick are done in the time alloted. Thank You!

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HCOG in Fort Myers, Florida

37 months ago

Good Evening Carolyn,

What I was trying to say is that the Phlebotomy Rules and the written Phlebotomy Policies should correlate with the facilities (Hospital, Clinic, Outpatient Center) Standard of Patient Care. The classic number of sticks may vary from site to site, but the old standard was five minutes per stick barring exceptional situations.

hcog

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Ann in Victorville, California

35 months ago

sandy waller in Cleveland, Ohio said: please reply with this answer a nurse poked me 6 times and i know there is a rule somewhere but i need it in writing anyone know where i can find it?

@ Jessica; That's correct the attempt for blood draw should only be twice. After the two attempts, someone else has to draw blood from the patient such as a supervisor or co-worker (in a medical facility). But with Mobile/Insurance Examiners you can definetly come back another day to do the blood draw again, after the two failed attempts.

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betty in Topeka, Kansas

33 months ago

Linda in San Diego, California said: You are allowed to make two attempts before getting help, however, if the patient asks for someone else after the first attempt, and the phlebotomist/nurse makes another attempt anyway, he/she can be charged with assault and battery.

even if they got it the second time around...... I dont understand that....

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betty in Topeka, Kansas

33 months ago

I try twice most of the time I get it on the first time but when I cant I try a second time and always get it the second time imagine if everyone just did it once then there would be alot of recollects I at least make sure its ok with the patient before doing so if they say yes then its alright but if they refuse it then dont do it but atleast try dont be afraid to do what you have to do to get the job done because you could end up with alot of unhappy doctors and staff who are depending on you to do your job and get it done without help

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HCOG in North Fort Myers, Florida

33 months ago

It seems that most agree on the rule of two. I was very happy to see that some set a personal limit of one stick. Phlebotomists should never be criticized for wanting to turn a blood draw over to another phlebotomist. They may have a very good reason for doing this. New phlebotomists are frequently limited to one try.

hcog

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Jackie in Harvest, Alabama

30 months ago

sandy in Chicago, Illinois said: Generally, nurses or doctors don't draw blood very well. If the phlebotomist sticks you twice and misses, Ask for the most experienced phlebotomist to come and get your blood. This advice is coming from someone who has been working in hospitals for 18 years, and has seen many cocky doctors and nurses leave huge bruises and hurt arms on patients that were not difficult sticks.

I am a phlebotomist, sandy is right, i had a doctor stick a patient over and over for a matter of 15 mins. over three times,and still didnt get it, then wanted to get the patients foot, i signaled the patients to stop him and the husband finally did. it was awfull,i quit that job. 2 times is enough,get someone else , ask for a technologist or lab director to stick for the last time, unless its life death situation.

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Super. ,Trainer. in Sacramento, California

29 months ago

carolyn in Lancaster, Pennsylvania said: Hello
Could you be more clear on the answer to the question, are you saying that the standard of care is equally important if not more and amount of sticks only second? There are great phlebotomists but more concern is put on how fast rather then the quality of care even though the stick are done in the time alloted. Thank You!

A GOOD phlebotomist will draw a patient every five minutes. If someone is taking ten minutes to obtain blood specimens,They are not all that good!!! Therefore one stick in FIVE minutes is what supervisors are looking for!! One stick,good technique,obtains proper levels every five minutes=A phlebotomist with a full time permanent position!!!

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jeremy in Saint Cloud, Florida

29 months ago

sandy waller in Cleveland, Ohio said: please reply with this answer a nurse poked me 6 times and i know there is a rule somewhere but i need it in writing anyone know where i can find it?

You can only stick (Do venipunture 2 times) you try one arm.....if you don't hit the vein, you can adjust needle/move poistion of needle up to 3 times. If your not getting blood floe, then you need patients permission to try the other arm. You do not want to adjust and move needle more than 3 times, as this can cause haemotoma.
These are the rule I follow, as I draw blood from donors for a major bloodbank.

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dawne766 in New York, New York

27 months ago

What if its the doctor? I just watched a resident stick my dad about 30 ti
es trying to get blood.

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DavidK in Tuscaloosa, Alabama

26 months ago

Our 13 months old DD was at the ER in Tuscaloosa last night with fever. The nurses there sticked her 5 times before they agreed to our request for a Phlebotomist. For each stick they moved the needle very many times. Baby cried tilll her voice was gone and my wife teared up. They said they don't have a phlebotomist at the time. The last nurse used a large needle and dung very deep in the little arm several times. We decided thats enough. She still dung it in deep again before pulling it out. That's when they brought in the phlebotomist who draw the blood from the wrist without any struggle. They were very rough when checking her renal temperature as well. We had to cancel the visit and go back home. We just managed the fever at home and went to the babies doctor in the morning. Will never got to DCH Tuscaloosa unless on a stretcher. We're still in shock.

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scp-106 in Tulsa, Oklahoma

20 months ago

DavidK in Tuscaloosa, Alabama said: Our 13 months old DD was at the ER in Tuscaloosa last night with fever. The nurses there sticked her 5 times before they agreed to our request for a Phlebotomist. For each stick they moved the needle very many times. Baby cried tilll her voice was gone and my wife teared up.

It's your fault you allowed them to stick her five times. You can kindly ask the physician on duty if the procedure is necessary and likely get it canceled. I know it was a long time ago, but I felt you needed to know this anyway...

You don't need to take an infant to the ER for a fever. When you take your sick child to the ER, you are asking for them to be poked with a needle. They were not doing it to be mean, but if they feel they can get it done with just a little more pain, they will try. Don't forget the doctors are breathing down their necks to get those IVs and blood draws started.

I am a medical laboratory scientist and I work nights at a small hospital. I work alone (14 hrs) and as such I have to do about 20-30 draws a night from our ER and then about 15 draws in the morning between 4 and 5 am. I get so sick of parents bringing healthy kids to my ER, or kids with a runny nose or something silly, not realizing our doctors are going to order blood work. If you don't want your kids treated, then don't bring them in. Don't waste my time, and your baby won't have to get poked with a needle. Treat that fever at home, or wait until the morning and there is more staff available. I am 25 years old and I've been doing this for a few years. When I was young, we didn't go to the EMERGENCY room unless it was an EMERGENCY.

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DavidK in Tuscaloosa, Alabama

20 months ago

scp-106 in Tulsa, Oklahoma said: It's your fault you allowed them to stick her five times. You can kindly ask the physician on duty if the procedure is necessary and likely get it canceled. I know it was a long time ago, but I felt you needed to know this anyway...
.

You sound like you are in the wrong profession and I suggest you look for a job in another area. If seeing patients makes you sick then you'll die of stress very soon. You have no idea how high and how long the fever lasted yet you are quick to make conclusions. We have a good doctor who kept in touch with us every 3 hours when our kid was sick and he requested that we take her to ER. Are you suggesting that you know better? Perhaps you should keep your ideas in the laboratory instead of assuming duties of a job that you never trained for. The last time I checked it's lab techs who draw blood and not medical laboratory scientist! I hope you stick your patients correctly though.

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scp-106 in Tulsa, Oklahoma

20 months ago

That's exactly what I'm suggesting.

You seem a little confused. Lab tech is a misnomer for medical laboratory technologist. It's a term that people not involved in allied health use to refer to "anyone in the laboratory." I assure you that MLTs and MLSs are true experts behind phlebotomy. When a trained phlebotomist can't get they blood, they call US. We are all trained phlebotomists with years of experience (or we should be, it was required for me and those I know) except that in addition to phlebotomy we also run the blood tests. We see exactly whats going on inside your child, your mother, etc better than any physician does. Physicians in the modern day only know what we tell them, and nothing more. Don't get me wrong, the older generation of physicians are very wise, and a few of the modern ones are too, they didn't rely on tons of unnecessary testing just to say "yep, it's a fever." We are finding that most physicians now are unreliable. I enjoy seeing patients and many of them have come to know me and request my services, I just don't like having my time wasted on petty nonsense when there are legitimately sick people needing help. Every parent thinks their child is the sickest one.

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