It is time for change

What an interesting thread. As a practicing and licensed PTA in Georgia, a state with very liberal laws regarding PTA's, I think this conversation is rather intriguing. I do agree that the PTA profession should advance to a bachelor's level program. I'll be honest though...I think it would probably be for vanity sake. I think the PTA profession as a whole has a general lack of respect in the professional community. My personal opinion is that it has more to do with individual experiences than an actual problem with the profession. As a two year program based at mostly community colleges, the program attracts those that are not planning on a career as much as they are planning on a paycheck. This allows people into the profession that have no business in healthcare. They get a license. They fulfill all continuing ed requirements online. They are not interested in professional enrichment or specialization...and give us that choose to do the opposite a bad name. I'm not trying to sound almighty...just honest. If the program were bachelor's level, a certain element would be added to prove that the program is more than "just a community college program"...and a ceetain element would be eliminated that put a bad name on our profession. I find this struggle of skepticism every time I have to prove myself again to a new PT. I don't care about added rights and responsibilities because I live in a state that allows me freedom to practice and work at a facility that trusts my judgement and experience (I'm one of the spine guys, completed McKenzie A,B,C). I don't care about pay, because to be honest, it's already decent and on par with new grad DPT's, much to their chagrin. It all comes down to respsect. Not for me...but for the new PTA's that are trying to establish a name for themselves. The ones that work hard but are caught in the shadows of the sloppy ones that came before them.

Joe in Cumberland, Maryland said: Judith I'm not a PT.

"As a PTA we have to learn in our program just as much as PT's in a 2 year frame and order to relate to PT's and the patient or resident."

So you claim that the PTA program is equivalent to a DPT program? You really think you learn "just as much" as a PT within your really one year of clinical education that you'd learn in a 3 year DPT program?

"Just think about it PT's went from bachelor's to DPT in how many years. PTA's should at least be at a bachelor degree by now."

So the rationale for increasing the educational requirements of the PTA degree would be based upon the fact that PT has increased its entry-level requirements to the DPT level?

"Sometimes other profession or professionals don't even know the knowledge,training and experience we process."

So public perception is a problem. Do you think that a BS degree is really going to help this perceived issue? FYI Physician Assistants possess a Masters degree, but the public many times compares them to Medical Assistants. Is it really the degree or is it the title that's bothering people?

FYI Physician Assistants a few still award an undergraduate bachelor's or associate's degree.

We are now down to only one transitional PTA to PT program.

"In 2008, 142 education programs for physician assistants were accredited or provisionally accredited by the Accreditation Review Commission on Education for the Physician Assistant. Eighty percent, or 113, of these programs offered the option of a master's degree, 21 of them offered a bachelor's degree, 3 awarded associate degrees, and 5 awarded a certificate."

www.bls.gov/oco/ocos081.htm

eighty percent of programs are at the masters level.

Joe in Cumberland, Maryland said: "In 2008, 142 education programs for physician assistants were accredited or provisionally accredited by the Accreditation Review Commission on Education for the Physician Assistant. Eighty percent, or 113, of these programs offered the option of a master's degree, 21 of them offered a bachelor's degree, 3 awarded associate degrees, and 5 awarded a certificate."

www.bls.gov/oco/ocos081.htm

eighty percent of programs are at the masters level.

That is what I just said... isn't it?

Eighty percent of PA programs award master's degrees so the overwhelming majority have higher than an associates level, and they still get compared to medical assistants. That's the entire point. You can have Masters of PTA as well and the public would still ask you "so when are you going to finish your education and become a PT."

I am blessed that I was able to work full time, care for my children and attend a PTA Program. However now 10 years later with my children in college, I would love the opportunity to bridge from PTA to PT. It is frustrating that there is a limited number of programs with little hope of APTA nurturing any new ones. I am at place in my life where I would like to advance my career since I topped out as a PTA. I have limited choices, start over in a PT program and spend a large amount of money with no credit for what I have learned or Change professions,and school for Doctor of Osteopathy, Chiropractor, or Physician Assistant. This will require starting over as if I enrolled in a PT program.The money I spend for a PA degree, or DO can be eligible for loan forgiveness. When I have meet with some of these colleges, I was meet with opened with open arms and encouraged to work forward in my health care career. I was even told I would get credit for some of my PTA course work. I believe that there is a need for more bridging programs for PTAS to PTs.

Instead of bridging, why not seek to advance the PTA profession to the level of respect of that of a PA?

"Instead of bridging, why not seek to advance the PTA profession to the level of respect of that of a PA?"

from a prePT prospective, if the PTA degree was deemed equivalent to the PT degree it would make the decision whether or not to pursue PT school a whole lot easier. Massive debt, years in school, responsibility, paperwork, politics, decreased patient interaction, etc for an extra 20k per year. No thanks. I as well as many other would opt out for the PTA route because it would just not be worth it.

Hello! 12 years experience here. I am glad to see I am not the only PTA with complaints regarding the APTA. My thoughts on things:
1.) We do need bridge programs which account for clinical experience.
2.) PTs vs. PTAs - there are good and bad in both areas - just like everything else in life.
3.) I have yet to see any real difference between a Master's Level PT and a DPT (I have worked with several of both.)
4.) My colleagues treat me with respect as I do them. I know and can do things they can't do just like they know and can do things I can't do.
5.) Degree nor experience does a great practitioner make. Great practitioners are born from a true desire to serve others as collaboratively as possible.
6.) Egocentrism and Narcissism exist in every field - look at MDs.

As for me, I am getting my teaching license - time for a change. Keep up the good fight with the APTA, just don't be surprised if we lose.

I really don't think the PTA degree should be quilvalent to a PT degree. The entry level PT has great evaluative skills and poor treatment skills. The entry level PTA has great treatment skills and poor evaluative skills. Both of those things build over time. I think the curriculum in each should be suited for the entry level responsibilities. I also believe that PT's should be required to take pharmacology and radiology (as most programs do) and eventually hold the privelege of writing orders for diagnostic imaging. I also believe that they should be able to write orders for DME (walkers, canes, bedside commodes)and for custom orthotics and orthoses. This would still allow a delineation between PT's and PTA's, as PTA's would focus on advancing their research skills (PTA would be a BS) and have new ability to interpret data and create treatment plans and carry them out under a PT, but with more leeway to alter a Plan of Care if needed.
As for the differences between PT's and PTA's...the responsibilities, paperwork, politics, and patient interaction are pretty much the same. In some places the pay is very very close, if not skewed in the other direction with PTA's on top (with experience of course). I've met facility directors that are PTA's. It just depends on what your aspirations are.

By the way, in a previous comment, I stated: why not bring the level of respect of the PTA to that of a PA......I was speaking of physician assistant and their ancillary role with an MD. They have a level of respect in the consumer world and in the professional world that the PTA hasn't achieved yet. Maybe we should ask why?

I have been interested in the PTA profession for a couple of years but have been unable to actively pursue education or possibly of a non-experience job opportunity. I am now unemployed through choice and searching for my next 10 years of employment in a job that I love to do. In monitoring the local job boards, the seem to be a lot of PTA openings. Is anyone in the Colorado Springs, CO area monitoring this forum? I would love to get feedback on the local PTA situation: what are the actual opportunities to find a job; what is required as far as education/work experience; what schools may be the best in
Colorado Springs. Thanks for the comments! Very informative.

Sammi,
I don't know the job market in Colorado Springs, but I can help you with the education aspect. Pueblo Community College, Arapahoe Community College in Littleton, PIMA Medical Institute in Denver and Morgan Community College in Fort Morgan are your only in-state options with accredited programs for physical therapist assistants. Pueblo, your closest option, has a great reputation with a high graduation rate but is pretty competitive to get into.
Good luck,
Shakes

Practicing physical therapists will be "grandfathered" and granted use of DPT as the clinical designator.

Just for an idea, how many PTAs do you think would make application to a new PTA to PT bridging program if located on the east coast in a rural community? What would you feel would be a reasonable tuition? How would you want your class schedule? All day Friday and Saturday every other weekend? or Friday, Saturday and Sunday every third weekend? Would you want the college to provide transportation from the nearby airport at a fee, or rent a car?( no taxi cab service available) Please respond, Thankyou Note your answers will be printed off and presented.

DavidT in Berwyn, Illinois said: Ahem BROTHER! If there were some bridging programs that allowed my work experience and classes taken to be accepted as credits then i would most definitely make the transition to PT

HI I need information in bridging i am foreign trained in il ,i need help , thank's

Shannon in Bloomington, Indiana said: Hello! 12 years experience here. I am glad to see I am not the only PTA with complaints regarding the APTA. My thoughts on things:
1.) We do need bridge programs which account for clinical experience.
2.) PTs vs. PTAs - there are good and bad in both areas - just like everything else in life.
3.) I have yet to see any real difference between a Master's Level PT and a DPT (I have worked with several of both.)
4.) My colleagues treat me with respect as I do them. I know and can do things they can't do just like they know and can do things I can't do.
5.) Degree nor experience does a great practitioner make. Great practitioners are born from a true desire to serve others as collaboratively as possible.
6.) Egocentrism and Narcissism exist in every field - look at MDs.

As for me, I am getting my teaching license - time for a change. Keep up the good fight with the APTA, just don't be surprised if we lose.

I am looking for an Indiana or Illinois student who is serious about passing the board exam in the next 3 months. HELP!!!! Iam!~

HI,

at present i am in mi i am from il i want to know about bridge course and i am, moving in il , i am from il, if any job i can ,get here in mi i am doing home health as pta , i need your help to fight with apta for bridge cousre, i appreciate your help in this, we should unite together for bridge course , i came worked with temporary permit ,my bad luck i didn't renew my board license, my eval done only geriatric deficit in aug 29 99 ,my bad luck did eval again and more defecit , if you know clinic or anything i am ready to work as pt teck i don'tmind in indiana a na chicago , i prefer to live in il , i don't like mi , thank's reply me plz

Wow...i thought i was the only one that is so frustrated with this profession!...I have been a LPTA for 10 years and now feel mature enough and ready to be a PT...but there is one problem...they make it pretty much impossible!...I have been hearing about the shortage of P.T's...well hello...you have a line of great PTA's with the knowledge, experience and heart to transition up! It just doesn't make any sense to me and it is such a no brainer!..ya know?

To Joe in Cumberland. Yes PTAs have it pretty good right now. I am a NY state Licensed PTA working full time in the profession at a job I love and I get paid well. I needed to become a DPT to perform evaluations at my job and was lucky enough to find a weekend DPT program. Turns out I already took most of the same classes as a PTA student that I'm taking now in DPT school so I'm not struggling through them as my fellow DPT students are. In addition, the practicals, Procedures and Modalities are actually EASIER in DPT school than they were in PTA school. This explains my first affiliation in PTA school at an outpatient clinic. There were also DPT students performing their 3rd clinical and they had no idea how to use the equipment, what it was for or any of the science behind it. They had no clinical skills and made stupid and dangerous mistakes (lying a 200+ pound patient directly on a hotpack for example) I was so much more knowledgeable as a PTA student on my first affiliation than DPT students on their 3rd that the PTs working there started requesting me to work with. The DPT students didn't even know basic anatomy or therex, one of them asked me how they could strengthen their anconeus!!
I think the main gripe of PTAs is the lack of professional acknowledgment. When I joined the APTA I had to fax them my diploma before they would accept my money for membership. This is not a one time thing. When it came time to renew, I had to fax it again! As if suddenly I wouldn't have graduated from an accredited institution! PTs do not have to jump through such ridiculous hoops to prove they are members of the profession. Yes, I love my job and yes, I am paid well but aside from evaluations, I do everything the PTs at work do. In fact, I do more! My caseload is almost twice that of the PTs and for most of my patients, I am the only person who sees them. I go to the same conferences, I get the same specialized certifications, and I get the same results.

Even after reading more negative views than good on the subject I'm still looking to pursue a career as a pta(who knows from there) because i really love this work. I am currently a licensed massage therapist and pending personal training certification working with accident victims. However this isn't enough, my desire is to work in a hospital environment under a good pt. If anyone could tell me about a good school to attend in the tampa, fl area it would be awesome.

hi, i have a question pta can do dpt , what about pt reuire to pass license exam in ny, reply me thank's

Hi, in MI all Robtech canadian college pta on line 6 month courses they , are working all over in mi,playing with pt life ,and alll home health company hire them,all pt and pta should fight for the right,it is totally injustice going on in mi state

Do you have an email address where you can be contacted concerning the Canadian rules for PT/PTA?

yes ummakv@yahoo.com

i need your email and phone number so that we can discuss more about canadian robtech pta 6month online

I've been a PTA for 15 years. The main complaint that I have with the APTA and PT schools is that they are all going to a Doctoral degree when there aren't enough PT's to go around in the first place and now that the Babyboomers are here, the profession is going to have a tougher time getting enough therapist in the field. If they made PT a masters degree and allow those who want to continue on to do so, then the PT schools should offer both not just one.

Anyone want to give me a jobby job? I already filled out an appy.
Bartle-doo!

I am curious as to why you all stay in the profession if most of you dislike it so much? I am considering becoming a PTA and would like to hear the great things about the profession ONLY. I have heard so much negative that it is making me wonder....yes I know that every job has it's downfalls, but is the PTA profession ALL bad??? Please help to put a positive light on the profession...PLEASE!!!

Jai in Plano, Texas said: I am curious as to why you all stay in the profession if most of you dislike it so much? I am considering becoming a PTA and would like to hear the great things about the profession ONLY. I have heard so much negative that it is making me wonder....yes I know that every job has it's downfalls, but is the PTA profession ALL bad??? Please help to put a positive light on the profession...PLEASE!!!

It's a great feeling when you see someone progress having some major issues via accident or surgery... and leave independent and able to go back to their normal life. The issue is the politics with what PTA's do and how we are perceived within the profession.

Aphex in Falls Church, Virginia said: An excellent point! LOL

i am a pta in al. i totally agree with your comment that pta's are under appreciated. i have been a therapist for 8 yrs and i know as a Ph.T.

Aphex in Falls Church, Virginia said: An excellent point! LOL

i am a pta in al. i totally agree with your comment that pta's are under appreciated. i have been a therapist for 8 yrs and i know as a Ph.T.

I don't see all the problems with our profession that everyone else sees. I do agree that we should have more options for bridging. I have never been disrespected by a PT and I make more money than many of the PT's in my area. I love what I do. For those of you interested, go for it. If we had more bridge programs, the demand for PTAs would go down. Many single parents and working students do not have time to earn a DPT degree. We should continue to support our profession.

Aphex in Falls Church, Virginia said: An excellent point! LOL

First off, Kay Vyas IS using English spelling in words such as: "generalised" & "specialising". The use of an "s" is used where American English will use a "z". As for the rest of her spelling "errors", this is a forum where we are "talking" our text (like texting) and the spelling rules are relaxed. Please,let this forum exchange remain what it is, an environment for greivances and problem-solving/brainstorming in the realm of PTA education and title improvement. This forum is sustaining an important issue, I believe. Let's keep the petty criticisms outside, shall we?.

Aphex in Falls Church, Virginia said: An excellent point! LOL

First off, Kay Vyas IS using English spelling in words such as: "generalised" & "specialising". The use of an "s" is used where American English will use a "z". As for the rest of her spelling "errors", this is a forum where we are "talking" our text (like texting) and the spelling rules are relaxed. Please,let this forum exchange remain what it is, an environment for greivances and problem-solving/brainstorming in the realm of PTA education and title improvement. This forum is sustaining an important issue, I believe. Let's keep the petty criticisms outside, shall we?.

Hello I am grateful to have found this site while researching for a paper. I am currently a massage therapist who always wanted to be a PT but had no desire to work 9-5 full time. I am hoping to do PTA part time and continue in massage part time, but that is still in the air. I am curious how all of your backs are doing? Do the tech assist wit a lot of the lifting or is it mostly you? I love to work hard and take care of myself, but I also know long term jobs with lifting a lot of people does a number on your back.. Thoughts?

Why not apply to a DPT program? You knew before getting into PTA that their where limited advancement opportunities. Do you really think you should get paid as much as a DPT? GO BACK TO SCHOOL and quit bitching. For a 2 year degree you're making a decent salary.

future PTA student in Sacramento, California said: Why not apply to a DPT program? You knew before getting into PTA that their where limited advancement opportunities. Do you really think you should get paid as much as a DPT? GO BACK TO SCHOOL and quit bitching. For a 2 year degree you're making a decent salary.

hi what school are you going to? Im from sacramento too, well I have to take my perequiste Classes first, and then apply to a pta program. Are classes pretty hard? Do you need to be really good in math? Thanks

Jessica Xicay in Sacramento, California said: hi what school are you going to? Im from sacramento too, well I have to take my perequiste Classes first, and then apply to a pta program. Are classes pretty hard? Do you need to be really good in math? Thanks

There is very minimal math. You need algebra to get into chemistry, to get in to anatomy. after that it's very minimal. It's all very doable, especially after all the prereq classes. Good luck.

The future of the PTA profession gets worse and worse. The 2020 initiative that I keep hearing about seems to get rid of the PTA profession or at the very least relegate it to an aide type role. The APTA party line of it being a career change from PTA to PT and the two are seperate professions is about as much nonsense as I can take. I have never seen the big difference between the two jobs that the APTA will have us believe. I have been a PTA for 14 years and have worked for good PTs and bad PTs. That is just a biproduct of working with people in general. And yes there is an educational difference between the PT and PTA, hence that is why we need more than one bridge program. This difference is what the bridge is supposed to take care. And as far as the suggestion goes, well just go to DPT school. The answer to that is I have two kids, a wife, and a mortgage. Quiting work and going back to school full time is just out of the question.
The APTA is not supporting the PTA profession. It wants to eliminate it. The APTA is the problem. They do not respect the PTA profession enough to help further it. It is easier to let it die out on its own. Eventually Medicare will follow suit with some of the current insurance companies, that let pts only be treated by PTs, and when they do what will the APTA do, NOTHING. They will let this happen, widening the gap between PT and PTA even further. So what do we do now, just wait for the inevitble. Where do we go? What do we do? I don't know. Any light at the end of the tunnel?????

The future of the PTA profession gets worse and worse. The 2020 initiative that I keep hearing about seems to get rid of the PTA profession or at the very least relegate it to an aide type role. The APTA party line of it being a career change from PTA to PT and the two are seperate professions is about as much nonsense as I can take. I have never seen the big difference between the two jobs that the APTA will have us believe. I have been a PTA for 14 years and have worked for good PTs and bad PTs. That is just a biproduct of working with people in general. And yes there is an educational difference between the PT and PTA, hence that is why we need more than one bridge program. This difference is what the bridge is supposed to take care. And as far as the suggestion goes, well just go to DPT school. The answer to that is I have two kids, a wife, and a mortgage. Quiting work and going back to school full time is just out of the question.
The APTA is not supporting the PTA profession. It wants to eliminate it. The APTA is the problem. They do not respect the PTA profession enough to help further it. It is easier to let it die out on its own. Eventually Medicare will follow suit with some of the current insurance companies, that let pts only be treated by PTs, and when they do what will the APTA do, NOTHING. They will let this happen, widening the gap between PT and PTA even further. So what do we do now, just wait for the inevitble. Where do we go? What do we do? I don't know. Any light at the end of the tunnel?????

i have been commenting on this since pps happened but nobody wanted to comment maybe we should lobby i am in

YEP JUST MAKE THE PTS MORE POWERFUL BUT WHAT WILL HAPPEN TO PTAS WILL PTS JUST LIKE PHYSICAL MEDICINE MDS HIRE PERSONAL TRAINERS AND TECHS TO ASSIST THEM I HOPE APTA WILL NOT ALLOW THAT SELFISH MOVE AND GUARD PTA PROFESSION AS WELL I AM AT END OF MY CAREER BUT WORRY ABOUT THE EXCITED KIDS WHO WANT TO BE PTAS AND SPEND A LOT OF MONEY FOR SCHOOL NOT EVERYBODY CAN AFFORD TO BE IN SCHOOL FOR 6 YEARS