Advantages of PA vs Physician

Hey Brianna,

I am one of those "Some people" who would rather see a PA or NP than a doctor. I spent 9 weeks sleeping in my mother's hospital room when she was suffering from pancreatic cancer. The nurses were exceptional, we had one PA who was okay, one who was exceptional, one doctor in residency who cared, one good oncologist, and the rest of the doctors were just going through the motions as quickly as possible to get to the next patient. My father (who is an engineer with absolutely NO medical experience whatsoever) had to serve as the solution-giver because the doctors who saw her would not bother spending the extra ten minutes of thought or effort really THINKING.
This was at the Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania, supposedly one of the best.

A few of the nurses she had made such a HUGE impact on us. Thinking about the comfort and care they gave us made me want to try to do that for somebody else. I have no background in medicine (I work in finance), so I have been volunteering on the oncology floor of our community hospital for nearly two years now. The general feeling/impression I get is that those who are in their residency or a few years out really try/think/care. After that, it becomes routine. Much of what motivates many of the doctors I see seems to be the idea of being the doctor, and feeling like the authority on medicine. While we have no lack of crappy nurses at the community hospital, much of what motivated the nurses at Penn seemed to be the desire to really help people who are sick. The NPs and PAs that we have dealt with were truly something. They spent the five minutes to truly connect with the patient, explain the condition, listen to questions, and offer insightful responses.

Brianna in Virginia Beach, Virginia said: Lucas...once again...Now you have compared "non-physicians"

Omar, you basically find the time to respond to every single question/comment on this site with a helpful, encouraging, and thoughtful answer. While a large part of this is probably your inherent grace and desire to share knowledge with people, your enduring enthusiasm for your craft must be a big part of it. You are very generous with your time and your knowledge. It's nice to see that in people, so thanks!

Omar

Hi Meeps! Hey, is your name Omar also. It looks like you signed your comment "Omar". Anyway, thanks for thanks. Yes, I do enjoy being a PA. I have to say that it takes a good deal of humility. I have seen medical doctors receive accolades for accomplishments and not make mention of the PAs with whom they worked. That kind of stuff can't bother you if you're a PA. Personally, I just like being part of a health care team. It's like being on a football team and the QB gets all the fame and TV time w/out any credit being given to the blockers and linemen. I gotta tell folks, I just am really enjoying life right now. My children particpated in the Dr.Martin Luther King, Jr. Memorial oratory competition. They made me so incredible PROUD (my 7 year old took 3rd place)! Being a Dad and husband is waaaaaay more important to me than any professional accolade I could attain. Being a PA has allowed me to take care of my family. My wife gets to stay home and be with our children which in today's economy, is a very rare phenomenon.

I got a little type-happy with the enter button. I didn't mean to sign my name Omar! I'm a female, so that would be quite amusing.

Congratulations on your 7 year old's accomplishment!

Signed: Meeps

To those who are already PA's: I've been in the finance industry for the past 6.5 years, graduated from UNC-Chapel Hill in Business, and just decided to pursue the PA route. I make great money where I'm currently employed, and likely getting a promotion in the next 6 months. However, the work is not as fulfilling anymore. I loved the days of helping small and medium size business owners strategize on how to grow, whether to finance it or use cash, how to improve cash flow, etc. I have developed amazing contacts, including doctors who own private medical practices. I've seen doctors who made it, and those who lost everything....literally, everything (family left them, used up all their cash, and then health went south). Every day that I'm given to live is too important to be away from the people who sacrifice everything for me (i.e. my family). Many other reasons lead me to wanting to become a PA.

With that said, though, I have no medical background (when I was a kid, I wanted to be a doctor b/c all of my parents' friends were doctors and I had great exposure to the field). Since my husband and I would like to start having a family in three years (given his older age), I really need to get accepted into PA school for this upcoming Oct 1st deadline at GWU (my only option given where I live, owning a home, and having my husband support both of us while I go to school, if I get in).

So, as you can see, I have little time from now until then to finish my courses (which I can do), take the GRE, and get direct patient care experience. I'm not a fan for doing the min., but with time, that's what it may end up being. I am willing to sacrifice and leave my job to make it happen. But I am needing some advice as to whether I even have a chance with GWU. I'm taking Medical Terminology class b/c I thought it would benefit me in the long-run, and help me get direct patient care right away (medical scribe?!). Any advice as to the best way to approach this given time

finance to PA in Annandale, Virginia said: So, as you can see, I have little time from now until then to finish my courses (which I can do), take the GRE, and get direct patient care experience. I'm not a fan for doing the min., but with time, that's what it may end up being. I am willing to sacrifice and leave my job to make it happen. But I am needing some advice as to whether I even have a chance with GWU. I'm taking Medical Terminology class b/c I thought it would benefit me in the long-run, and help me get direct patient care right away (medical scribe?!). Any advice as to the best way to approach this given time

If this is something you really want to do, then you have got to committ. I'm younger, without a spouse or kids, but I worked my butt off to get into pa school. It took me two years after my undergrad.

1st, what is your school want for patient contact? 2000 hours? you can't do it in the time frame given, but if its 500, or even 750? Doable, as long as you figure out a job real soon, like CNA work, FULL TIME. Not fun, but it shows committment.

2nd, GRE. Know strengths, be real with your weaknesses. I had to get a tutor two times a week for the math portion, and I just took tests over and over everyday the month prior.

3rd. Shadowing. Did you just go once, or a couple times? Couple different people or specialties?

4th Letters of rec. Get one from a practing PA.

5th Talk to the school, ask them what they look for in their candidates, what details a strong applicant? What was the profile of last years class?

6th. Make your statement real. Don't overlook this, it's just as important.

7th and MOST IMPORTANT. Vist GWU. Talk to the current PA students there. Is this really what you want? Can your spouse support you emotionally through it. If you can dedicate yourself fully to this then of course, you can do it. But not everyone realizes the effort it takes.

finance to PA in Annandale, Virginia said: So, as you can see, I have little time from now until then to finish my courses (which I can do), take the GRE, and get direct patient care experience. I'm not a fan for doing the min., but with time, that's what it may end up being. I am willing to sacrifice and leave my job to make it happen. But I am needing some advice as to whether I even have a chance with GWU. I'm taking Medical Terminology class b/c I thought it would benefit me in the long-run, and help me get direct patient care right away (medical scribe?!). Any advice as to the best way to approach this given time

I just started school, and it takes every minute of my day. The reason: this is the majority of the medical school crammed into two+ years. You can do it, but it really is a committment on your part. If you're okay with it, don't hesitate anymore, and just start tomorrow morning.

Thanks Meeps!

Hi finance in PA! I totally respect your veiws and emphasis on family. Family always comes first with me. I think you have good reasons for wanting to pursue a career as a PA. You can shadow me if you want. I am in Washington, DC. I would also encourage you to apply to Howard University's PA program (BS in PA), even though it's not a Master's level program like GWU's. Also University of Md. Eastern shore has a new Master's level PA program. BTW, Howard is close to GWU about 1.5 miles away (or five Metro stops). Anyway, I have served on the admissions committee for both schools, so I hope I can give you some good tips on how to get in. I hope this information was helpful.

I offer a free webinar, "The 5 Mistakes You Must Never Make When Applying to PA School" This webinar is very informative and covers all of the information necessary to be a competitive PA school applicant. To sign up, please visit www.andrewrodican.com/?page_id=13

Good luck!

Hi finance in PA 202! Please 549 give 7136 a call. My clinic is in Washington, DC. I really want to help you!

Peace,
Omar

Hi Cathy! This is REALLY great advice you've given finance to PA.

Omar

Omar Abdul-Malik, MPAS, PA in Washington, District of Columbia said: Hi Cathy! This is REALLY great advice you've given finance to PA.

Omar

Thank you Omar.

Ineedaname in Rotherham, United Kingdom said: Omar,
As someone who is looking to do this in the UK (where it is so new barely anyone knows of it), how would you describe the role a PA does, or what they are?QUOTE]
Ineedaname,
I'm answering you since it looks like no one else caught your question. Keep in mind I'm still in PA school, and legislation in The States allows greater autonomy than in the UK right now. Therefore, I'm not educated as YOU are, about what a UK PA can do. However, when my friends and family asked me "What's a PA?" I say I go through similar training that of a physician, but the program is designed for my profession to graduate earlier to get to the workforce. The PA is taught as a generalist, goes through licensure exams, and finally, works under the supervision of a doctor. Outside of state legislation that limits certain duties to doctors only, what I can do is determined between myself and my supervising physician, regarding my experience level and strengths." So that's a long explanation, but if you have a patient that asks you, "So what is a PA?" Be patient and give them a concise, thorough answer.

Hi Omar,
I am new to this forum but I am glad that I found it. I noiticed you said you have served on the admission board for PA programs. I am just wondering what exactly do they want to hear. I have been interviewed 3 times already with 2 rejections and 1 wait-list. But even after that they ended up not accepting me. I do not want to give up because I really want to do this. Can you give me some pointers on interview questions and answers.. Im just ready to get in I know I can succeed in the program I just cant seem to get past the interview.... Help Plz!!! THANK YOU!

Cathy in Albuquerque, New Mexico said: If this is something you really want to do, then you have got to committ. I'm younger, without a spouse or kids, but I worked my butt off to get into pa school. It took me two years after my undergrad.

1st, what is your school want for patient contact? 2000 hours? you can't do it in the time frame given, but if its 500, or even 750? Doable, as long as you figure out a job real soon, like CNA work, FULL TIME. Not fun, but it shows committment.

2nd, GRE. Know strengths, be real with your weaknesses. I had to get a tutor two times a week for the math portion, and I just took tests over and over everyday the month prior.

3rd. Shadowing. Did you just go once, or a couple times? Couple different people or specialties?

4th Letters of rec. Get one from a practing PA.

5th Talk to the school, ask them what they look for in their candidates, what details a strong applicant? What was the profile of last years class?

6th. Make your statement real. Don't overlook this, it's just as important.

7th and MOST IMPORTANT. Vist GWU. Talk to the current PA students there. Is this really what you want? Can your spouse support you emotionally through it. If you can dedicate yourself fully to this then of course, you can do it. But not everyone realizes the effort it takes.

Cathy,
Thank you so much for taking the time to not only outline the priorities needed to be prepared, but also being so motivational! Really, I appreciate all of your help. My husband and I have been having serious conversations about how soon I can leave my job...given my position, my employer requires 30 days notice instead of the standard two weeks. So, as it looks now, I'm preparing to give my resignation February 1st. GW requires a minimum of 960 hours or 6 months. Starting March 1st, I need to have something full time (hopefully a blend of paid and volunteer hours).

I'll use March-May to focus on GRE preparation (going to take a class w/one-on-one) and finish up my Medical Terminology class, then starting May begin Chem and A&P prereq courses, so that by August, I can start taking the final class needed to satisfy prereqs for GW's PA school. I will submit my application no later than the end of August, so the committee gets it in time for cutoff of Oct 1st. Pardon my thinking out loud, but Cathy, you got me on a roll! Thank you!!!

Omar, thank you so much for your willingness to help me! I would be honored to shadow you and be able to spend some time to figuratively pick your brain. I will call you tomorrow after 5pm, as I think you mentioned in another posting as a preferable time.

Again, I can't thank you enough for dedicating your already hectic schedule to people like me, who have a direction and purpose, just need some insights and tips to get there! Thank you!

Awwww (blushing) you're quite welcome finance to PA. Helping people like yourself is my passion. I've already met some INCRDEIBLE people from this blog. Two came to my office this past week. I plan to help them get into Howard's program. Man, I gotta tell ya, getting into PA school has become waaaay more competative than when I applied in the late 97. It was fairly competative THEN. Hoever, it's going to become moreso as the economy worsens, Americans get older (the "greying of America"), the MD and RN shortage continues, and the PA profession gets more publicity.
BTW, I think Cathy in Alberque has been giving you some GREAT advice. You should do as well as possible on the GREs. I mean blow them out of the WATER, if you can! GWU is one of the MOST competative PA programs in the country. They have a near 100% PANCE board passage rate. You'll be competing (i.e. for acceptance) against prospective students who are well -established in academia and other health fields. Believe me, I know.I served on GWU's addmissions committee a couple of times. You can get in, but you've got to SHINE! YOU CAN DO IT!!! The better prepared you are, the more confident you will be. My advice to you (and others) is to also read about the history of PAs (e.g. Dr.Eugene Stead, Army corps men, etc.), know something about current issues in the PA field, know the difference between a PA vs NP. Also, be prepared to answer why do you want to be a PA, SPECIFICALLY; vs an MD, PT, OT, DO, RN, etc. You'd be surprised at how many prospective students can't answer this. Also, you should be able to answer why you want to go to GWU as oppossed to an alternate PA program. We'll talk more when we meet. I know this seems like alot, but getting into PA school is no joke. However, I can tell you after 10 years of being a PA, it's an absolutely AWSOME profession! I feel very proud, humbled, and honored to be a part of it.

I need help can anyone help me with the post I submitted one day ago to Omar.. I know he is very busy!

H! chloe 1118! Sorry; must've missed you. I've been pretty busy for the past several days. What can I help you with?

chloe1118 in Woodstock, Georgia said: Hi Omar,
I am new to this forum but I am glad that I found it. I noiticed you said you have served on the admission board for PA programs. I am just wondering what exactly do they want to hear. I have been interviewed 3 times already with 2 rejections and 1 wait-list. But even after that they ended up not accepting me. I do not want to give up because I really want to do this. Can you give me some pointers on interview questions and answers.. Im just ready to get in I know I can succeed in the program I just cant seem to get past the interview.... Help Plz!!! THANK YOU!

Oops; sorry chloe. I just sent you an email saying I didn't see this. I don't know why you didn't get in. I need to get a better picture of you (as an applicant). FOr example, what are your grades like, extra currics., volunteer hours, health care experience, etc.? I think I can help you. 202 please 549 feel 7136 free to contact me.

That is ok I know you are busy and I appreciate to taking the time to help.
I graduated with a BS in Biology in 2007. I have been working in the the hospital ever since, I see patients, but it is not direct patient care, more like clerical work dealing with insurances,getting tests authorized by reading through their charts and clinical,lab reults, etc.. I have been shadowing PAs and they all think I would be great. My GPA in undergrad was around a 3.3, I know not as competitive as I would like but the past is history. I have grown and matured and know that I would not have a problem once I get into the program. I got invited for the interview so I assume they seen something that they were interested in..maybe its the actual interview, I don't know?

Hi chloe118! It appears as if you would make a fine candidate. The administrative experience you've garnered through your job is what many clinicians are lacking. The other day the MD and I were bemoaning the multitude of administrative duties we have in in conjunction with trying to see as many patients as we can in our clinic. Much of this work stemms from the accountability issues resulting from increasingly litigous society in general. I think someone w/ your baclkground would be a great boon to te PA profesion.

Thank You, It's nice to hear that! I guess it is the interviewing part...I dont know what they are looking for or what they want to hear.

I currently work as a research technician at the Albert Einstein college of Medicine in the Bronx. I've followed this thread for quite a while and I'm hoping to get into PA school following this upcoming CASPA cycle.

The two things that I feel are my greatest weaknesses as a PA applicant are the following:

1) although I am engaged in clinical (translational) research, I don't feel that it is providing the type of experience that is considered "direct pt. contact." I am also certified as an EMT-B in New York state but took a job as a research tech shortly after I was certified because I was desperate for work/benefits out of Undergrad (where I studied Chemistry). I hoped that working in a clinical capacity could help me in some way when it comes time to apply.

2) I need shadowing/PA interaction!! I work at a medical school that is part of Montefiore MC/Weiler and I still can't seem to find/establish a relationship with a practicing PA that will allow me to shadow.

I was wondering if anyone who reads/contributes to this thread can help me either strengthen my chances for this next CASPA cycle or HOPEFULLY point me in the right direction to initiate a PA shadowing opportunity in the NYC area. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!!

Thanks!!

Integrity First in Katy, Texas said: A few more points....
In the corporate world, a MD on your Board, carries weight and penache. A PA doesn't.

In global markets, a PA does not translate to a significant carreer.

It is very frustrating to have been trained at a top medical school, yet have your salary capped, limited, and no good outlet for advancement. There are RNs that are CEOs of hospitals and hold top level administrative positions. I don't know of any PAs in similar positions....usually because the PA generates a different level of revenue. They don't want to loose their higher revenue generators to office positions...just as you don't tend to see MDs in those positions. Still, that is a two sided back-handed complement....which gets old 20 years out.

I love medicine. I miss clinical medicine. But in my 50's, I don't want to work like a machine. I want to value and enjoy my patients. Not easily possible in managed care. So...I now use my medical knowledge in industry.

There are a lot of emotionally rewarding careers in medicine. However, if your reason is money, or to own your own business....you might want to look around more. Just make sure you ask people with many years of experience, preferably over 10 yrs.

Still....a very admirable profession.

Good luck.

Hello,

I trained as a P.A. and received my degree from UTMB in 1994. I worked for a solo practitioner just over 11 years. I took some time off to raise my girls and am now looking to go back to the workforce; however, I'm not sure in what capacity. My previous employer is requesting I return to the practice but like you I don't want to see patients like "a machine" I am currently researching other opportunities available to me with my degree and experience. You said you are working in technology what exactly are you doing? Do you have any other suggestions of other fields to look into?

Thank you for your time

Omar Abdul-Malik, MPAS, PA in Washington, District of Columbia said: Hi Meeps! Hey, is your name Omar also. It looks like you signed your comment "Omar". Anyway, thanks for thanks. Yes, I do enjoy being a PA. I have to say that it takes a good deal of humility. I have seen medical doctors receive accolades for accomplishments and not make mention of the PAs with whom they worked. That kind of stuff can't bother you if you're a PA. Personally, I just like being part of a health care team. It's like being on a football team and the QB gets all the fame and TV time w/out any credit being given to the blockers and linemen. I gotta tell folks, I just am really enjoying life right now. My children particpated in the Dr.Martin Luther King, Jr. Memorial oratory competition. They made me so incredible PROUD (my 7 year old took 3rd place)! Being a Dad and husband is waaaaaay more important to me than any professional accolade I could attain. Being a PA has allowed me to take care of my family. My wife gets to stay home and be with our children which in today's economy, is a very rare phenomenon.

Omar,

No more earnest comments are stronger than those you posted conveying your love for the profession. You’re right anyone that wants to be/is a physician assistant (PA) has to have a measure of humility. Your analogy is also a good one, as a sports enthusiast you never hear about the frontline or the defensive line too often, but they are very instrumental in the success of the overall team; as well as to the stars we hear and read about.

Being a PA can be very rewarding personally, professionally, and financially, however, it is not without hard work and some stresses. Serving my patients and working with other colleagues who share your passion for quality healthcare is blissful, inspiring, and uplifting which drives me to serve those in need of care.

Thanks Better HealthI I really appreciate your comments ! :)

Im a PA with 13 yrs experience. I make roughly 173,000 a year. I work with a team of pa's and there are currently 2 pa's who work with me that make over 200,000yr. My son finished medical school at the university of washington and has been in private practice for 6 years, he makes 113,000yr..

nasir in Lynnwood, Washington said: Im a PA with 13 yrs experience. I make roughly 173,000 a year. I work with a team of pa's and there are currently 2 pa's who work with me that make over 200,000yr. My son finished medical school at the university of washington and has been in private practice for 6 years, he makes 113,000yr..

I have a few questions if you dont mind. I've met maybe 3PAs all with salaries around 100k. I was under the impression PAs had a salary cap closer to 120k. I'm quite impressed to hear other wise. What's your speciality? Are you nuero, surgery? I was told that salary is dertermined by that. Im quite curious to know what your day to day out look is?I would think since you're making 70-80k above average you probably never leave the hospital? High stress higher reward? I worked in the mortgage industry for about a yr after undergrad, during that time i took an emt class and saved a life during my clinics quit my job the same week and went back to school to complete Pre-reqs for the pa program. Left a lot of money on the table to follow what I believe is my vocation and have been happy ever since. Reading this makes me feel like i made tge rifht choice spiritually and financially lol let me know

Peace and greetings to you Nasir. This is amazing! What is your specialty?Mine is ID. I also usedmy Doctorate in Health Education w/ my medical knowledge in PA to create my own business. I've done pretty well (Praise God!). Anyway, I think you and your PA colleagues have set a good example of what PAs' financial potential can be in today's market if you're creative and motivated.

Mike Lowrey in Brookfield, Illinois said: I have a few questions if you dont mind. I've met maybe 3PAs all with salaries around 100k. I was under the impression PAs had a salary cap closer to 120k. I'm quite impressed to hear other wise. What's your speciality? Are you nuero, surgery? I was told that salary is dertermined by that. Im quite curious to know what your day to day out look is?I would think since you're making 70-80k above average you probably never leave the hospital? High stress higher reward? I worked in the mortgage industry for about a yr after undergrad, during that time i took an emt class and saved a life during my clinics quit my job the same week and went back to school to complete Pre-reqs for the pa program. Left a lot of money on the table to follow what I believe is my vocation and have been happy ever since. Reading this makes me feel like i made tge rifht choice spiritually and financially lol let me know

Mike Lowrey,

Salaries can run a wide range basis on a PA’s experience, skill set, employment setting, etc. Some PAs earnings can reach upwards of up to $400k/yr depending on several streams of earnings. Some PAs in addition to practicing medicine, may teach, and/or others consult as a means of increasing their yearly earnings.

There are some PAs who no longer practice medicine but remain close with the healthcare industry as pharmaceutical Reps to managers and/or executives within healthcare companies such as CVS and others.

Therefore, it will be difficult to give you a real number as to your potential earnings. That is something that will be determine by you!

Good luck with your future.

M
DHSc, PA-C

Is there anyone that is familiar with St Johns PA program, and be willing to share their knowledge?

Josh in Saint Marys, Pennsylvania said: Hi everyone,

I am second year PA student enrolled in a 5 year physician assistant program. I have debated many times between becoming a PA or DO/MD. If I continued and graduated as PA how difficult would it be to go to medical school. In my program students do not take a single physics course or a math course besides statistics and to my understanding they are required for acceptance into medical school.

I am a PA and have been working as a PA for 12 years.
I cannot believe that your school does not required math, even pre-calculus,,,which school are you going to. Are you giving out correct information????

LD in Bronx, New York said: I currently work as a research technician at the Albert Einstein college of Medicine in the Bronx. I've followed this thread for years and I'm to get into PA school in the near future. I was wondering if anyone who reads this thread can help me initiate a PA shadowing opportunity in the NYC area. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

contact me at NOONDONGJA@AOL.COM. I am a PA, 12 years exp,,,

lilaznsurfer in Los Angeles, California said: OMG I am so glad to have run across your blurb. I am deciding whether to get my masters in medical medicine (it will lead me to the PA) or to get my doctorate's.

1. I am not very good with authority. I like to run by my own schedule and I don't like to have people question me.
2. People do not respect PAs as much as they do doctors.

So that said, I am 25 and need to make a decision soon. Yale's PA program is only 2 1/2 years whereas med school is another 4. I need to make money now *(don't get me wrong because I love the medicial field and dealing with patients) but I've taken all this time to get my bachelor's and then travel the world and now I am broke and need to start my career. Do you really suggest being an MD if time is ticking and I have a family to take care of. I mean, it seems like we have the same dilemma. PA vs. MD. Which is going to be more beneficial and more convenient for me in the long run? Where will I get more satisfaction?

you should just get into business school, I think it will be best decision for you.

Actually you're wrong, there's a reason why it's an AVERAGE. $800k a year is completely possible for a physician, maybe rare, but possible... my close relative is a GI doctor and makes about $600K a year between his procedures and his partnership in the practice he practices at...

PA in New York, New York said: you should just get into business school, I think it will be best decision for you.

I second, PA in New York’s comments! If the comments expressed by lilaznsurfer in Los Angeles are a true reflection of his/her and anyone else’s, then it is very likely PA is not the profession for you.

With regards to earning potential for all those that are curious, there has been plenty of good information posted as to potential earnings; many have been caveated to ensure no one goes off believing they will jump right out there making scores of money.

As one colleague posted there are many variables that will impact one’s salary.

Speaking for myself, I have a very good quality of life as a result of my earnings. I have 10+ yrs. of experience practicing medicine; in addition to everything else I am teach Intro to Biology at a local community college. What I am trying to convey is ---- “your” earning potential is only limited by oneself.

M
DHSc, PA-C

Hi Omar or anyone else willing to help me.

I am a high school junior looking to create my list of colleges to apply to. I have decided that a PA is what I really want to be. I am wondering how important the college I attend for undergrad is in for admission to PA school. Is it better to attend a prestigious school or one where I would be more likely to be near the top academically? I have grades & scores that might get me into some of the top schools, but would a school more around 50 on the usnwr list be just as competetive for admission? I'm just afraid that the competition at schools such as Berkeley in the prerequistes might cause me to have a lower gpa than a less competitive school. Which looks better - Berkeley with b's or a less prestigous school with A's?

As far as a major, would nursing be a good or bad choice for undergrad? I was thinking that If I'm not accepted into a PA program straight from undergrad, I would probably be able to make more money, have better patient care opportunities while I try and apply to schools the next year than if I was a biology major. What about using a major such as public health, which might be easier than those, and just make sure I take all the required prerequisites?

Since most PA programs require a lot of patient care hours, what would be the very best way to gain these hours while I am getting my undergrad? Volunteer - medical assistant ??? I think I am going to try and base my college choice around those schools that have either a medical school or hospitals near by - good idea?

Thanks for your help!

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FuturePa,

There is no 'best' way to become a PA, or anything for that matter. In my PA class, my classmates are between the ages of 22-45. Many had prior careers, myself included. Many went to community college, myself included. Everyone had a different healthcare experience, from scribe, to laser technology, massage therapy, phlebotomy, etc. Some had kids, others had significant others back home. Most of my class isn’t even from the state.
It’s incredible to me that you’ve already targeted a career; you drive and eagerness, and I’m happy for you.
I had a supervisor at a pharmaceutical internship highly impressed with my drive for healthcare and opportunity, and he said so to me. I will also pass on the advice that he gave to me, which is not everyone gets on a train and takes the straight path in life. Some people take different roads, and it makes them better people, and providers for it. In other words, SLOW DOWN!
The reality is that I’m not sure you will take this advice, so I’ll give you something else. Don’t worry about getting into PA school now. IDENTIFY what you WANT to do to get there.
Do you like nursing? Because if you spend four years in school using it as a backup and you hate nursing, you will be miserable if you have to work as one because you were rejected the first year you applied to PA school. Do you want to go to a prestigious school? Do you want to become an EMT? Do you want…etc. The theme here is what do you want, and that’s hard question to ask someone at any age. Not just when they are 16 or 17.
Do you best to simplify your wants, like ‘I want good grades so I want to go to a school that will support me in that goal’. Perhaps to you that means an awesome tutoring center, approachable faculty, flexible schedules, etc. Or, ‘I want to have lots of patient contact’. Careers that fit that are CNA, EMT, Scribes, ER techs, etc.

futurePA in Carlsbad, California said: Hi Omar or anyone else willing to help me.

I am a high school junior looking to create my list of colleges to apply to. I have decided that a PA is what I really want to be. I am wondering how important the college I attend for undergrad is in for admission to PA school. Is it better to attend a prestigious school or one where I would be more likely to be near the top academically? I have grades & scores that might get me into some of the top schools, but would a school more around 50 on the usnwr list be just as competetive for admission? I'm just afraid that the competition at schools such as Berkeley in the prerequistes might cause me to have a lower gpa than a less competitive school. Which looks better - Berkeley with b's or a less prestigous school with A's?

As far as a major, would nursing be a good or bad choice for undergrad? I was thinking that If I'm not accepted into a PA program straight from undergrad, I would probably be able to make more money, have better patient care opportunities while I try and apply to schools the next year than if I was a biology major. What about using a major such as public health, which might be easier than those, and just make sure I take all the required prerequisites?

Since most PA programs require a lot of patient care hours, what would be the very best way to gain these hours while I am getting my undergrad? Volunteer - medical assistant ??? I think I am going to try and base my college choice around those schools that have either a medical school or hospitals near by - good idea?

Thanks for your help!

I wish you good luck in your endeavors, FuturePA. Wait for Omar's reply, and don't worry.

FuturePA,

As responded to you earlier, “there is no best way to become a PA”. The journey you will take will be influenced by many different things. What I recommend you concentrate on is selecting the best college/university for you. For example private verses public, big v. small, and ranking of the schools program you wish to pursue verses a non-recognized program just to have a degree. And let’s not forget the elephant in the room which is COST. If you do those things, work hard, and serve your community, I don’t see you having a problem competing against other applicants when it’s time to enroll into a PA program.

I commend you on doing well in high school, but you have to know that a secondary learning environment is totally different from an institution of higher learning. I have seen firsthand, kids who graduated within the top 5 percent of their high school and score impressively on the SAT/ACT, yet get to college and struggle academically. So finding the best school for you and your learning style will be critical. A lot of times the best school is not the one you hear about, like a Berkley, Brown, or Harvard. There are several tier-2 colleges/universities with nationally recognized academic programs. You just have to do the homework and figure out with your parents what’s the best fit for you.

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Your question about nursing as a major is a little confusing. Typically you don’t see people earn a BSN and then pursue PA. Nurses generally follow the path to NP/DNP which has a lot of similarities and skills to PA, but are not PAs, just like PAs are not MDs although given the experience of the PA many perform some of the same procedures and skills as an MD with a wide range of flexibility. But I do understand your logic in your question. You are looking for a safety net in the event you’re not selected into a PA program. I was a biology major, but I also earned my EMT-I certification via a Technical College as well, and worked as an EMT for a local urban hospital & fire department while I applied to various PA programs that I wanted to attend. And trust me I received a lot of experience in direct patient care.

In short, it is great you are looking ahead, but I think you may be looking too far ahead. Finish high school and then get into college. Too often people get into college and change their minds about what they want to pursue. But if you get there and still feel like PA is the path you want to take, I suggest you start preparing to follow that PA journey at the end of your second semester of your sophomore year in college.

Good Luck and keep doing well it will pay off!

M
DHSc, PA-C
Emergency Medicine (EM)

To the above people whom are asking how PA's are making more than 150k a year, is because they are most definitely surgical PA's whom are grouped and do there own billing. I was offered a job by a PA whom has such a company in orthopedics/Neuro (spine not cranial). He was making a killing and working maybe 4x a month. Of course his business had fees which you had to pay no matter what,however depending on how the surgeon coded and the insurance, a PA can easily make $500-$1200 a case. You do 3 a these a day and have a busy surgeon, you can make a ALOTT of money. However, the team must be supremely skilled and you are not going to get that unless you do a residency or you have military training and the OR is just natural to you. Most PA's are in clinic, a brand new entry level, PA will start (in Seattle)@ $70k. And you will be busting you butt off trying not to get fired, if you have loans and a family, the debt can really mess with you. Most of my fellow classmates are in huge debt- so I admonition, people unless you really have a passion to help ALL people, do not become a PA. All these stories are from the "glory years of PA" 13 years this that, let me tell you something, it was way easier to get in PA school then, and most of my teachers are grandfathered into the proffession. Also quit asking people how to get in school-I never even thought about becoming a PA, I just got a degree worked at a hospital and wanted more responsibility because I enjoyed helping people-I applied for med school didn't get in but got into PA school instead- after my interview, they told me I was the most genuine interviewee, nothing scripted, just happy to be there to share my experinces, if it's your passion and being a PA is all that you can see yourself being, the dots WILL connect!
Good luck to you!

PA-want-to-be asks what the school pre reqs are and what the current level of school entry as well as job competition are? I'm 48 and have owned my own photography business the past 26 years. While I love it, I can continue working occasionally with Top 10 clients and do my art as time allows while pursuing school and later during PA work time. I always knew I would be a doctor (my dad had his own clinic where I spent hours weekly) but my photo-future was laid so wonderfully I went for it. Now I like having weeks where I don't work 40 plus hours (though still average this) and no longer need to be the boss so PA sounds like it's perfect. While talented at math and science in high school, I needed little of either getting my BFA. I'm concerned how I might test after such a long education hiatus.

1. DOES EARNING COMMUNITY COLLEGE PRE-REGS MAKE ME LESS COMPETITIVE WHEN ENTERING A UNIVERSITY NURSING THEN PA PROGRAM?
2. What are the pre-regs for someone long out of school (who's only college-level science credits are from high school AP classes and college photographic science)?
3. How competitive are PA programs (I'd most likely become a 4 year RN then 2 year PA)?
4. How competitive are PA jobs? (I'd be willing to work in any medical environment on any shift but would be firm about staying in the Seattle area- an ideal place for me and my family.)
So happy to have found this on-line discussion. Thank you for your help!!!

pA in Middletown, New Jersey said: You may be thinking of a practitioner. A physician assistant is much like a doctor. They go through the same extensive schooling and internships as a doctor although they go for one less year of schooling and do not have a residency.

Even though u do most of the work,U people still are working under a supervision of a doctor. U have to accept the fact that u are never ever equal to a doctor.

If u feel so inferior about urselves,then why dont you go to medical school.
You must have done it? Isnt it? But you didnt..There comes the difference..

If all PAs consider them as doctors,then there is no point for all the doctors to go to med school.
Bcoz Doctors,have done something more than you people,doctors definitely are much more superior than you.

Now stop comparing urselves with Doctors.

I sincerely hope that I can get an answer from someone here without also offending anyone. Allow me to first say that I highly respect PA's as caring, capable, and professional individuals.
I am currently a 27-year-old,, MA-holding pre-med student at CU Boulder, but am finding that I may not be cut out for the pursuit of this dream of mine. I realize that, generally speaking, I am not "old", but I can't help but feel at a disadvantage when wandering the teenager-strewn campus. I did not emerge from graduate school with a stellar GPA by any means (3.3 undergrad GPA, but with no science courses under my belt) and feel that I really must get all A's in order to make myself presentable to any medical school acceptance committee. Even if my GPA were perfect, the classes in which I am currently enrolled, as unchallenging as they are (I hope that doesn't sound pretentious; I am only trying to be honest), something technical or stupid (on my part) seems to happen practically every week (e.g. completely forgetting about a fairly significant homework assignment after three 12-hour shifts at the hospital) and in every class (e.g. completely failing, along with 80% of the class, my intro to chemistry exam) that detracts from the grade I hope to receive in the class! I do very stupid things despite my insanity-inducing drive to do well. There are many other things that come into play (i.e. personality, leadership skills, age, GPA, etc), but I feel I will bore anyone who reads this.
That being said (and this is where the potentially offensive part comes in), should I, still doing my best to succeed, should I begin to re-examine this dream to become a doctor? I'm truly exhausted, which, in turns causes me to wonder whether the demands of being an M.D. wouldn't overwhelm me as well. I'm just...dazed, confused, and just a little down in the dumps.